Yogacara, Dzogchen, Experience

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Re: Yogacara, Dzogchen, Experience

Postby Malcolm » Thu Apr 28, 2011 11:12 pm

adinatha wrote:Sure. My point was to leave aside all levels except "unsurpassed utterly secret" level. Longchen Nyingthig is the Nyingthig of the Nyingthigs, because Longchenpa gathered all the Nyingthig transmissions and took the essence.


Many other masters have done this as well. Jigme Lingpa simply is one of the most famous due mostly to his recent appearance and the fame of some of his disciples and recognized incarnations.

Other transmissions, for example, Dudjom Lingpa's Gnas lugs rang byung are every bit as profound as anything in Klong chen snying thig.

N
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འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔

Though there are infinite liberating gateways of Dharma,
there are none not included in the dimension of the knowledge of the Great Perfection.

-- Buddha Samantabhadri
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Re: Yogacara, Dzogchen, Experience

Postby username » Thu Apr 28, 2011 11:16 pm

Hi adinatha, I don't think there is any point in PMing you as I don't have any insights and don't want to lead anyone astray and am just going through the motions of Dzogchen and parroting things I heard. Maybe one day I will be a true beginner Dzogchenpa. You seem to be doing alright anyway. In Palyul many start from toghal then onto trekcho as they are inseparable anyway and there are many ati paths specially around Himalayas including guru devotion and more and things unfold in numerous ways which is the vast aspect of the greatness of the effortlessness of completion. I can imagine too many paths beyond fathoming in all time and space. From what is often told us being non-dual in the state of the lineage gurus giving direct transmission and other teachings by the practitioner is the key to everything, so you are right there. As for experiences there is always the inevitable coming down, and going up again. As pilots say any landing including a crash landing that one walks away from is a good landing. And a soft landing is better than a hard landing. Best of all is leaving the blissful experience at its height suddenly and truly forgetting most if not all of them. I have to get back to the stove. Best wishes and it's great to have fun, in fact I am planning on having some very soon. Have a good weekend.
Dzogchen masters I know say: 1)Buddhist religion essence is Dzogchen 2)Religions are positive by intent/fruit 3)Any method's OK unless: breaking Dzogchen vows, mixed as syncretic (Milanese Soup) 4)Don't join mandalas of opponents of Dalai Lama/Padmasambhava: False Deity inventors by encouraging victims 5)Don't debate Ati with others 6)Don't discuss Ati practices online 7) A master told his old disciple: no one's to discuss his teaching with some others on a former forum nor mention him. Publicity's OK, questions are asked from masters/set teachers in person/email/non-public forums~Best wishes
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Re: Yogacara, Dzogchen, Experience

Postby Enochian » Thu Apr 28, 2011 11:25 pm

Anyway, I am pretty sure Dzogchen criticizes yogacara, so they are definitely not the same.
There is an ever-present freedom from grasping the mind.

Mind being defined as the thing always on the Three Times.
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Re: Yogacara, Dzogchen, Experience

Postby gnegirl » Thu Apr 28, 2011 11:27 pm

heart wrote:Seriously, I feel like you guys are on some drug I don't know about. The discussion has no shape or continuity at all the last few days. One should discuss ones experience with ones teacher, no one else. A thread on Dzogchen experience is a very bad idea.

/magnus


:popcorn: I can make room on the couch of bemused observation :)!

