Mahamudra meditation problem: locating the mind

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conebeckham
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Re: Mahamudra meditation problem: locating the mind

Postby conebeckham » Thu Apr 17, 2014 5:25 pm



"Absolute Truth is not an object of analytical discourse or great discriminating wisdom,
It is realized through the blessing grace of the Guru and fortunate Karmic potential.
Like this, mistaken ideas of discriminating wisdom are clarified."
- (Kyabje Bokar Rinpoche, from his summary of "The Ocean of Definitive Meaning")

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conebeckham
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Re: Mahamudra meditation problem: locating the mind

Postby conebeckham » Thu Apr 17, 2014 6:24 pm

Again, from 3rd Karmapa's Mahamudra Prayer:

"It can not be shown by saying "This is it."
It can not be refuted by saying "This is not it."
the true nature of phenomena is beyond concept, unconditioned.
May we definitely know the perfect, ultimate truth."

And a few shlokas later:

"Both appearance is mind, and emptiness is mind.
Both realization is mind and confusion is mind.
Both birth is mind and cessation is mind.
May all doubts about mind be resolved."


"Absolute Truth is not an object of analytical discourse or great discriminating wisdom,
It is realized through the blessing grace of the Guru and fortunate Karmic potential.
Like this, mistaken ideas of discriminating wisdom are clarified."
- (Kyabje Bokar Rinpoche, from his summary of "The Ocean of Definitive Meaning")

Andrew108
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Re: Mahamudra meditation problem: locating the mind

Postby Andrew108 » Thu Apr 17, 2014 6:27 pm

The Blessed One said:

"What is the All? Simply the eye & forms, ear & sounds, nose & aromas, tongue & flavors, body & tactile sensations, intellect & ideas. This, monks, is called the All. Anyone who would say, 'Repudiating this All, I will describe another,' if questioned on what exactly might be the grounds for his statement, would be unable to explain, and furthermore, would be put to grief. Why? Because it lies beyond range." Sabba Sutta.

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conebeckham
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Re: Mahamudra meditation problem: locating the mind

Postby conebeckham » Thu Apr 17, 2014 6:38 pm

There is no intellectual explanation that can satisfactorily answer the question, Andrew108. Would that there were. Karmapa's prayer is, to me, the most succinct and practical instruction I can think of at the moment.

I will say that, in my personal experience, there is no intellectual explanation that can satisfactorily answer the question, "what does it mean to be free from extremes?" There is merely mind, in a state of being free from extremes. So much ink has been used, over the centuries, to attempt to describe this--words like "bliss/Emptiness," Coemergent Awareness/Emptiness," Self-Arisen Wisdom," "Ordinary Mind," "Presence," "Bare Awareness," "Clear Light Luminosity," etc.

None of those is satisfactory. Sorry.


"Absolute Truth is not an object of analytical discourse or great discriminating wisdom,
It is realized through the blessing grace of the Guru and fortunate Karmic potential.
Like this, mistaken ideas of discriminating wisdom are clarified."
- (Kyabje Bokar Rinpoche, from his summary of "The Ocean of Definitive Meaning")

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Grigoris
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Re: Mahamudra meditation problem: locating the mind

Postby Grigoris » Thu Apr 17, 2014 7:08 pm

"My religion is not deceiving myself."
Jetsun Milarepa 1052-1135 CE

"Butchers, prostitutes, those guilty of the five most heinous crimes, outcasts, the underprivileged: all are utterly the substance of existence and nothing other than total bliss."
The Supreme Source - The Kunjed Gyalpo
The Fundamental Tantra of Dzogchen Semde

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Re: Mahamudra meditation problem: locating the mind

Postby Andrew108 » Thu Apr 17, 2014 7:21 pm

The Blessed One said:

"What is the All? Simply the eye & forms, ear & sounds, nose & aromas, tongue & flavors, body & tactile sensations, intellect & ideas. This, monks, is called the All. Anyone who would say, 'Repudiating this All, I will describe another,' if questioned on what exactly might be the grounds for his statement, would be unable to explain, and furthermore, would be put to grief. Why? Because it lies beyond range." Sabba Sutta.

Andrew108
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Re: Mahamudra meditation problem: locating the mind

Postby Andrew108 » Thu Apr 17, 2014 7:23 pm

The Blessed One said:

"What is the All? Simply the eye & forms, ear & sounds, nose & aromas, tongue & flavors, body & tactile sensations, intellect & ideas. This, monks, is called the All. Anyone who would say, 'Repudiating this All, I will describe another,' if questioned on what exactly might be the grounds for his statement, would be unable to explain, and furthermore, would be put to grief. Why? Because it lies beyond range." Sabba Sutta.

