Ram's Interpretation of the Lotus Sutra

Discuss your personal experience with the Dharma here. How has it enriched your life? What challenges does it present?

Re: The Lotus Sutra

Postby ram peswani » Wed Mar 21, 2012 4:16 am

[quote="Tatsuo"
I don't think that anything ram peswani writes about is of any help to understand the Lotus Sutra.. all he does is repeat washed-out new-age nonsense coupled with praising himself and bragging about the "insights" he got from meditation. He not only seeing connections were there are none, but also making contradictory statements as "I am sending my predictions. [...] Now Ram predicts on the basis of lotus sutra." and "I am not predicting, i am reading Lotus Sutra.". This is ridiculous at best and I don't think that in a Buddhist forum such sophomoric personalities should be left uncriticized. This has nothing to do with disparaging ram, but if he chooses to publish his thoughts about himself being able to explain the Lotus Sutra to everyone else because of his "insight", I think it is more than desirable that he will have to face criticism. I don't want to read sentences like these in this forum again:


Most of the criticism I have faced that my writings are egoists.
Lotus sutra is difficult because it handles pair of opposites.
In this case egoism and egolessness.
With egoism Buddhas make better universes.
Egolessness makes it easier for Buddha to walk on this path which is very long and difficult.
EGoism is also as important as egolessness.
If you learn or practice on these two above statements , tremondous advantages will incur you.
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Re: The Lotus Sutra

Postby ram peswani » Wed Mar 21, 2012 4:30 am

Mr. G wrote:
Tatsuo wrote:
Image



Guatam Buddha told Lotus sutra 2500 years back approx.
At that time earth was considered flat and writing language was not available.
At present this world is too too advanced in knowledge and science.
If someone has guts , let him translate it taking advantage of these facilities.

There are a lot of scholars here on this site.I hope someone comes out.
Explain what is this Phantom city ?
What is treasure tower?
What is this emerging from the earth? etc.etc.
Just do not read this lotus sutra from the book but explain what you understand as to these terms covey?
ram
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Re: The Lotus Sutra

Postby ram peswani » Wed Mar 21, 2012 6:39 am

Ngawang Drolma wrote:Here is a link to The Lotus Sutra text.

The Lotus Sutra or Sutra on the White Lotus of the Sublime Dharma is one of the most popular and influential Mahayana sutras in Asia and the basis on which the Tien Tai and Nichiren sects of Buddhism were established.

-History and background-

The Lotus Sutra was probably compiled in the first century BCE in Kashmir, India some 500 years after the death of Shakyamuni Buddha. Therefore, it is not included in the more ancient Āgamas nor in the parallel Sutta Pitaka of the Theravada Buddhists, both of which represent the older Buddhist scriptures which to a greater degree of certainty can be historically linked to the Buddha himself.

The Lotus Sutra purports to be a discourse delivered by the Buddha toward the end of his life. The tradition in Mahayana states that the Lotus Sutra was written down at the time of the Buddha and stored for five hundred years in the realm of the dragons (or Nagas). After this, they were reintroduced into the human realm at the time of the Fourth Buddhist Council in Kashmir. The tradition further claims that the teachings of the Lotus Sutra are higher than the teachings contained in the agamas and the Sutta Pitaka (the Sutra itself also claims this), and that humankind had been unable to understand the Lotus Sutra at the time of the Buddha (500 BCE).

Source




Women will never be allowed to become Buddhas. Never , never.

I give following three explanations to support this statement.

1.Buddha energy reaches the highest level and the result is infinite life of Buddha. It wants to touch Suniata source.
And this can only happen if ego, time , space have not come out of Suniata.
Ego at the highest level cannot be divided. It remains Male. Only when Ego splits in cosmic energy 1 and cosmic energy 2, female energy comes out.
In order for Buddha to achieve this Buddha energy has to transced the female.
Other wise it can not ascend.

2. This is further claified when 8 years old Dragon girl has to convert in male before attaining Buddhahood.
3. I am told Bible also tells that Eve came out of Adam's rib.


