Please be more consistent with the enforcement of the rules

[Ayu]

Hello Myoho-Nameless,

did you have any personal conversation (PM) with the mod in charge about those removals? I'm not at all aware that one of your posts was regarded as worth deleting lately. Possibly I missed that incident, but on the other hand it is possible that a post was removed together with a whole conversation. (?) Often it makes no sense to keep the answers to a trolling post. Then also sane and normal posts are vanishing together with the trolling post. They are moved to a dumping ground and they are not deleted.
I believe, your latest discussions with a member who was banned permanently multiple times, was removed. That's why, I guess, the whole problem wasn't about you at all.

Every member of the staff gladly admits, we are not perfect. All we can do is try. What takes most time and energy is writing PM's. Maybe some mod (I don't know who) forgot to inform you about that removal. (?) Possibly.

A good picture of the situation in general is painted in this long thread: Dial back the moderation a notch, please
While reading you will see: too tight moderation for one person, is way too loose for the other. Even one and the same person scolds us for moderating (him) too tightly and for "doing nothing" about his opponents. In other words, they want us to moderate everybody else very tightly - except themselves.
A mayor error is to think moderators should be omniscient. We simply cannot fulfill this role.

[Ayu]

...
"One size fits all" does not work and couldn't work, even if we had five times as many mods and could spend months training them. Reality is messy, and we just have to live with it.

So true!

[boda]

A mayor error is to think moderators should be omniscient.

A major error, or logical fallacy to be exact, is to claim anyone thinks that.

[Myoho-Nameless]

So if you want consistency, appealing bad decisions and reporting posts that should get reported is probably the best case scenario. You may not necessarily want the post back, but asking for it to be put back if it was not what it was claimed to be is actually reasonable, and one step towards consistency.

One reason I was hesitant to bring this up is I assumed there is an above average amount of hurt feelings and vitriol given the popularity of the POTUS thread. Its also just not what I normally do (I honestly feel like a whiner), in my various quests for self knowledge I realized that I can be thin skinned and so I don't always assume my "feels" come from a place of wisdom. Despite being really hurt at times on DW I don't remember ever reporting anything, I prefer to talk things out.

My goal here was to just put in some people's minds, I expect this will be brought up again, if not by me, maybe someone else. Though I did a few posts back suggest actually allowing limited use of profanity would make things easier. I'm a millennial, "raising awareness" is my go to.

I have seen what mods of furry communities have to go through and I do appreciate its a pain.

did you have any personal conversation (PM) with the mod in charge about those removals? I'm not at all aware that one of your posts was regarded as worth deleting lately.

It was removed because I was guilty of name calling (with sarcasm, so without malice aforethought). So figured it was a legit removal, didn't occur to me to contest it. I just thought it worth mentioning that some things more serious were still up.

whatever "level" of modding is done, more or "toning it down" (my feeling is it would be easier to be consistent if the rules were more lax, but thats for y'all to decide. I a from the Nichiren sub, heard we had a reputation for having a lot of heat, but a dearth of complaining), I noticed there was some inconsistency. And I didn't see anything else in recent suggestion box threads pertaining to consistency.

[Ayu]

... did you have any personal conversation (PM) with the mod in charge about those removals? I'm not at all aware that one of your posts was regarded as worth deleting lately.

It was removed because I was guilty of name calling (with sarcasm, so without malice aforethought). So figured it was a legit removal, didn't occur to me to contest it. I just thought it worth mentioning that some things more serious were still up.

whatever "level" of modding is done, more or "toning it down" (my feeling is it would be easier to be consistent if the rules were more lax, but thats for y'all to decide. I a from the Nichiren sub, heard we had a reputation for having a lot of heat, but a dearth of complaining), I noticed there was some inconsistency. And I didn't see anything else in recent suggestion box threads pertaining to consistency.

If you had reported those more serious things instead of starting this thread, everything would be much more clear now. I still do not know, what you mean exactly. Do you really think, we see those things (omniciently ) and don't act on them for reason?

Boda says, no, nobody thinks we are omniscient.
So, please, don't hesitate to use the PM tool or reporting button.

What you call "inconsistence" is just the natural result of being a team of human beings. You can contact us, ask, complain in detail via PM.

[boda]

I pointed out a blatant logical fallacy, not that no one here thinks the moderators are omniscient.

What you call "inconsistence" is just the natural result of being a team of human beings.

The function of a suggestion box is to recieve input for the purpose of service improvement. It is contradictory or indeed "inconsistent" to suggest no improvement is intended, or possible. The suggestion box should be removed if there is no interest in improvement, or if there is a lack of belief that improvement is possible.

[Grigoris]

I pointed out a blatant logical fallacy, not that no one here thinks the moderators are omniscient.

What you call "inconsistence" is just the natural result of being a team of human beings.