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Re: Mahamudra meditation problem: locating the mind

Postby Grigoris » Thu Apr 17, 2014 8:11 pm

And the essence of mind is???
"My religion is not deceiving myself."
Jetsun Milarepa 1052-1135 CE

"Butchers, prostitutes, those guilty of the five most heinous crimes, outcasts, the underprivileged: all are utterly the substance of existence and nothing other than total bliss."
The Supreme Source - The Kunjed Gyalpo
The Fundamental Tantra of Dzogchen Semde

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smcj
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Re: Mahamudra meditation problem: locating the mind

Postby smcj » Thu Apr 17, 2014 8:37 pm

Don't take me too seriously.

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Grigoris
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Re: Mahamudra meditation problem: locating the mind

Postby Grigoris » Thu Apr 17, 2014 9:03 pm

"My religion is not deceiving myself."
Jetsun Milarepa 1052-1135 CE

"Butchers, prostitutes, those guilty of the five most heinous crimes, outcasts, the underprivileged: all are utterly the substance of existence and nothing other than total bliss."
The Supreme Source - The Kunjed Gyalpo
The Fundamental Tantra of Dzogchen Semde

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Kaccāni
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Re: Mahamudra meditation problem: locating the mind

Postby Kaccāni » Thu Apr 17, 2014 9:16 pm

Shush! I'm doing nose-picking practice!

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Re: Mahamudra meditation problem: locating the mind

Postby krodha » Thu Apr 17, 2014 10:20 pm


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Malcolm
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Re: Mahamudra meditation problem: locating the mind

Postby Malcolm » Thu Apr 17, 2014 10:34 pm





འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


Free of hope and fear, relax.
Human life spent in
a state of great spaciousness is enjoyable.


— Kunzang Dechen Lingpa

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conebeckham
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Re: Mahamudra meditation problem: locating the mind

Postby conebeckham » Thu Apr 17, 2014 11:38 pm



"Absolute Truth is not an object of analytical discourse or great discriminating wisdom,
It is realized through the blessing grace of the Guru and fortunate Karmic potential.
Like this, mistaken ideas of discriminating wisdom are clarified."
- (Kyabje Bokar Rinpoche, from his summary of "The Ocean of Definitive Meaning")

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Wayfarer
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Re: Mahamudra meditation problem: locating the mind

Postby Wayfarer » Thu Apr 17, 2014 11:53 pm

In the beginner's mind there are many possibilities; in the expert's mind there are few ~ Suzuki-roshi

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Kaccāni
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Re: Mahamudra meditation problem: locating the mind

Postby Kaccāni » Thu Apr 17, 2014 11:57 pm

@conebeckham: As if anything unceasing there was. Do you believe?
Shush! I'm doing nose-picking practice!

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conebeckham
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Re: Mahamudra meditation problem: locating the mind

Postby conebeckham » Fri Apr 18, 2014 12:04 am



"Absolute Truth is not an object of analytical discourse or great discriminating wisdom,
It is realized through the blessing grace of the Guru and fortunate Karmic potential.
Like this, mistaken ideas of discriminating wisdom are clarified."
- (Kyabje Bokar Rinpoche, from his summary of "The Ocean of Definitive Meaning")

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Kaccāni
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Re: Mahamudra meditation problem: locating the mind

Postby Kaccāni » Fri Apr 18, 2014 12:18 am

And who paints up the image of "that which is unceasing" or "that which is unborn"?
Can it exist without him?
How should it survive him?
Shush! I'm doing nose-picking practice!

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conebeckham
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Re: Mahamudra meditation problem: locating the mind

Postby conebeckham » Fri Apr 18, 2014 12:39 am

No need to paint, and not possible anyway.
No survival needed, no existence indicated.

No further sense in talking, at this point, I anticipate.


"Absolute Truth is not an object of analytical discourse or great discriminating wisdom,
It is realized through the blessing grace of the Guru and fortunate Karmic potential.
Like this, mistaken ideas of discriminating wisdom are clarified."
- (Kyabje Bokar Rinpoche, from his summary of "The Ocean of Definitive Meaning")

Andrew108
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Re: Mahamudra meditation problem: locating the mind

Postby Andrew108 » Fri Apr 18, 2014 5:48 am

The Blessed One said:

"What is the All? Simply the eye & forms, ear & sounds, nose & aromas, tongue & flavors, body & tactile sensations, intellect & ideas. This, monks, is called the All. Anyone who would say, 'Repudiating this All, I will describe another,' if questioned on what exactly might be the grounds for his statement, would be unable to explain, and furthermore, would be put to grief. Why? Because it lies beyond range." Sabba Sutta.


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