Six months back when I had commented that females are not allowed to become Buddhas, I was humilated and my letters were censored to the level that I stopped writing on this forum. I hope this time someone comes out with better explanation of Lotus sutra or i am allowed to withdraw without going thro all this.

If I withdraw the reason will be that I have no hope in you. The same feeling i had six months back. When I found Noah going thro same negativities I had to come out with a support for Noah at the thought that that someone respects the Lotus Sutra.
I was shocked last time when someone on this forum commented that Lotus Sutra is not the highest teaching of Guatam.

ram
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Re: The Lotus Sutra

Postby ram peswani » Wed Mar 21, 2012 11:08 am

plwk wrote:Was it Harold Samuel who said location, location, location...

Interpretations, interpretations, interpretations...

This brings me back memories of Church days back then when there are some who insist that women should cover their heads and shut up in church and then impose the same on today's women, totally disregarding reading of the other parts of the Gospel and Pauline Epistles and then come out with a literalistic triumphant 'THERE YA GO. IT SAYS SO!' But this gang of fellas with horse blinkers on fail to see other historical, social & other aspects to be considered when reading this passage and other passages of scriptures... And female ordination? Because Mary, the Mother of Christ didn't get it, so all women shouldn't get it and just because he passed the keys to Peter? Yet in other passages, there is a 'priesthood of all believers' mentioned...


But where is the second opinion challanging my explanations. Why go round about.


This polarisation thingy on women and Buddhahood must be a kosher topic for some with a trump card of the phallic species I guess... when one read this Devadatta Chapter with other Sutras like Vimalakirti, Srimala Devi, Vajracheddika Prajna Paramita, one gets an impression that all of that display by the dragon girl and her skeptical audience are somewhat made up of layers of Dharma teachings? Just google on the Nichiren and SGI stances plus other Traditions' commentaries on this Devadatta Chapter and one can find that varied teachings on this 'dragon girl: 8 years of age as a representation of our own 8 Sufferings, the dragon girl representing the unhindered Buddha potential in all of us as compared to Devadatta and how she displayed the social stigma of that exists those days on what they regarded women as, plus when Prajnakuta Bodhisattva and the Elder Sariputra played the 'devil's advocate' in asking or stating 'chauvinistic' questions on a female's Buddhahood potential, it was to awaken the audience to such facts of social discrimination back then and its attachment to the marks of a male or female. One even opined that since a woman cannot be a Mara King, that must be quite a 'trump card' or 'consolation' for the female over the male species huh?


What is wrong with my answer that when the galaxi goes back in the black holes again and again, at some stage it will accept Devdatta as well as dragon girl. All came from one point Suniata and all goes to near one point Buddhahood.

I once read in a Nichiren forum where a poster opined that it would be quite arrogant to think that those in past ages and different cultures must conform to how we think on the issue of sexism these days given that women, in some cultures play a more dominant role than men as one instance...and vice versa with varying dynamics at play


Why not directly challange my three logical reasons I have given? Male female came from one. Male came first and to go back male will go last. Simple logic.


Oh ya...the 'highest Sutra' thingy? Won't advocates of the Mahaparinirvana, Avatamsaka and Sutras be trumpeting the same? What's the context of 'highest', 'best'? In the Larger Amitayus Sutra, it's mentioned that the Sutra will last another hundred years more before departing from this Saha World but do we read of the same preservation for the Saddharmapundarika? But does that make either one more special or better? That would be like children declaring to each other about whose candy is the best rather than that seeing that candy best fits that child for that time, circumstance and affinity? Look at the posters in this thread? For some it either has nothing special about it but it's a wow factor for some? And given the flip side, wouldn't the vice versa happen as well?

You have not read the lotus sutra. Guatam himself says that this sutra is the highest teaching. Is this not Guatam Buddha 's site? If you do not accept Guatam Buddhas words I have nothing more to say.

Sutras like the Lotus and et al are not easy to read and understand, much less to practice and should be treated with all round perspectives instead of just the one that one is fond of, be it sectarian or personal agenda ones...



