Any Dream Yogis here?

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Nosta
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Any Dream Yogis here?

Post by Nosta »

Does anyone here practice Dream Yoga?

If so, how do you: 1) fall asleep (for example visualising the Tibetan A?) and 2) how did you train yourself to wake up lucid while dreaming? 3) do you have dreams of clarity?

Thanks
haya
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Re: Any Dream Yogis here?

Post by haya »

In Tibetan Buddhism Saraswati sometimes appears in the retinue of other Buddhas and Bodhisattvas, ordinarily in sadhanas with lots of deities.
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Natan
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Re: Any Dream Yogis here?

Post by Natan »

You should ask your teacher. Or look into Choegyal Namkhai Norbu's dream yoga teachings. It's very clear how to do it.
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Paul
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Re: Any Dream Yogis here?

Post by Paul »

These are the two books you need:

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There's actually a lot about lucid dreaming on the internet from a secular point of view that I think could be very useful.
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Nosta
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Re: Any Dream Yogis here?

Post by Nosta »

Thank you!

Nevertheless I would like to know if there are dream yogis here and learn about their experiences :)
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kirtu
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Re: Any Dream Yogis here?

Post by kirtu »

I am not a dream yogi. The following is some of the reasons why I'm not.

A few years ago my main Nyingma teacher gave us dream yoga instructions. So I had the blessings of the lineage and my lama's instructions. These of course are absolutely vital. He gave detailed instructions and I followed them. However I am often dead tired and this is the worst situation you can be in to practice dream yoga. So you shouldn't practice when you are dead tired (more correctly it's just harder to practice). He also said that it is easier to practice dream yoga if you practice visualizing a peaceful deity. I really like the wrathful deities so this is kind of a problem for me. My teacher also said that you need to realize that there is really no difference between our normal waking state and our reaming state. Unfortunately while I can mouth these words the normal waking state appears vividly to me and the dream state does in fact seem like a dream state.

So I do go home and begin to practice that afternoon (the afternoon we finish). I pray to be able to accomplish the practice in order to liberate all beings from samsara. Sure enough I'm able to recognize that I'm dreaming. So I begin to manipulate objects in the semi-dream, turning perceived objects into vajras and other things as my teacher told me to to. Then I wake up. So a little while later I practice dreaming like this again. This time I'm also able to recognize a little and transform the dram a little. Then I wake up again. This goes on for a while and I never get beyond this. Later I forget to practice dream yoga.

My teacher also did have instructions for maintaining awareness as one falls sleep and for actual sleeping instead of not being able to sleep because of too much active awareness. I forgot those instructions. One night I couldn't get to sleep at all in fact.

Thus I failed to put my teacher's instructions into practice just like the pot with a hole in it.

However when my teachers are physically around then it's easier to practice anything, even my failed dream yoga.

So to start you need the blessings of the lineage and verbal instructions from your lama and then you need to practice in order to realize that the waking state and the dream state are no different and you want to accomplish this path to attain Buddhahood and liberate all beings from the experienced nightmare of samsara.

The End.

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Nosta
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Re: Any Dream Yogis here?

Post by Nosta »

Kirtu, thank you very much for sharing your experience!

I dont have a teacher, a lama, whatever and I also have the same problems as you, so I think that my practice is near to impossible. I fall asleep and forget completly to be aware and I also wont wake lucid in my dreams. One night, just like you, I was completly unable to fall asleep (I dont understand why) when I tried to do just a little of dream yoga (if we can call that to someone who just read books about the topic).

When I read that we need to see reality as a dream, I always tought that is like "feeling" (like "feeling" in your gut) that our world is like a big dream. I never tought that we should really feel it like a dream. If thats the point with dream yoga, then I think I will never do it because the world seems very real to me and I also question myself if insanity wouldnt be a near to...As much I would like to get free from samsara, I wouldnt like to get crazy in the process, and perceiving the all world like a dream all the time is something dangerous I suppose, only people with strong mental development can do it.
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Re: Any Dream Yogis here?

