All Buddhist traditions are oral traditions. Or...?

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Queequeg
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Re: All Buddhist traditions are oral traditions. Or...?

Post by Queequeg »

dzogchungpa wrote:
Queequeg wrote:
Malcolm wrote:You cannot teach Dharma through the mail or email. This is why there is no teaching of Dharma here.
I guess that answers my question about the efficacy of undies.
I think there can be no doubt that Kanzeon's used undies, should one be so fortunate as to obtain them, would be extremely efficacious.
For a split moment, on reading your comment, I had the impression of a sublime fragrance. No joke. Synesthesia? Or an actual whiff of Avalokitesvara's jock strap? The experience was like the first time I smelled Drakkar. or CK1. or Jitterbug Perfume.

Ah, must have been an illusion because how could something like that be communicated through this medium.

I don't know. It must have been the roses.
There is no suffering to be severed. Ignorance and klesas are indivisible from bodhi. There is no cause of suffering to be abandoned. Since extremes and the false are the Middle and genuine, there is no path to be practiced. Samsara is nirvana. No severance achieved. No suffering nor its cause. No path, no end. There is no transcendent realm; there is only the one true aspect. There is nothing separate from the true aspect.
-Guanding, Perfect and Sudden Contemplation,
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Queequeg
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Re: All Buddhist traditions are oral traditions. Or...?

Post by Queequeg »

Malcolm wrote:
Queequeg wrote:
How about telecast - ie. the live feed is one way?
Yup.
Here's what I'm getting - the interaction with a teacher must be temporally immediate, but not spatially immediate.

The interaction must be through the medium of a common language - mediation through an interpreter OK.

The interaction does not have to be mutual - in the sense of individual intercourse - but interaction from teacher to student is the critical factor.

How about telecast, in a language I don't understand, but with subtitles...
There is no suffering to be severed. Ignorance and klesas are indivisible from bodhi. There is no cause of suffering to be abandoned. Since extremes and the false are the Middle and genuine, there is no path to be practiced. Samsara is nirvana. No severance achieved. No suffering nor its cause. No path, no end. There is no transcendent realm; there is only the one true aspect. There is nothing separate from the true aspect.
-Guanding, Perfect and Sudden Contemplation,
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dzogchungpa
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Re: All Buddhist traditions are oral traditions. Or...?

Post by dzogchungpa »

Queequeg wrote:
dzogchungpa wrote:I think there can be no doubt that Kanzeon's used undies, should one be so fortunate as to obtain them, would be extremely efficacious.
For a split moment, on reading your comment, I had the impression of a sublime fragrance. No joke. Synesthesia? Or an actual whiff of Avalokitesvara's jock strap?
It's a DW miracle!
Queequeg wrote:The experience was like the first time I smelled Drakkar. or CK1. or Jitterbug Perfume.
For me the corresponding aroma would be Opium (the perfume) combined with cigarette smoke.

:cheers:
There is not only nothingness because there is always, and always can manifest. - Thinley Norbu Rinpoche
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Queequeg
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Re: All Buddhist traditions are oral traditions. Or...?

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The olfactory sense door is totally underestimated... Like Napoleon, I tell my wife not to shower if I've been away and we are to rendez-vous.

A follow up question...

What if you are not immediately present- in person or remotely via the mediums discussed above - but hear an accurate account of the oral teaching from someone who was in attendance?

To make this discussion more explicit, you guys are talking about Direct Introduction... right?
There is no suffering to be severed. Ignorance and klesas are indivisible from bodhi. There is no cause of suffering to be abandoned. Since extremes and the false are the Middle and genuine, there is no path to be practiced. Samsara is nirvana. No severance achieved. No suffering nor its cause. No path, no end. There is no transcendent realm; there is only the one true aspect. There is nothing separate from the true aspect.
-Guanding, Perfect and Sudden Contemplation,
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Taco_Rice
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Re: All Buddhist traditions are oral traditions. Or...?

Post by Taco_Rice »

Queequeg wrote:The olfactory sense door is totally underestimated... Like Napoleon, I tell my wife not to shower if I've been away and we are to rendez-vous.
What a way to renounce the world.