So now you admit that you do not understand Lotus sutra.

ram
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Re: The Lotus Sutra

Postby Mr. G » Wed Mar 21, 2012 11:45 am

ram,

Get over yourself. Don't think we forgot your early nonsensical postings when you first joined here:

    "code name God " and "cosmic detective" author name "Mani Bhaumik" describes this process from present to past when our universe appeared 14.5
    billion years ago. the scientists have seen with various instruments appearing from black hole two round patches. I have named them Shiva and Shakti.

    I sincerely feel that I am soldier for improvement of this existence for some higher General......AND I DO NOT EXIST

    Lotus sutra always mentions Suniata (Emptiness), no other scriptures uses this word.

    The violent reactions indicate that if i write a book , it will be very popular, due to noise and acclaim that it will produce

    What i have seen on this site is primarily hinayanist and if you demand a teacher, i will expect respect and devotion from you


Stop lecturing people as it's clear you're not a person to be teaching anyone. The members here who want to learn the nuances of the Lotus Sutra will read the commentaries that are worth reading as well as learning from their teachers. You however are just spewing New Age nonsense.
    How foolish you are,
    grasping the letter of the text and ignoring its intention!
    - Vasubandhu
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Re: The Lotus Sutra

Postby plwk » Wed Mar 21, 2012 1:07 pm

ram peswani wrote:But where is the second opinion challanging my explanations. Why go round about.
What is wrong with my answer that when the galaxi goes back in the black holes again and again, at some stage it will accept Devdatta as well as dragon girl. All came from one point Suniata and all goes to near one point Buddhahood.
Why not directly challange my three logical reasons I have given? Male female came from one. Male came first and to go back male will go last. Simple logic.

Thanks for humoring me. You actually think that I was responding to or challenging your statements as opposed to posting a general observation? At which point in my posting did it mention your name or quoted any part of your posts? People post all kinds of things all the time here and I am one of them. Note that this time, this post contains a reference to your user name and posts, so yes, it's spot on. What an assumption...
You have not read the lotus sutra. Guatam himself says that this sutra is the highest teaching. Is this not Guatam Buddha 's site? If you do not accept Guatam Buddhas words I have nothing more to say.

Assuming again... and on my behalf... straw man argument
So now you admit that you do not understand Lotus sutra.

If I do, then what? If I don't, so what? Has it got anything to do with you?
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Re: The Lotus Sutra

Postby Noah » Thu Mar 22, 2012 1:16 am

wow, guys. :(

I have been a Buddhist of Theravada tradition since my beginning, never worrying about any of the historical traditions of Buddhism. I only read and tried to follow the Pali suttas. Deeply a disciple at heart, once I started meditating I found it was natural to orient my life towards the Dharma. After many years having only experience with the Diamond Sutra outside the Pali texts, I read the Lotus Sutra and was affected greatly. Since then I have read and studied many Mahayana Sutras and traditions as well. I decided to try and find an online community of people to talk about the Dharma.
I hoped to find a place where those who love the Dharma talk about it. A forum for each sutra, where current, personal understandings could be shared. Followers all sharing their devotion for Sutras that they love and follow. This is disheartening.

plwk- Thanks for sharing! It is great to see how the Lotus Sutra was able to transform a culture and flower into a tradition. Just as new insights and a current understanding of the Sutra were instrumental in that development and growth, I believe now the text holds the same power.

Mr.G- thanks for lending your voice here. I hope you will share your own personal understanding of the Lotus Sutra.

ram- I think you love the Dharma. Thank you for sharing your perspective. The Lotus Sutra is truly a spiritual perspective of cosmic evolution. It is interesting, fun and worthy to explore it in any way we can. We as humanity have a very different perspective in terms of knowledge than those the traditional understandings had, it is true of the Dharma that it shall grow, develop or die.

