Arhat From The Perspective Of Mahayana

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Lotus_Bitch
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Arhat From The Perspective Of Mahayana

Postby Lotus_Bitch » Sun Feb 26, 2012 9:55 pm

Taking this from wikipedia

In the early Buddhist schools

A range of views on the relative perfection of arhats existed amongst the early Buddhist schools. In general, the Mahāsāṃghika branch, such as the Ekavyāvahārikas, Lokottaravādins,[9] Bahuśrutīyas,[10] Prajñaptivādins, and Caitika[11] schools, advocated the transcendental and supermundane nature of the buddhas and bodhisattvas, and the fallibility of arhats.[12] The Caitikas, for example, advocated the ideal of the bodhisattva (bodhisattvayāna) over that of the arhat (śrāvakayāna), and they viewed arhats as being fallible and still subject to ignorance.[13]

According to A.K. Warder, the Sarvāstivādins held the same position as the Mahāsāṃghika branch regarding arhats, considering them to be imperfect and fallible.[14] The Kāśyapīya school also held the doctrine that arhats were fallible and imperfect, similar to the view of the Sarvāstivādins and the various Mahāsāṃghika sects.[15] The Kāśyapīyas believed that arhats have not fully eliminated desires, that their "perfection" is incomplete, and that it is possible for them to relapse.[16]


Can anyone explain the specifics on how the Hinayana Arhats are "fallible and imperfect" and "possible for to relapse?"

My main source of information (on how Yogacara makes the distinction) is from Tsongkhapas Ocean of Eloquence translated by Gareth Sparham. In it (if I remember correctly) they differentiate the difference of the attainments of the Arhat, in contrast to bodhisattvas on the pure gounds and that of buddhas in these ways: That the alaya-vijnana has "ceased" for the (post-learner) arhats and they are no longer subject to the 7th consciousness taking the alaya as its objective support (and are hence always in samadhi.) Though, Yogacara says that the continuum of the klista manas for the arhats cease while in nirodhi samapatti (9th jhana of cessation.) Yet, they say that bodhisattvas on the pure grounds (8th bhumi and up) the continuum of the seeds of the 7th consciousness cease entirely in both the absorption and post-absorption period. While of course for buddhas, the alaya is "overturned" or "transformed" into the wisdoms of a buddha.

So if anyone could help clarify (and correct) the specifics for me, it would be greatly appreciated. :smile:
Many meditators know how to meditate,
But only a few know how to dismantle [mental clinging].
- Je Gyare

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Huifeng
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Re: Arhat From The Perspective Of Mahayana

Postby Huifeng » Mon Feb 27, 2012 1:43 am

If you can get your hands on a copy of Bareau's book on the schools of the lesser vehicle, it has all the details of each school's position vis-a-vis arhats and their possible regression. Note that only some schools believed this, other schools did not. I suspect that this is where Warder may have got his information, because he doesn't read Chinese (where most of the information we now have on the Sarvastivada and probably the Mahasamghika is to be found).

~~ Huifeng


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Indrajala
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Re: Arhat From The Perspective Of Mahayana

Postby Indrajala » Mon Feb 27, 2012 6:54 am

tad etat sarvajñānaṃ karuṇāmūlaṃ bodhicittahetukam upāyaparyavasānam iti |

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Re: Arhat From The Perspective Of Mahayana

Postby mikenz66 » Mon Feb 27, 2012 8:02 am


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Huifeng
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Re: Arhat From The Perspective Of Mahayana

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Malcolm
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Re: Arhat From The Perspective Of Mahayana

Postby Malcolm » Mon Feb 27, 2012 9:30 am





འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


Free of hope and fear, relax.
Human life spent in
a state of great spaciousness is enjoyable.


— Kunzang Dechen Lingpa

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Indrajala
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Re: Arhat From The Perspective Of Mahayana

Postby Indrajala » Mon Feb 27, 2012 11:27 am

tad etat sarvajñānaṃ karuṇāmūlaṃ bodhicittahetukam upāyaparyavasānam iti |

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Indrajala
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Re: Arhat From The Perspective Of Mahayana

Postby Indrajala » Mon Feb 27, 2012 11:30 am

tad etat sarvajñānaṃ karuṇāmūlaṃ bodhicittahetukam upāyaparyavasānam iti |

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kirtu
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Re: Arhat From The Perspective Of Mahayana

Postby kirtu » Mon Feb 27, 2012 8:03 pm



"Even if you practice only for an hour a day with faith and inspiration, good qualities will steadily increase. Regular practice makes it easy to transform your mind. From seeing only relative truth, you will eventually reach a profound certainty in the meaning of absolute truth."
Kyabje Dilgo Khyentse Rinpoche.

"Only you can make your mind beautiful."
HH Chetsang Rinpoche

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AdmiralJim
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Re: Arhat From The Perspective Of Mahayana

Postby AdmiralJim » Mon Feb 27, 2012 9:57 pm

So what is the reason that Arhats aren't fully enlightened? It is an idea that I have never really accepted.
I don't know where we are going but it will be nice when we get there

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kirtu
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Re: Arhat From The Perspective Of Mahayana

Postby kirtu » Mon Feb 27, 2012 10:35 pm



"Even if you practice only for an hour a day with faith and inspiration, good qualities will steadily increase. Regular practice makes it easy to transform your mind. From seeing only relative truth, you will eventually reach a profound certainty in the meaning of absolute truth."
Kyabje Dilgo Khyentse Rinpoche.

"Only you can make your mind beautiful."
HH Chetsang Rinpoche

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Re: Arhat From The Perspective Of Mahayana

Postby cdpatton » Sat Mar 03, 2012 2:42 am


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Re: Arhat From The Perspective Of Mahayana

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