rTsa, rTsal, and the Fruition of Trekchö

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Lhug-Pa
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rTsa, rTsal, and the Fruition of Trekchö

Postby Lhug-Pa » Fri Nov 11, 2011 3:48 am

Without going into discussing the Yid-Lus and sGyu-Lus so much (unless relevant); let's discuss mainly the Ja'-Lus (the Rainbow Body), Lus rDul Phran (Atomic Body), Od-Kyi-Lus or A'od-Lus (Light Body), and Phowa-Chenpo (Great Transference Body) in possible relation to the practice of Trekchö.

It seems that the final Fruition of Anuyoga and/or Anuttaratayoga Tantra is the Ja'-Lus; the Fruition of Trekchö is the Lus rDul Phran (but not necessarily with either the Rainbow Body or the Light Body), the Fruition of Thögal or Tögyal at the time of physical death is the Od Kyi Lus or A'od-Lus, and the Fruition of Thögal before physical death is Phowa-Chenpo.

This being said, it is taught that for the Fruition of Thögal, our Nadis or rTsa must be healthy (this is implied in Heart Drops of Dharmakaya).

Is this the same for the Fruition of Trekchö?

Could anyone reference some teachings that might say as to whether or not we need very healthy, or at least relatively undamaged, Nadis in order to 'achieve' the Fruition of Trekchö?


Some Dharmawheel reference threads (no time to right now):

"Rainbow Body Misconception"

"Tathagatagarbha and Eternity"

"Mind, Rigpa, and Body Relation"

"Saraha, Moksaragupta and Dzogchen"

"Difference between Dzogchen and Mahamudra"

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Lhug-Pa
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Re: rTsa, rTsal, and the Fruition of Trekchö

Postby Lhug-Pa » Sun Nov 13, 2011 4:15 am

Are there Tibetan (or even Sanskrit) words that would fill in the following blanks?


Trekchö - Kadag - Dharmakaya - Thigle - Essence - Sounds

Thögal - Lhungrub - Sambhogakaya - Lung - Nature - Lights

_______ - ________ - Nirmanakaya - rTsa - Energy - Rays


However since the above three aspects are inseparable, it logically follows that we would need healthy Nadis for the Fruition of Trekchö as well?

(Although the Dharmakaya precedes, so to speak, the Sambhogakaya and the Nirmanakaya; but perhaps for those of us who are tangled up in Samsara, we would have to go through the Nirmanakaya and Sambhogakaya first (or simultaneously) in order to achieve any Fruition related to the Dharmakaya)


Also, what is the difference between Gzhi and Kunzhi (Alaya) (not necesarily Kunzhi-Namshe or Alaya-Vijnana)

(Some Key-words: Thugs-rJe, gDangs, rGyan, Rolpa, and rTsal (Tsal or Tsel), Ngo-bo (Ngowo), Rang-bZhin (Rangzhin), rTsal (Nadi), Lung (Prana), and Thig-le or Thigle (Bindu) )

Is this a good webpage?

http://www.lamrimnotes.webs.com/dzogchen.html


Best Regards

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Lhug-Pa
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Re: rTsa, rTsal, and the Fruition of Trekchö

Postby Lhug-Pa » Tue Jan 03, 2012 5:38 pm

Not that I want to pursue this thread at the moment, although to link to another thread here:

viewtopic.php?f=100&t=6459&p=76433#p76433

And another key-word is Yermed.

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Malcolm
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Re: rTsa, rTsal, and the Fruition of Trekchö

Postby Malcolm » Tue Jan 03, 2012 7:15 pm





འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


Free of hope and fear, relax.
Human life spent in
a state of great spaciousness is enjoyable.


— Kunzang Dechen Lingpa

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Lhug-Pa
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Re: rTsa, rTsal, and the Fruition of Trekchö

Postby Lhug-Pa » Wed Jan 04, 2012 1:19 am

Thanks for posting the Sanskrit translations. :thumbsup:

Now I did get a little lost somewhere between Abhasvarah and Karuna in regard to matching the terms here. :thinking:

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mint
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Re: rTsa, rTsal, and the Fruition of Trekchö

Postby mint » Wed Jan 04, 2012 3:56 am

Someone's been studying hard.

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kalden yungdrung
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Re: rTsa, rTsal, and the Fruition of Trekchö

Postby kalden yungdrung » Wed Jan 04, 2012 12:27 pm

The best meditation is no meditation

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Sönam
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Re: rTsa, rTsal, and the Fruition of Trekchö

Postby Sönam » Wed Jan 04, 2012 2:45 pm

Sound is first ... as explained by ChNN
By understanding everything you perceive from the perspective of the view, you are freed from the constraints of philosophical beliefs.
By understanding that any and all mental activity is meditation, you are freed from arbitrary divisions between formal sessions and postmeditation activity.
- Longchen Rabjam -

krodha
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Re: rTsa, rTsal, and the Fruition of Trekchö

Postby krodha » Thu Jan 05, 2012 5:23 am


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ground
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Re: rTsa, rTsal, and the Fruition of Trekchö

Postby ground » Thu Jan 05, 2012 6:40 am


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Lhug-Pa
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Re: rTsa, rTsal, and the Fruition of Trekchö

Postby Lhug-Pa » Thu Apr 05, 2012 8:39 pm


Dronma
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Re: rTsa, rTsal, and the Fruition of Trekchö

Postby Dronma » Thu Apr 05, 2012 9:17 pm

"My view is as vast as the sky, but my actions are finer than flour"
~ Padmasambhava ~

Greg
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Re: rTsa, rTsal, and the Fruition of Trekchö

Postby Greg » Fri Apr 06, 2012 5:09 pm


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Malcolm
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Re: rTsa, rTsal, and the Fruition of Trekchö

Postby Malcolm » Fri Apr 06, 2012 5:22 pm





འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


Free of hope and fear, relax.
Human life spent in
a state of great spaciousness is enjoyable.


— Kunzang Dechen Lingpa

Greg
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Joined: Tue Jun 28, 2011 6:42 pm

Re: rTsa, rTsal, and the Fruition of Trekchö

Postby Greg » Fri Apr 06, 2012 5:28 pm

thanks


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