I am going to post on the next chapter soon.......The revelation of the Eternal Life of the Tathagata!!! And I shall continue to share my personal understanding. I hope others do as well :)
It is all happening right now :)
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Re: The Lotus Sutra

Postby ram peswani » Thu Mar 22, 2012 5:00 am

Noah wrote:wow, guys. :(
I am going to post on the next chapter soon.......The revelation of the Eternal Life of the Tathagata!!! And I shall continue to share my personal understanding. I hope others do as well :)



When I understood this chapter, that day I got firmly established in the Lotus sutra.
This chapter always resounds in my mind.
Now that I think back, Buddhas were bound to be the master of all universes.
They understood the laws of nature and followed them logically and total success was bound to come.
I do not treat Lotus sutra as a religion to be worshiped, but a science to be studied and understood.
After Noah has written and explained this chapter, I shall write down my understandings.
I understand the frustation and anger for many on this forum.
My simple advise that those who are having Gurus or have faith already in someone, they should not give any importance to my writings.
Faith is a different line and it will give one equally good results.
But Lotus Sutra is Lions Roar (Budha's words) and they are meant for very very few.
ram
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Re: The Lotus Sutra

Postby ram peswani » Thu Mar 22, 2012 6:29 am

Mr. G wrote:ram,

[color=#000080]Get over yourself. Don't think we forgot your early nonsensical postings when you first joined here:

"code name God " and "cosmic detective" author name "Mani Bhaumik" describes this process from present to past when our universe appeared billion years ago. the scientists have seen with various instruments appearing from black hole two round patches. I have named them Shiva and Shakti.

These books give scientific proof of cosmic evolution to great extent, while lotus sutra describes the evolution.

sincerely feel that I am soldier for improvement of this existence for some higher General......AND I DO NOT EXIST


I am my self surprised that lotus sutra is so heavy for many and still it came to me on my own. Who is doing this?

Lotus sutra always mentions Suniata (Emptiness), no other scriptures uses this word.


Lotus sutra describes Suniata or emptiness in many more ways.
The violent reactions indicate that if i write a book , it will be very popular, due to noise and acclaim that it will produce

What i have seen on this site is primarily hinayanist and if you demand a teacher, i will expect respect and devotion from you



My God, I was shocked myself at the disturbance my writings caused last time and my letters started getting deleted.


Stop lecturing people as it's clear you're not a person to be teaching anyone. The members here who want to learn the nuances of the Lotus Sutra will read the commentaries that are worth reading as well as learning from their teachers. You however are just spewing New Age nonsense.



You are man of faith. I am man of science. You are more lucky than I am. Your path is much easier than mine. Can we both not exist together?
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Re: The Lotus Sutra

Postby Jikan » Thu Mar 22, 2012 5:21 pm

Hi Ram,

I think Mr G's point is that your positions on the Lotus Sutra don't seem to have much of a relationship to the Lotus Sutra as a whole, but instead reflect your own understanding. Further, Mr G disagrees with you on fundamentals, as do most of us here at DharmaWheel.

There's a place in the world for everyone, to be sure. There's no reason why people who disagree can't get along in a neighborly way. William Blake: "Opposition is True Friendship."

That said, if you take a position that is clearly at odds with the evidence available to you (in this case the text of the Lotus Sutra), I think it is fair for you to expect serious disagreement. That's all.
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Re: The Lotus Sutra

Postby kirtu » Thu Mar 22, 2012 5:30 pm

ram peswani wrote:Noah,

I read the site you sent to me on future prediction of tibetean lama. I am sending my predictions.


Scientists have already understood that our sun though youngest is one of the healthiest suns.

Now Ram predicts on the basis of lotus sutra.

1. our sun is going to outlast all the suns of our galaxi.


Nope, nada, nitchivo, no way 'bra!

2.Life on planets of our sun is going to outlive every where.


See above - unless we possibly move to the moons of the outer planets in 4 billion years - 4b is a long time and we can't exclude extensive terraforming .... but the inner planets are toast - literally.

Kirt
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Re: The Lotus Sutra

Postby Jikan » Thu Mar 22, 2012 5:38 pm

kirtu's comment brings me to another point:

If you want to make a claim about cosmology, what kind of evidence is warranted? Do you value the observations made by scientists, or do you take a religious text such as The Lotus Sutra as the most authoritative evidence?