This sort of reminds me of when a good friend asked me point blank 'you aren't into that wierd tantric stuff are you'. All he got from me was a smile and a small laugh, and a quick change of subject.
"Things are not what they appear to be: nor are they otherwise." --Surangama Sutra

Phenomenon, vast as space, dharmata is your base, arising and falling like ocean tide cycles, why do i cling to your illusion of unceasing changlessness?
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Re: Yogacara, Dzogchen, Experience

Postby adinatha » Thu Apr 28, 2011 11:48 pm

username wrote:Hi adinatha, I don't think there is any point in PMing you as I don't have any insights and don't want to lead anyone astray and am just going through the motions of Dzogchen and parroting things I heard. Maybe one day I will be a true beginner Dzogchenpa. You seem to be doing alright anyway. In Palyul many start from toghal then onto trekcho as they are inseparable anyway and there are many ati paths specially around Himalayas including guru devotion and more and things unfold in numerous ways which is the vast aspect of the greatness of the effortlessness of completion. I can imagine too many paths beyond fathoming in all time and space. From what is often told us being non-dual in the state of the lineage gurus giving direct transmission and other teachings by the practitioner is the key to everything, so you are right there. As for experiences there is always the inevitable coming down, and going up again. As pilots say any landing including a crash landing that one walks away from is a good landing. And a soft landing is better than a hard landing. Best of all is leaving the blissful experience at its height suddenly and truly forgetting most if not all of them. I have to get back to the stove. Best wishes and it's great to have fun, in fact I am planning on having some very soon. Have a good weekend.


You can't lead me astray. Good job. Keep it up.
CAW!
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Re: Yogacara, Dzogchen, Experience

Postby gnegirl » Fri Apr 29, 2011 12:05 am

adinatha wrote:
username wrote:Hi adinatha, I don't think there is any point in PMing you as I don't have any insights and don't want to lead anyone astray and am just going through the motions of Dzogchen and parroting things I heard. Maybe one day I will be a true beginner Dzogchenpa. You seem to be doing alright anyway. In Palyul many start from toghal then onto trekcho as they are inseparable anyway and there are many ati paths specially around Himalayas including guru devotion and more and things unfold in numerous ways which is the vast aspect of the greatness of the effortlessness of completion. I can imagine too many paths beyond fathoming in all time and space. From what is often told us being non-dual in the state of the lineage gurus giving direct transmission and other teachings by the practitioner is the key to everything, so you are right there. As for experiences there is always the inevitable coming down, and going up again. As pilots say any landing including a crash landing that one walks away from is a good landing. And a soft landing is better than a hard landing. Best of all is leaving the blissful experience at its height suddenly and truly forgetting most if not all of them. I have to get back to the stove. Best wishes and it's great to have fun, in fact I am planning on having some very soon. Have a good weekend.


You can't lead me astray. Good job. Keep it up.


And what, exactly, is the basis of this 'me'?
"Things are not what they appear to be: nor are they otherwise." --Surangama Sutra

Phenomenon, vast as space, dharmata is your base, arising and falling like ocean tide cycles, why do i cling to your illusion of unceasing changlessness?
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Re: Yogacara, Dzogchen, Experience

Postby adinatha » Fri Apr 29, 2011 12:15 am

gnegirl wrote:
adinatha wrote:
username wrote:Hi adinatha, I don't think there is any point in PMing you as I don't have any insights and don't want to lead anyone astray and am just going through the motions of Dzogchen and parroting things I heard. Maybe one day I will be a true beginner Dzogchenpa. You seem to be doing alright anyway. In Palyul many start from toghal then onto trekcho as they are inseparable anyway and there are many ati paths specially around Himalayas including guru devotion and more and things unfold in numerous ways which is the vast aspect of the greatness of the effortlessness of completion. I can imagine too many paths beyond fathoming in all time and space. From what is often told us being non-dual in the state of the lineage gurus giving direct transmission and other teachings by the practitioner is the key to everything, so you are right there. As for experiences there is always the inevitable coming down, and going up again. As pilots say any landing including a crash landing that one walks away from is a good landing. And a soft landing is better than a hard landing. Best of all is leaving the blissful experience at its height suddenly and truly forgetting most if not all of them. I have to get back to the stove. Best wishes and it's great to have fun, in fact I am planning on having some very soon. Have a good weekend.


You can't lead me astray. Good job. Keep it up.


And what, exactly, is the basis of this 'me'?


Today? A bowl of porridge and a beef sandwich.
CAW!
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