:namaste:
When facing a single tree, if you look at a single one of its red leaves, you will not see all the others. When the eye is not set on any one leaf, and you face the tree with nothing at all in mind, any number of leaves are visible to the eye without limit. But if a single leaf holds the eye, it will be as if the remaining leaves were not there. One who has understood this is no different from Kannon with a thousand arms and a thousand eyes.
— Takuan Sōhō, the Unfettered Mind
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Queequeg
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Re: All Buddhist traditions are oral traditions. Or...?

Post by Queequeg »

Taco_Rice wrote: What a way to renounce the world.
Why would anyone want to do that?

"Every sight and scent is the Middle Way itself."
There is no suffering to be severed. Ignorance and klesas are indivisible from bodhi. There is no cause of suffering to be abandoned. Since extremes and the false are the Middle and genuine, there is no path to be practiced. Samsara is nirvana. No severance achieved. No suffering nor its cause. No path, no end. There is no transcendent realm; there is only the one true aspect. There is nothing separate from the true aspect.
-Guanding, Perfect and Sudden Contemplation,
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Re: All Buddhist traditions are oral traditions. Or...?

Post by Taco_Rice »

Queequeg wrote:
Taco_Rice wrote: What a way to renounce the world.
Why would anyone want to do that?

"Every sight and scent is the Middle Way itself."
The scent of spiced wine, of course. :roll:
When facing a single tree, if you look at a single one of its red leaves, you will not see all the others. When the eye is not set on any one leaf, and you face the tree with nothing at all in mind, any number of leaves are visible to the eye without limit. But if a single leaf holds the eye, it will be as if the remaining leaves were not there. One who has understood this is no different from Kannon with a thousand arms and a thousand eyes.
— Takuan Sōhō, the Unfettered Mind
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dzogchungpa
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Re: All Buddhist traditions are oral traditions. Or...?

Post by dzogchungpa »

Taco_Rice wrote:
Queequeg wrote:
Taco_Rice wrote: What a way to renounce the world.
Why would anyone want to do that?

"Every sight and scent is the Middle Way itself."
The scent of spiced wine, of course. :roll:
Dude, all phenomena are one scent as the dharmadhātu.
There is not only nothingness because there is always, and always can manifest. - Thinley Norbu Rinpoche
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Re: All Buddhist traditions are oral traditions. Or...?

Post by Taco_Rice »

dzogchungpa wrote:Dude, all phenomena are one scent as the dharmadhātu.
Like cocaine? Or am I missing something here?
When facing a single tree, if you look at a single one of its red leaves, you will not see all the others. When the eye is not set on any one leaf, and you face the tree with nothing at all in mind, any number of leaves are visible to the eye without limit. But if a single leaf holds the eye, it will be as if the remaining leaves were not there. One who has understood this is no different from Kannon with a thousand arms and a thousand eyes.
— Takuan Sōhō, the Unfettered Mind
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Queequeg
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Re: All Buddhist traditions are oral traditions. Or...?

Post by Queequeg »

You're not missing anything.

Of course, you're presumably not a full blown enlightened being, so following that line of cocaine to its end game probably doesn't end well.
There is no suffering to be severed. Ignorance and klesas are indivisible from bodhi. There is no cause of suffering to be abandoned. Since extremes and the false are the Middle and genuine, there is no path to be practiced. Samsara is nirvana. No severance achieved. No suffering nor its cause. No path, no end. There is no transcendent realm; there is only the one true aspect. There is nothing separate from the true aspect.
-Guanding, Perfect and Sudden Contemplation,
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Taco_Rice
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Re: All Buddhist traditions are oral traditions. Or...?

Post by Taco_Rice »

Queequeg wrote:You're not missing anything.

Of course, you're presumably not a full blown enlightened being, so following that line of cocaine to its end game probably doesn't end well.
Neither does the bee situation.
When facing a single tree, if you look at a single one of its red leaves, you will not see all the others. When the eye is not set on any one leaf, and you face the tree with nothing at all in mind, any number of leaves are visible to the eye without limit. But if a single leaf holds the eye, it will be as if the remaining leaves were not there. One who has understood this is no different from Kannon with a thousand arms and a thousand eyes.
— Takuan Sōhō, the Unfettered Mind
Malcolm
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Re: All Buddhist traditions are oral traditions. Or...?