I'd argue that the Lotus Sutra is very warranted as evidence regarding the nature of Buddhahood. Not so much on cosmology or, for that matter, gender.
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Re: Chapter 11 Beholding the Precious Stupa- Imagery in Action

Postby kirtu » Thu Mar 22, 2012 5:40 pm

ram peswani wrote:Suniata is unstable eroding cosmic energy.
We are surrounded inside and outside by Suniata energy.


Nope .... also sunyata is taught in other scriptures.

Anyway,the Lotus Sutra is great but is probably not meant to be taken so cosmically. Think of Bodhisattva Never Disparaging.

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Re: Chapter 11 Beholding the Precious Stupa- Imagery in Action

Postby ram peswani » Fri Mar 23, 2012 4:16 am

[quote="kirtu"]
ram peswani wrote:
Nope .... also sunyata is taught in other scriptures.

Anyway,the Lotus Sutra is great but is probably not meant to be taken so cosmically. Think of Bodhisattva Never Disparaging.

Kirt




Probably i wanted to write Suniata is explained in lotus sutra better than in other scriptures.
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Re: The Lotus Sutra

Postby ram peswani » Fri Mar 23, 2012 4:39 am

Jikan wrote:kirtu's comment brings me to another point:

If you want to make a claim about cosmology, what kind of evidence is warranted? Do you value the observations made by scientists, or do you take a religious text such as The Lotus Sutra as the most authoritative evidence?

I'd argue that the Lotus Sutra is very warranted as evidence regarding the nature of Buddhahood. Not so much on cosmology or, for that matter, gender.




Code name God explains that you, me, all life came of from black hole.He explains scientific methods and instruments used in support. Black hole is sort of Suniata (emptines) for physical life. Stars emerged first and then planets, then life and existence. And he does it with solid scientific proofs.

Lotus sutra in chapter after chapter explains, how Buddhas are formed even before suns appeared.
In Phantom city he explains that suns with their guarding lords (brahama) from 8 directions (surroundings) start moving towards Buddha who is the center of this movement.The suns start shining more and more.

This is a gigantic movement in the sky which Buddha controlled forming a galaaxi.

Code name God explains scientific instruments used to confirm this process 14.5 b years earlier.

My writings will not be clear if one has not read Lotus sutra carefully and sceptics will further need Code name God to get satisfied.
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Re: The Lotus Sutra

Postby ram peswani » Fri Mar 23, 2012 4:56 am

Jikan wrote:Hi Ram,

I think Mr G's point is that your positions on the Lotus Sutra don't seem to have much of a relationship to the Lotus Sutra as a whole, but instead reflect your own understanding. Further, Mr G disagrees with you on fundamentals, as do most of us here at DharmaWheel.

There's a place in the world for everyone, to be sure. There's no reason why people who disagree can't get along in a neighborly way. William Blake: "Opposition is True Friendship."

That said, if you take a position that is clearly at odds with the evidence available to you (in this case the text of the Lotus Sutra), I think it is fair for you to expect serious disagreement. That's all.



Six months back I had trouble with the site . I was literally thrown out. Later I read the letters on forum more and more and found out that discussions are of faith, Mantras, gurus, monks.
If this forum has the guts I can explain some of the portions of lotus sutra from scientific angle. But in that case one has to read lotus sutra.

Some one has to come out with sentences from lotus sutra. Then he has to express his understandings. And then the fruitful discussion will start.

Or if one can not express his understandings then he can ask questions and answers will be of my understandings.

Here on this forum complexes are rising in persons of faith. They are right in getting them. So I advice them to neglect my writings. And let me survive for a few readers.

ram
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Re: The Lotus Sutra

Postby Sherab Dorje » Fri Mar 23, 2012 9:54 am

And He said, "Come!" and Jikan stepped down from the boat, and walked on the waters to come to Ram.
But when Jikan saw that the wind was strong, he was afraid, and beginning to sink, he cried out, saying, "Ram Avatar, save me!"
Immediately Ram stretched out his hand, took hold of him, and said to him, "You of excessive faith, why do you believe gurus and monks, have faith, and chant mantras; why do you not enter into fanciful over-intellectualisation?"
jikan_walking_on_water.jpg
jikan_walking_on_water.jpg (27.6 KiB) Viewed 873 times
"When one is not in accord with the true view
Meditation and conduct become delusion,
One will not attain the real result
One will be like a blind man who has no eyes."
Naropa - Summary of the View from The Eight Doha Treasures
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Re: The Lotus Sutra

