Right livelihood

A forum for discussion of Buddhist ethics.
Simon E.
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Re: Right livelihood

Post by Simon E. »

seeker242 wrote:
DGA wrote:
Overall, I've been taught that it's best to spend your energy on your own practice, on doing your best, rather than worrying overmuch about what others do and how they do it--further, that it's easiest to assume that others are also doing the best they can too.
Unless their activity causes harm to others, then I think it's appropriate!

ALL mundane activity causes harm. Its just a matter of degree.
“You don’t know it. You just know about it. That is not the same thing.”

Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche to me.
DGA
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Re: Right livelihood

Post by DGA »

seeker242 wrote:
DGA wrote:
Overall, I've been taught that it's best to spend your energy on your own practice, on doing your best, rather than worrying overmuch about what others do and how they do it--further, that it's easiest to assume that others are also doing the best they can too.
Unless their activity causes harm to others, then I think it's appropriate!
Or themselves, arguably. For example: my great-grandmother convinced my grandfather to quit smoking cigarettes in 1949; he came back from the War with that habit, and she didn't like to hear him coughing all the time--she wanted him to be healthy and happy. Was she right to speak up about it? Sure, but what if she had been a smoker herself--would it have carried the same kind of weight? Or if she wanted him to quit because it bothered her cats (she had a lot of cats), or because it made his teeth yellow and marred the family photograph? Different motivations...

Yes, there are times when it's appropriate to speak out, but you have to have your own house in order first. My point was rather that it's better to spend our time and energy on our own issues, rather than making our top priority diagnosing and remarking on the shortcomings of others.
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seeker242
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Re: Right livelihood

Post by seeker242 »

Simon E. wrote:
seeker242 wrote:
DGA wrote:
Overall, I've been taught that it's best to spend your energy on your own practice, on doing your best, rather than worrying overmuch about what others do and how they do it--further, that it's easiest to assume that others are also doing the best they can too.
Unless their activity causes harm to others, then I think it's appropriate!

ALL mundane activity causes harm. Its just a matter of degree.
Alright! I'll rephrase it "if the activity causes unnecessary or excessive harm to others"

DGA wrote: My point was rather that it's better to spend our time and energy on our own issues, rather than making our top priority diagnosing and remarking on the shortcomings of others.
Sounds reasonable. :smile:
One should not kill any living being, nor cause it to be killed, nor should one incite any other to kill. Do never injure any being, whether strong or weak, in this entire universe!
nilakantha
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Re: Right livelihood

Post by nilakantha »

As bodhisattvas, we also point out moral faults in others:

If the bodhisattva, in regard to sentient beings who deserve to be rebuked, who deserve punishment, and who deserve banishment, with a defiled thought fails to rebuke them, or rebukes them but fails to correct them with an act of punishment, or corrects them but fails to banish them, then he is possessed of fault, possessed of contradiction; there is defiled fault. -- Bodhisattvabhumi
May I be a poet in birth after birth, a devotee of the feet of Lord Avalokiteśvara,
with elevated heart, spontaneously directed towards his Refuge,
wholly occupied with the solemn duty of saving others.

--Lokeshvarashatakam of Vajradatta
anthbrown84
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Joined: Wed Nov 11, 2015 9:51 am

Re: Right livelihood

Post by anthbrown84 »

Hi guys, this is my first post here, btu this topic has got me thinking - I work in the oil and gas industry. I am a very small cog in the machine, but I am in charge of cabling that runs to instruments that help the process get oil out of the ground.

My input is very small, and I am bringing very little expertise into the roll, I often wonder, id this wrong livelihood? I know the definition only covers the poisons, dealing in animals etc... but if the oil industry was around in the BUddhas time, would he have stuck what I do into this category?

I am not in charge of getting the oil out the ground, I am basically placing equipment in places so that it works properly

any input or thoughts is really appreciated :)
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Paul
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Re: Right livelihood

Post by Paul »

Jesse wrote:
Simon E. wrote:No you can't assume that...but, if you are driving completely sober and attentively and despite that you hit a pedestrian ( it happens ) then you will not accrue any karma at all.
Karma vipaka is the result of VOLITIONAL activity.
The accident might however be a result of the pedestrians karma ripening.
lol.. so assuming the above is the case and you hit a small child, you think you'd feel just fine the next day? the next few months? No karma at all would cause no effects, any effect is obviously the result of karma.

Thing's arent so simple that you can say only intentional actions acrue karma.
Simon is right. For karma to be created you need intention, to carry out the action, and be pleased with the action having been completed.
Look at the unfathomable spinelessness of man: all the means he's been given to stay alert he uses, in the end, to ornament his sleep. – Rene Daumal
the modern mind has become so limited and single-visioned that it has lost touch with normal perception - John Michell
tingdzin
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Re: Right livelihood

Post by tingdzin »

Dear anthbrown84,

I personally wouldn't worry about it too much. It's not always obviously bad, and there are very few ways to make a living that are completely harmless. Your occupation is not only not on the List of those specifically prohibited, but it does not, on your part, involve lying, killing, stealing, improper sex, slandering, harsh speech, etc., right? I've worked a lot of different kinds of job, and I figure that unless you are fortunate enough to find a slot in an actively beneficial occupation, the best you can do is keeo your own nose clean, and not go along with harmful behavior when you run across it..
anthbrown84
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Joined: Wed Nov 11, 2015 9:51 am

Re: Right livelihood

Post by anthbrown84 »

tingdzin wrote:Dear anthbrown84,

I personally wouldn't worry about it too much. It's not always obviously bad, and there are very few ways to make a living that are completely harmless. Your occupation is not only not on the List of those specifically prohibited, but it does not, on your part, involve lying, killing, stealing, improper sex, slandering, harsh speech, etc., right? I've worked a lot of different kinds of job, and I figure that unless you are fortunate enough to find a slot in an actively beneficial occupation, the best you can do is keeo your own nose clean, and not go along with harmful behavior when you run across it..

Thankyou very much for them kind words Tingdzin, I have started leaning towards that method of thinking myself recently. Your input is really appreciated and makes a lot of sense
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