How to chant Amitabha name?

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Saoshun
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How to chant Amitabha name?

Post by Saoshun »

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Best explanation I saw. :namaste:
Yuren
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Re: How to chant Amitabha name?

Post by Yuren »

This kind of "explanation" as you call it, has very little to do with the Pure Land tradition or the Pure Land Sutras though.
This is very different from the way Shan Tao, Tan Luan, etc. up to Honen explain the purpose and meaning of Nianfo
Saoshun
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Re: How to chant Amitabha name?

Post by Saoshun »

Yuren wrote:This kind of "explanation" as you call it, has very little to do with the Pure Land tradition or the Pure Land Sutras though.
This is very different from the way Shan Tao, Tan Luan, etc. up to Honen explain the purpose and meaning of Nianfo
All I care if something is working or not working no matter if it's from tradition or off tradition. It's working great especially Vajra chanting, to get's effect in couple Vajra chants I would need to chant thousand of times regular chant. Chanting needs to transform you otherwise it's good vocal exercise, not spiritual process.
Tan-luan was originally a Buddhist scholar but after becoming ill he studied Taoism in order to seek the Elixir of Life. However after an encounter with Bodhiruci a Buddhist monk from India, Tan-luan became a devotee of the Pure Land teachings and, according to the Jodo Shinshu hymn Shoshinge, burnt his Taoist texts.
Well, nobody should follow such persons who burns scriptures as the taoist elixir methods greatly enhance health and bring off suffering from people.
Admin_PC
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Re: How to chant Amitabha name?

Post by Admin_PC »

Saoshun wrote:Well, nobody should follow such persons who burns scriptures as the taoist elixir methods greatly enhance health and bring off suffering from people.
Having done Chinese Neigung (Taiji, Qigong, etc) I can say I have experienced the beneficial aspects of taoist methods. At the same time, I think it's a bit strong to say not to follow a master whom many schools consider to be a Pure Land patriarch, especially when he's credited with creating the 6 character phrase: 南無阿彌陀佛, which is being used in this video.

....
Yuren wrote:This kind of "explanation" as you call it, has very little to do with the Pure Land tradition or the Pure Land Sutras though.
This is very different from the way Shan Tao, Tan Luan, etc. up to Honen explain the purpose and meaning of Nianfo
On the other hand... If I'm not mistaken this is Nan Huai-Chin, a widely recognized Chan practitioner of the last century. The Chan understanding of Nianfo recitation is sometimes a bit different than that of the exclusive Pure Land schools, but it is still Pure Land practice. In fact, some of this is rather good advice for chanting out loud, which Honen and the other masters were known to advocate. For what it's worth, I've had the "hearing your own voice" thing happen. It's weird like hearing a tape recording, not like the normal way you hear yourself. The tips for regulating the breath are also helpful. Also, I think he's doing the 5 tone Buddha recitation introduced by Fa Zhao (correct me if I'm wrong), one of the 13 Chinese Pure Land patriarchs and one of the patriarchs denoted by Honen.

....

I guess my point is, if we have different understandings it's okay. We shouldn't be quick to disparage someone else's teaching because it doesn't align with our own.
Saoshun
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Re: How to chant Amitabha name?

Post by Saoshun »

I'm not saying this on personal level because mostly people especially masters do stupid things but overall they know what they are doing so I mean to not follow approach of burning which can be used for helping people thru meditation or different spiritual approaches.
Yuren
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Re: How to chant Amitabha name?

Post by Yuren »

Tan-Luan is for the Pure Land tradition what Linji or Mazu is for the Chan tradition. Even that's not enough really. Perhaps what Hui-Neng is?

Anyway, comrade iPorkChop goes to explain the Chan understanding of Pure Land etc. that's all good but you should know that to this Chan understanding of nianfo it is basically the same whether you chant "Kentucky Fried Chicken and Pizza Hut!" or you chant the nianfo. Because in this understanding, the content, the meaning, is irrelevant. If what really matters is the concentration when you chant, and the breath, etc. then it's really the same whether you chant KFC or nianfo.

If you don't believe me, read Hakuin's letter to the Nichiren nun. That's the Chan/Zen attitude to chanting. Hakuin doesn't care whether you chant Lotus Sutra title, nianfo, mantra, or whatever. What matters is your mind's concentration. But if you read the Infinite Life Sutra it says what matters is the mind of joy when realizing the essence of the Vow. Basically, that when you understand how it is that the Buddha Amitayus saves you, you experience authentic joy.

And that is very different from what Master Nan teaches in the video you posted.
Admin_PC
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Re: How to chant Amitabha name?

Post by Admin_PC »

Actually he's not making it up. This is a pretty common sentiment from Chan/Seon/Zen folks...
Seon Master Seung Sahn wrote:This is a very interesting try-mind story. It means, from moment to moment only “do it.” Only keep a try mind, only one mind: do it mind. When chanting, sitting or bowing, only do it. Practicing will not help if you are attached to your thinking, if your mind is moving. Taoist chanting, Confucian chanting, Christian chanting, Buddhist chanting: it doesn’t matter. Even chanting, “Coca Cola, Coca Cola, Coca Cola…” can be just as good if you keep a clear mind.
Q&A with Ch'an master Ven Sheng-Yen wrote: Question: Ch’an practice seems quite different from that of Pure Land, but Ch’an practitioners still chant Amitabha Buddha’s name. Why is this?

Shih-fu: First, there is a historical reason. Toward the end of the T’ang Dynasty, Pure Land practice was very popular. A Ch’an master by the name of Yung-ming (904-975) was a master of the Fa-yen school, but he was also a great proponent of Pure Land practice. His influence was so great that after his time there were few monks who did not recite Buddha’s name.

It is also important to note that there is no intrinsic antagonism between the recitation of Buddha’s name and Ch’an practice. For example, in the Sutra of Immeasurable Light (Sukhavativyuha Sutra), many methods of contemplating the Buddha are described, including that of reciting his name. Recitation of the Buddha’s name may be considered Pure Land practice, but as it is described in the sutra there is no emphasis on seeking rebirth in the Pure Land. Likewise, in the Amitabha Sutra, one passage describes reciting the Buddha’s name with a single-pointed mind. This can be a method of practicing samadhi. Likewise, the Sutra of Manjusri Inquiring on Prajna, speaks of reciting the Buddha’s name and similar methods. In fact, in that sutra, the name of any Buddha will do. It doesn’t have to be Amitabha’s. Even though all of these methods involve the recitation of Buddha’s name, they do not imply an aspiration to be reborn in the Pure Land. Thus a Ch’an practitioner and a Pure Land practitioner may both recite the Buddha’s name, but they do so with different attitudes.
Yuren
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Re: How to chant Amitabha name?

Post by Yuren »

Thanks for those quotes!!
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rory
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Re: How to chant Amitabha name?

Post by rory »

Here is a great 2 hour chanting video of Namo Amitabha in lyrical Chinese style. I really love it.

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gassho
Rory
Namu Kanzeon Bosatsu
Chih-I:
The Tai-ching states "the women in the realms of Mara, Sakra and Brahma all neither abandoned ( their old) bodies nor received (new) bodies. They all received buddhahood with their current bodies (genshin)" Thus these verses state that the dharma nature is like a great ocean. No right or wrong is preached (within it) Ordinary people and sages are equal, without superiority or inferiority
Paul, Groner "The Lotus Sutra in Japanese Culture"eds. Tanabe p. 58
https://www.tendai-usa.org/
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