Gotama/Shakyamuni

A Ah Sha Sa Ma Ha
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Re: Gotama/Shakyamuni

Post by A Ah Sha Sa Ma Ha »

:anjali:
pema yeshe
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Re: Gotama/Shakyamuni

Post by pema yeshe »

AND samantabhadra/bhadhri is YOU!!!

have fun everyone!
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dzogchungpa
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Re: Gotama/Shakyamuni

Post by dzogchungpa »

pema yeshe wrote:AND samantabhadra/bhadhri is YOU!!!

have fun everyone!
Mind is blown.
There is not only nothingness because there is always, and always can manifest. - Thinley Norbu Rinpoche
Schrödinger’s Yidam
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Re: Gotama/Shakyamuni

Post by Schrödinger’s Yidam »

...the claim was made that all forms of Buddhism are derived 'directly ' from ' Gotama, The Buddha '.
My understanding is that Vajradhara is understood to be the enlightenment of Sakyamuni as seen from the Vajrayana perspective. So that's why at the very top of the Kagyu Refuge tree is a small Vajradhara, representing Sakyamuni. Then you also visualize your own teacher as Vajradhara, not because he is in any sense the same personage as Sakyamuni, but the enlightenment presented to you by him is still the enlightenment of Sakyamuni as has been passed down through the lineage(s).
What say you ?
So from that perspective and understanding, yes.
1.The problem isn’t ‘ignorance’. The problem is the mind you have right now. (H.H. Karmapa XVII @NYC 2/4/18)
2. I support Mingyur R and HHDL in their positions against lama abuse.
3. Student: Lama, I thought I might die but then I realized that the 3 Jewels would protect me.
Lama: Even If you had died the 3 Jewels would still have protected you. (DW post by Fortyeightvows)
Simon E.
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Re: Gotama/Shakyamuni

Post by Simon E. »

pema yeshe wrote:AND samantabhadra/bhadhri is YOU!!!

have fun everyone!

So I am the Dharmakaya ?
“You don’t know it. You just know about it. That is not the same thing.”

Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche to me.
florin
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Re: Gotama/Shakyamuni

Post by florin »

Simon E. wrote:
pema yeshe wrote:AND samantabhadra/bhadhri is YOU!!!

have fun everyone!

So I am the Dharmakaya ?
You are all three.Dharmakaya Sambogakaya Nirmanakaya
Simon E.
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Re: Gotama/Shakyamuni

Post by Simon E. »

No I'm not. :lol: They're just words.
“You don’t know it. You just know about it. That is not the same thing.”

Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche to me.
florin
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Re: Gotama/Shakyamuni

Post by florin »

Simon E. wrote:No I'm not. :lol: They're just words.
they are words but they point towards a certain reality which we all possess
Malcolm
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Re: Gotama/Shakyamuni

Post by Malcolm »

smcj wrote:
...the claim was made that all forms of Buddhism are derived 'directly ' from ' Gotama, The Buddha '.
My understanding is that Vajradhara is understood to be the enlightenment of Sakyamuni as seen from the Vajrayana perspective. So that's why at the very top of the Kagyu Refuge tree is a small Vajradhara, representing Sakyamuni. Then you also visualize your own teacher as Vajradhara, not because he is in any sense the same personage as Sakyamuni, but the enlightenment presented to you by him is still the enlightenment of Sakyamuni as has been passed down through the lineage(s).
This is not how things are presented in Dzogchen, or for that matter in Sakya or Nyingma. In both Sakya and Nyingma for example, the nirmanakāya is not considered to be the "Teacher". There is only one teacher, Buddha Samantabhadhra/Vajradhara. This single teacher, the dharmakāya, called Samantabhadra, emanates the Samabhogakāya, in this case Vajradhara, who in turn emanates the nirmanakāyas such as Śākyamuni. I am fairly certain the Kagyus also present things in this way.

The Gelugpas understand it the way you present it.
Simon E.
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Re: Gotama/Shakyamuni

Post by Simon E. »

alpha wrote:
Simon E. wrote:No I'm not. :lol: They're just words.
they are words but they point towards a certain reality which we all possess

So does ' rhubarb ' or ' gromit '. Actualising these things is a bit different isn't it ?
“You don’t know it. You just know about it. That is not the same thing.”

Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche to me.
Malcolm
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Re: Gotama/Shakyamuni

Post by Malcolm »

alpha wrote:
Simon E. wrote:
pema yeshe wrote:AND samantabhadra/bhadhri is YOU!!!

have fun everyone!

So I am the Dharmakaya ?
You are all three.Dharmakaya Sambogakaya Nirmanakaya
We have all three as potentials, we still have to recognize them in direct perception. That is what practice is for.
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kalden yungdrung
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Re: Gotama/Shakyamuni

Post by kalden yungdrung »

Malcolm wrote:
Kunga Lhadzom wrote:What's the difference between Gotama Shakyamuni and Samantabhadra (Ultimately) :shrug:
Samantabhadra is the dharmakāya, of whom Śākyamuni is an emanation.

Tashi delek M,

- Then who is here Sambhogakaya and Nirmanakaya?
- Is this Lineage of Indian origen ?
- What is the complete actual lineage ( Refuge Tree )?

Mutsug Marro
KY
The best meditation is no meditation
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kalden yungdrung
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Re: Gotama/Shakyamuni

Post by kalden yungdrung »

alpha wrote:
Simon E. wrote:
pema yeshe wrote:AND samantabhadra/bhadhri is YOU!!!

have fun everyone!

So I am the Dharmakaya ?
You are all three.Dharmakaya Sambogakaya Nirmanakaya

Tashi delek A,

- If i am not misunderstood according the 3 Kayas we have 3 Paths and 3 different fruits?
- What do you think about the fact that Buddha Shakyamuni would be an emantion from Samantabhadra?
This is remarkable because accourding the Jitakas the Buddha did spent about 254 lives in Benares. I guess he was a Bodhisattva therefore.

Mutsug Marro
KY
The best meditation is no meditation
Schrödinger’s Yidam
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Re: Gotama/Shakyamuni

Post by Schrödinger’s Yidam »

The Gelugpas understand it the way you present it.
Thanks for the correction. It was a Gelug lama that said it to me. I assumed the Kagyupas saw it the same way.
1.The problem isn’t ‘ignorance’. The problem is the mind you have right now. (H.H. Karmapa XVII @NYC 2/4/18)
2. I support Mingyur R and HHDL in their positions against lama abuse.
3. Student: Lama, I thought I might die but then I realized that the 3 Jewels would protect me.
Lama: Even If you had died the 3 Jewels would still have protected you. (DW post by Fortyeightvows)
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