Postby ram peswani » Fri Mar 23, 2012 11:06 am

[quote="gregkavarnos"]And He said, "Come!" and Jikan stepped down from the boat, and walked on the waters to come to Ram.
But when Jikan saw that the wind was strong, he was afraid, and beginning to sink, he cried out, saying, "Ram Avatar, save me!"
Immediately Ram stretched out his hand, took hold of him, and said to him, "You of excessive faith, why do you believe gurus and monks, have faith, and chant mantras; why do you not enter into fanciful over-intellectualisation?"

jikan_walking_on_water.jpg
[/quote]


What did I write? I do not remember truely. Why not print my words as well? At least send me copy of my words to me.

Faith is never excessive and I will not write such words.But what a beautiful effort? :smile: love you.

ram
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Re: The Lotus Sutra

Postby Sherab Dorje » Fri Mar 23, 2012 1:39 pm

"...the surprising discovery of quantum physics that the primary source of everything in the universe is present in each minutest stitch of the fabric of space of this immensely vast cosmos empowers us to ponder the One Source of all creation. It is not merely a blind faith anymore. This ought to enable us to feel ourselves as an inextricable part of the One Source, which would significantly improve the quality of our lives."
From "Code Name God". Well given that Buddhists do not believe in a creation either from one source or lots of sources. Where exactly in the Lotus Sutra do you believe it states something even remotely similar to Mani Lal Bhaumik's view?

In Phantom city he explains that suns with their guarding lords (brahama) from 8 directions (surroundings) start moving towards Buddha who is the center of this movement.The suns start shining more and more.

This is a gigantic movement in the sky which Buddha controlled forming a galaaxi.
What a crock! It says nothing of the sort in the chapter titled "The Apparitional City". http://www.bdkamerica.org/digital/dBET_ ... a_2007.pdf
How splendid it is to meet the buddhas,
The Great Sages who deliver the world,
Who diligently work to get sentient beings
Out of the hell of the triple world!
The Best of Devas and Humans,
Who has universal wisdom,
Out of compassion for everyone
Opens the gate to immortality
And extensively saves all.
Since olden times, immeasurable kalpas
Have passed away in vain
Without the presence of the Buddha.
In the time before the Bhagavat appears,
The ten directions are in constant darkness.
Those in the three troubled states of being increase
And the asuras also flourish.
The devas decrease all the more,
And when they die
Many of them fall into those troubled states.
Having never heard the teaching from the Buddha,
All of them always behave badly,
And their physical power and wisdom decreases.
Because of their erring deeds
They lose happiness or any notion of it.
Abiding in the teaching of false views
They know nothing of good conduct.
Deprived of the buddhas’ inspiration,
They always fall into the troubled states of being.
After a very long time, the Buddha has now
Appeared as the Eye of the World.
It is out of compassion for sentient beings
That the Buddha appears in the world.
Transcending everything, the Buddha
Has attained complete enlightenment.
We are all extremely happy,
And all the other beings joyfully acclaim
This unprecedented experience.
All our palaces are beautifully adorned
By this ray of light.
We now offer them to the Bhagavat.
Please accept them out of your compassion!
By the universal transference of this merit,
May we and all other beings
Together attain the buddha path!

:namaste:
"When one is not in accord with the true view
Meditation and conduct become delusion,
One will not attain the real result
One will be like a blind man who has no eyes."
Naropa - Summary of the View from The Eight Doha Treasures
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Re: The Lotus Sutra

Postby Blue Garuda » Fri Mar 23, 2012 3:10 pm

ram peswani wrote:

What did I write?

ram


Plenty of theories of cosmogenesis and anthropogenesis out there, including Blavatsky's . One more person stirring the pot and adding different spices does not prove much at all, and doesn't make me at all interested in tasting it, sorry. Expressing your views is fine, but if they are baseless attacks on Buddhadharma then you are probably in the wrong place.

maitri

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