Post by kirtu »

Nosta wrote: I dont have a teacher, a lama,
A teacher is indispensable
I fall asleep and forget completly to be aware
We were taught to self-generate a peaceful deity as we were falling asleep and to pray to awaken in the dream state for the benefit of all beings.

These instructions are also indispensable. So you will need a lama.
One night, just like you, I was completly unable to fall asleep
This is like a balancing trick. You have to relax and fall asleep but retain the intention at least of remaining aware. Staying awake means you are putting to much effort in the awareness side (or that the whole host of sleep issues are arising for you).
When I read that we need to see reality as a dream, I always tought that is like "feeling" (like "feeling" in your gut) that our world is like a big dream. I never tought that we should really feel it like a dream.
The waking state is really no different from dreaming because we are dominated by delusion. We are all in a kind of massive dream state grasping to things that cannot bring us true happiness, etc. We continue to fantasize and to grasp at the eight worldly concerns that just keep us mired in samsara. We have little control over our thoughts, which change constantly and are just like a dream.

Kirt
“Where do atomic bombs come from?”
Zen Master Seung Sahn said, “That’s simple. Atomic bombs come from the mind that likes this and doesn’t like that.”

"Even if you practice only for an hour a day with faith and inspiration, good qualities will steadily increase. Regular practice makes it easy to transform your mind. From seeing only relative truth, you will eventually reach a profound certainty in the meaning of absolute truth."
Kyabje Dilgo Khyentse Rinpoche.

"Only you can make your mind beautiful."
HH Chetsang Rinpoche
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Nosta
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Re: Any Dream Yogis here?

Post by Nosta »

Once again, thank you for your advices.

Altought a lama is indispensable, at least I could try to learn inducing lucid dreaming without one. Many people can do it too.

But I will keep in mind all advices you gave, I also think I am trying to hard to fall asleep without loosing my counsicousness.
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Re: Any Dream Yogis here?

Post by Arnoud »

Not watching tv before bed helps as well.
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Re: Any Dream Yogis here?

Post by Grigoris »

The "scariest" bit is when the dividing line between dream and reality becomes so blurred that dreams start encroaching into waking reality. That's when I stopped. Mainly because I knew that my mental state was not mature enough for me to able to "handle" this new reality in a wise and compassionate manner. You see, it is no use doing dream yoga if you are just going to intentionally engage in the eight worldly dharmas in your dreams too. ;)

Dream yoga practice is easy (uncomplicated), Dharma practice though...
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TaTa
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Re: Any Dream Yogis here?

Post by TaTa »

Im not a dream yogi but i tend to have lucid dreams. Sometimes i just play with them and sometimes i do more dharma oriented things. I recived minimun teachings on what to do when recognizing a dream by my lama but we never continued the dialoge and currently im not at my finest moment with lucid dreams (Im being lazy).
Personally lucid dreaming just came to me probably due to shamata practice. When i hear how tibetans used lucid dream i became more interested and started to develope that skill. Ive learned tips froms buddhist or buddhism oriented masters like Allan B Wallace or Charley Morley that are both trained in the tibetan way and in the modern psycocholy way and has been very helpfull. I recomend you both teachers and their material.

You do need a lama for dream yoga instructions but i dont think that there is harm in training yourself to lucid dreaming and it may be helpfull when and if you get dream yoga teachings.
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Re: Any Dream Yogis here?

Post by Natan »

If you have been directly introduced to your nature dream yoga is easy to do. You simply practice guru yoga at bedtime. It happens naturally. Without this basic ingredient you will frustrate yourself to no end. You have internet obviously. So tune into a webcast by ChNN when he gives the introduction and instruction on guru yoga. He does that every retreat by the second or third day. It's easy. It's fun. And you can do it on your couch. Smooches...
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Re: Any Dream Yogis here?

Post by Johnny Dangerous »

I learned an Amitabha phowa / dream yoga practice that I do. I go through periods where I remember dreams very well, and i've had a couple where I can consciously fly around, etc. Other periods I don't remember dreams at all, and when I do they are unremarkable. I practice it anyway though, since it's (among other things) prepping for dying...seems like a "better safe than sorry" thing lol!
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Re: Any Dream Yogis here?