Post by Malcolm »

Queequeg wrote: Here's what I'm getting - the interaction with a teacher must be temporally immediate, but not spatially immediate.
With modern tech, this is possible, yes.
The interaction must be through the medium of a common language - mediation through an interpreter OK.
Yes.
The interaction does not have to be mutual - in the sense of individual intercourse - but interaction from teacher to student is the critical factor.
Yes.
How about telecast, in a language I don't understand, but with subtitles...
If they are simultaneous, yup. This is mediation through interpretation.
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Re: All Buddhist traditions are oral traditions. Or...?

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What is this simultaneity important for? Certainly not for relaying teachings.
1 Myriad dharmas are only mind.
Mind is unobtainable.
What is there to seek?

2 If the Buddha-Nature is seen,
there will be no seeing of a nature in any thing.

3 Neither cultivation nor seated meditation —
this is the pure Chan of Tathagata.

4 With sudden enlightenment to Tathagata Chan,
the six paramitas and myriad means
are complete within that essence.


1 Huangbo, T2012Ap381c1 2 Nirvana Sutra, T374p521b3; tr. Yamamoto 3 Mazu, X1321p3b23; tr. J. Jia 4 Yongjia, T2014p395c14; tr. from "The Sword of Wisdom"
Malcolm
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Re: All Buddhist traditions are oral traditions. Or...?

Post by Malcolm »

Astus wrote:What is this simultaneity important for? Certainly not for relaying teachings.
Yes, it is important for relaying the teachings. We have already discussed this you and I. Not into a repeat.
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Queequeg
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Re: All Buddhist traditions are oral traditions. Or...?

Post by Queequeg »

Malcolm wrote:
Astus wrote:What is this simultaneity important for? Certainly not for relaying teachings.
Yes, it is important for relaying the teachings. We have already discussed this you and I. Not into a repeat.
Can you link the discussion?
There is no suffering to be severed. Ignorance and klesas are indivisible from bodhi. There is no cause of suffering to be abandoned. Since extremes and the false are the Middle and genuine, there is no path to be practiced. Samsara is nirvana. No severance achieved. No suffering nor its cause. No path, no end. There is no transcendent realm; there is only the one true aspect. There is nothing separate from the true aspect.
-Guanding, Perfect and Sudden Contemplation,
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Re: All Buddhist traditions are oral traditions. Or...?

Post by Malcolm »

Queequeg wrote:
Malcolm wrote:
Astus wrote:What is this simultaneity important for? Certainly not for relaying teachings.
Yes, it is important for relaying the teachings. We have already discussed this you and I. Not into a repeat.
Can you link the discussion?
It was in a thread on direct introduction
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Queequeg
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Re: All Buddhist traditions are oral traditions. Or...?

Post by Queequeg »

Malcolm wrote:
It was in a thread on direct introduction
Of course it was. :smile: Thanks.
Last edited by Queequeg on Tue Feb 02, 2016 6:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
There is no suffering to be severed. Ignorance and klesas are indivisible from bodhi. There is no cause of suffering to be abandoned. Since extremes and the false are the Middle and genuine, there is no path to be practiced. Samsara is nirvana. No severance achieved. No suffering nor its cause. No path, no end. There is no transcendent realm; there is only the one true aspect. There is nothing separate from the true aspect.
-Guanding, Perfect and Sudden Contemplation,
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Astus
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Re: All Buddhist traditions are oral traditions. Or...?

Post by Astus »

Queequeg wrote:
Malcolm wrote:Yes, it is important for relaying the teachings. We have already discussed this you and I. Not into a repeat.
Can you link the discussion?
More on recorded empowerments, etc.
1 Myriad dharmas are only mind.
Mind is unobtainable.
What is there to seek?

2 If the Buddha-Nature is seen,
there will be no seeing of a nature in any thing.

3 Neither cultivation nor seated meditation —
this is the pure Chan of Tathagata.

4 With sudden enlightenment to Tathagata Chan,
the six paramitas and myriad means
are complete within that essence.


1 Huangbo, T2012Ap381c1 2 Nirvana Sutra, T374p521b3; tr. Yamamoto 3 Mazu, X1321p3b23; tr. J. Jia 4 Yongjia, T2014p395c14; tr. from "The Sword of Wisdom"
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