The function of a suggestion box is to recieve input for the purpose of service improvement. It is contradictory or indeed "inconsistent" to suggest no improvement is intended, or possible. The suggestion box should be removed if there is no interest in improvement, or if there is a lack of belief that improvement is possible.

Isn't having multiple accounts against the Terms of Service Herbie? Do you suggest the staff should amend that too?

[boda]

Herbie?

[Ayu]

I pointed out a blatant logical fallacy, not that no one here thinks the moderators are omniscient.

What you call "inconsistence" is just the natural result of being a team of human beings.

The function of a suggestion box is to recieve input for the purpose of service improvement. It is contradictory or indeed "inconsistent" to suggest no improvement is intended, or possible. The suggestion box should be removed if there is no interest in improvement, or if there is a lack of belief that improvement is possible.

Isn't having multiple accounts against the Terms of Service Herbie? Do you suggest the staff should amend that too?

Yes, this shows our heart of gold and how we try to apply the rules individually again and again - as Kim explained already.
"Herbie" must be a typo.

[Mkoll]

"Herbie" must be a typo.

Doubt it. I think SD believes boda and Herbie are the same person. I don't think so. However, it wouldn't surprise me if the person who writes as boda also writes under another alias (or few) here, possibly a banned one. And having multiple accounts is against the rules.

[Grigoris]

My point is that people in glass houses should not throw stones.

[boda]

My point is that people in glass houses should not throw stones.

I'm sure if anyone knew that suggesting greater consistency would be painful, like being hit with flying stones, they wouldn't have made the suggestion. The intention was only to improve the forum and not to cause pain.

[Ayu]

I didn't read anyone writing about pain.
It is a saying: If you sit in a glass house, don't throw stones.
This means: why do you complain that much, when this board obviously is very generous to you, boda?

Is there anything more to add to the topic?

[boda]

From urbandictionary:

Commonly misinterpreted as being a proverb warning against hypocrisy. This is incorrect.

The actual meaning is closer to that of "if you can't take it, don't dish it out".

if you are a type of person who is easily offended [or hurt by criticism], do not go around offending people unless you can handle being offended yourself.

And these are suggestions. They don't need to be interpreted as complaints or an attack. I make the suggestion in order to try improving the forum, to answer your question, Ayu.

[Grigoris]

I'm sure if anyone knew that suggesting greater consistency would be painful, like being hit with flying stones, they wouldn't have made the suggestion. The intention was only to improve the forum and not to cause pain.

If you want the forum to improve then you need do nothing more than improve yourself. It goes without saying that this applies to all of us. Now quit whining and stop trying to misinterpret what I am saying, like you are victim here.

[boda]

I've been painted as an attacker, not a victim. But anyway, what exactly did you mean, if not what the proverb you used means.

[Myoho-Nameless]

What you call "inconsistence" is just the natural result of being a team of human beings

And I am being human too, I see something that I think might be off and I want to address it. At least one person acknowledged their own part and expressed a commitment to at least try to "be better". I have to agree with boda, in fact, I already said here that I am NOT expecting perfection from the mods. You see, this is going to be in people's minds and can influence their behavior weather they are aware of it or agree with it or not I also already acknowledged the role the non mods could play in helping with this issue.

This was a general trend so I think it merits a thread, not just a few PMs, I want to make sure more than just a few people, mods or peasants, become aware of this, or see that someone is aware enough and was motivated sufficiently to say something. The "point" of this thread is in its title. A few PMs here and there would not be sufficient.

If you had reported those more serious things instead of starting this thread, everything would be much more clear now

hard to know what to report, if what I see getting removed or changed is not consistent. this also makes the ToS less than useful.

[Johnny Dangerous]

And I am being human too, I see something that I think might be off and I want to address it.

Of course it's off, it's always off, to some degree.

The only way to have consistency is to have consistency int he busiest/most controversial threads. Personally I think that is pretty much what happens already. naturally though, missteps happen all the time, it;s the nature of it.

That's why I'm saying, notifying the mods of missteps is as simple as reporting stuff that oughta be, and appealing stuff you think was wrong. The problem with general statements like "moderation isn't consistent" is that once you've done the job, you realize what bizarre claim that is, consistency is pretty much relative.

[DGA]

notifying the mods of missteps is as simple as reporting stuff that oughta be, and appealing stuff you think was wrong.

^^^ Everyone please do this ^^^

[Kim O'Hara]

notifying the mods of missteps is as simple as reporting stuff that oughta be, and appealing stuff you think was wrong.

^^^ Everyone please do this ^^^

It would really make our lives easier and - more to the present point - would help us make moderation more consistent.
When people respond to a 'bad' post in the thread, and especially when that goes on for a dozen posts before we know it's happening, it gets really hard to remove the OT or nasty stuff without completely wrecking the real conversation (which is, btw, yet another reason for inconsistent moderation).


Kim