Post by Dakinisa »

Hello I am not a Yogi either, but I used to practice Lucid dreaming for some time. I found it very inspiring.
But it comes in phases and it goes in phases. Currently I am on a off phase and I can not control my dreams.
There are many interesting book also regarding Lucid dreaming, some more scientific some more spiritual.
I would also be interested discussing these type of dreams, does anybody know from y place here n the forum? ...I am still quite new ;)
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lorem
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Re: Any Dream Yogis here?

Post by lorem »

Need to start to understand illusory body first.

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Shemmy
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Re: Any Dream Yogis here?

Post by Shemmy »

Since getting involved with DC, I've been doing the guru yoga before falling asleep. I tried for years to do lucid dreaming practices nightly for months without any success in the slightest. Given that many people find it impossible to even remember their dreams, I feel lucky I can, when I want, have pretty extensive dreams every night.

There's a way to cheat with lucid dreaming I've found and that is to wake up and then go back to sleep. I can lucid dream if I am only half asleep, the environment I find myself in has arisen on its own, is fairly clear, yet I am able to choose to create things, interact a bit more cogently with people, animals, etc. that I meet. Seems like a half-way point between active imagination and dreams. Might be a useful thing to experiment with, waking up and going back to sleep.

For remembering dreams, there is nothing like a dream journal. My first semester in college I took a really interesting class with the old beat nick poet, WW2 conscientious objector, visionary poet Bill Everson. The class was in finding a poetic voice and vision and he insisted that we work with our dreams and keep a dream journal. My dream life instantly exploded. I have never had more dreams and more vivid ones than that period of journal writing. I was hooked on dream journal writing for 2-3 years after that.

So, I am trying to use the journal writing technique again to try and at least explore clarity in dreams since I cannot be lucid, it is impossible for me. What I am finding is that once I review the dream content via journal writing that there are all these hints and spots in the dreams that point to clarity and increased awareness . It has raised the that my dreams will help provide me with the clues i need to overcome my lack of lucidity and awareness in my dreams.

Another aspect of the journal writing, since I have just begun doing it again is the way that it enables me to cheat and half-lucidly dream. It really has been quite an astounding discovery.I am finding that as I reflect on dreams with a mind to aid my dream yoga/practice of the night, that the reflection/writing sessions are activating a rather strongly vivid and once again dreaming feel to the dream memory. It is as though the memory of the dreams are, via awareness and presence while writing and reflecting upon them, being restrored to dream status. There is an autonomy to them and intelligence that communicates that is beyond simply my just remembering a dream. I have several times put my pen down and just been taken very vividly into the dreams and found them reverberating with insight and insight, tremenodusly energetic and alive, almost palpabale intelligences floating in the room.

Finally, no one has mentioned, I suppose it is obvious, but there is the ChNN's Dark Retreat instructions. Again he was stressing the importance on todays retreat of doing it, I haven't done it and it sounds like anyone who is serious about becoming fully aware in dreams and who is having difficulty should do it. I will do it within the next week or so and if you like I will post on the results.
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Re: Any Dream Yogis here?

Post by lorem »

Shemmy wrote:I will do it within the next week or so and if you like I will post on the results.
That would be great if you can. I've been practicing TWR's book and notice that even setting an intention to wake up every couple of hours works. (Body-clock)

The problem for me is then I forget why I'm awake or lucid but don't recognize dream state and so I don't switch positions or chakra-bindu. Been successful handful of times.
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Re: Any Dream Yogis here?

Post by Vajrasvapna »

Is it just me who thinks that the dream yoga is a distraction? It only creates mental distraction, you create expectations and is waiting for some special dream. The most important dreams I had was when I was not practicing any kind of yoga.
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lorem
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Re: Any Dream Yogis here?

Post by lorem »

Are not waiting for a specific dream or best dream.

4 me work on central channel, learn (hey I eat too much at night, hey I'm dreaming now alter the dream and help sentient beings, those kinds of things.)

I guess if you were practicing specifically bare awareness it would be.
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