Malcolm wrote:Which ironically is one of the root tantras of "klong sde".
yes, I was wondering about that too... the footnote in "The Supreme Source" tries to convey that the 4 yogas of Semde are older than the yogas of Mahamudra, and as evidence for this it cites a Longde text...
I can’t read tibetan, so I’m dependent on translations, and so far I didn’t come across any references to the 4 naljors in any of the translations of early Dzogchen scriptures I read. Do you happen to know if any of the 18 semde tantras actually contain explanations on the 4 Naljors? I’m currently trying to learn more about the so-called Semde tradition in general, and especially about its contemplative practice(s), but this seems to be a rather difficult task. For example, according to David Germano, it is “difficult to ascertain precisely what type of formal contemplation might have been associated with early Mind Series literature, since it devotes little space to such practical presentations.
” But he goes on and writes that “In their early forms, both [mahamudra and rdzogs chen] represent innovative codifications of non-symbolic perfection phase practices separated off from their intimate partners in tantric contemplation, and thus in essence are tantric transformations of earlier calming (zhi gnas, samatha) and insight (lhag mthong, vipasyana) meditations. These latter meditations are modified in terms of actual practice as well as shaped by the tantric discourses in which they are rhetorically contextualized.
Now, there is plenty of literature that explains the 4 yogas of Mahamudra, but in regards of Semde, the available literature is quite scarce, hence I'm curious what the earliest sources are that explain the 4 Naljors of Semde in some detail, and if there is actually some evidence that the 4 Semde Naljors really predate the 4 yogas of Mahamudra.
BTW, does the commentary on the Kunjed Gyalpo translated by Valby contain some instructions on the 4 Naljors, and if so, in which volume?