conquering 1 desire is more valuable than fulfilling 1000

[tomschwarz]

dear friends, what human is credited with saying/writing this? I am sure it has been discovered countless times.... but is there a general belief that there was a single recent author? are there cases where this is false?

[Simon E.]

No idea. Sounds like a typical cyber-meme to me...made up in silicone valley and no doubt illustrated by a windblown flower.
If it does have any connection to 'Buddhism ' it's of the Hinayana variety.

No one else conflates the arising of Insight with the conquering of stuff.

[tomschwarz]

true true simon ))) and apropos.... ....i saw it on a stone, i think, at the end of this movie https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samsara_(2001_film)

...now i am confused )))) at the end of that film, is another quote, the monk finds a stone. on one side is written - ‘How can one prevent a drop of water from ever drying up?’ On the back it says – ‘By throwing it into the sea…’

....but this idea that overcoming desire is 1000 times more valuable than fulfilling desire, is the "correct relative" to quote patrul rinpoche, http://www.lotsawahouse.org/tibetan-mas ... w-mahayana anyone disagree with that?

[dzogchungpa]

Possibly of interest:
http://fakebuddhaquotes.com/it-is-bette ... n-or-hell/

[dzogchungpa]

If it does have any connection to 'Buddhism ' it's of the Hinayana variety.

No one else conflates the arising of Insight with the conquering of stuff.

Check out the word 'jinaputra' when you have a chance.

[明安 Myoan]

Welcome to Contrarian Wheel.

[Schrödinger’s Yidam]

No one else conflates the arising of Insight with the conquering of stuff

Actually I do. I'm not enthusiastic about the verb "conquering", but I do believe the point of practice is to remove obscurations.

Welcome to Contrarian Wheel.

Guilty as charged.

[Simon E.]

The issue isn't the removal of obscurations. The issue is whether we remove obscurations before they arise, by removing the obscurer. Which is not achieved by gritting our teeth.

[kirtu]

dear friends, what human is credited with saying/writing this? I am sure it has been discovered countless times.... but is there a general belief that there was a single recent author? are there cases where this is false?

It is similar to a phrase found in "The Principal Aspects of the Path" by Tsongkhapa with commentary by Pabongka. This was published by Michael Roach (yes that Michael Roach) back in the 70's or early 80's and is based on teachings given by Geshe Wangyal (so the commentary may also have Geshe Wangyal's teaching but this is not specifically indicated in the text).

I no longer have that exact text so cannot look the exact quote up. However the quote should be in the renunciation section of that text and referred to it being better to overcome one negative emotion than to perform a miracle.

Kirt

[kirtu]

The issue isn't the removal of obscurations. The issue is whether we remove obscurations before they arise, by removing the obscurer. Which is not achieved by gritting our teeth.

Which is of course the application from the ultimate perspective and is co-terminal with the Ati/Dzogchen approach. There are eight valid yanas beneath that.

My Sakya lama did say when teaching from the Mahyana perspective that sometimes we just had to grit our teeth in order to overcome negativities.

Kirt

[Taco_Rice]

No one else conflates the arising of Insight with the conquering of stuff

Actually I do. I'm not enthusiastic about the verb "conquering", but I do believe the point of practice is to remove obscurations.

I prefer "master," "subdue," or the more poetic "quell."

Welcome to Contrarian Wheel.

No, it's simply a "Clarification Wheel," IMVHO.

[dzogchungpa]

Welcome to Contrarian Wheel.

No, it's simply a "Clarification Wheel," IMVHO.

I prefer the more poetic "Clarifying Contrarian Wheel".

[muni]

...if you where now some 1000 years after your death what message would you send back to now?

Look how suffering arises. Look how all is passing and when grasping-desiring is freezing object, which is causing repeatedly many pain and harm. Look how all happens in thoughts, there is no beloved one or not beloved one outside of them, there is no pain or pleasure outside of them, there is no samsara or nirvana outside of them. There is no thing outside of them. Look how thoughts are non substantial, or having no owner, are having no existence on their own and are having no any power on their own. Look where they arise-subside, be there and let them arise-subside.
Thoughts are empty. Whatever their stories may be, they have no existence on their own and are therefore as nightly passing dreams.
The all-embracing sky lets clouds free, whatever stories they may contain.

Silence.

May it be of any benefit. _/\_

[Saoshun]

Realizing who is desiring anything is more valuable then conquering 1 desire.

[muni]

When I read the words of realizations and those with the highest faculties and those with less faculties, I think my ego is by the first while this doesn’t help, since I guess, I am smoothly of the lowest even not mentioned. In any case, whatever I think to be, is ego!

By all those elaborations about no elaborations, my mind becomes exhausted to elaborate about all these understandings about no elaborations since it sound all elaborated. Then a master gave a luminous teaching: when you lay in bed, peaceful, no conceptual thinking is there and yet not asleep, there is a peaceful clarity, a simplicity as simple space, not taint by anything.
Even “recognized”, alas it is very quick forgotten, as soon as mind pops up, moves in a direction onto an object, it starts its' grasping activities.

But I guess such teaching is not useful for all of us, and there are many ways, seen as complexities to follow, which are liberating into simplicity of nature and so not entangling like an entanglement of never ending labyrinths running in each other. At least so it looks when my mind keeps elaborating about no elaborations.

[Saoshun]

When I read the words of realizations and those with the highest faculties and those with less faculties, I think my ego is by the first while this doesn’t help, since I guess, I am smoothly of the lowest even not mentioned. In any case, whatever I think to be, is ego!

By all those elaborations about no elaborations, my mind becomes exhausted to elaborate about all these understandings about no elaborations. Then a master gave a luminous teaching: when you lay in bed, peaceful, no conceptual thinking is there and yet not asleep, there is a peaceful clarity, a simplicity as simple space, not taint by anything.
Even “recognized”, alas it is very quick forgotten, as soon as mind pops up, moves in a direction onto an object, it starts its suffering grasping activities.

But I guess such teaching is not useful for all of us, and there are many ways, seen as complexities to follow, which are liberating into simplicity of nature and so not entangling like an entanglement of never ending labyrinths running in each other. At least so it looks when my mind keeps elaborating about no elaborations.

Water will not drop into your mouth if you will not approach it or take it, you do not have a problem to get a glass of water from kitchen if you are thirsty, why do you think even less effort cannot be useful for anybody? You are talking bs here, you bonded yourself too tight and now think that everything/everyone is wrong or you have courage to state what is useful and what is not based on your lack of proper approach.

[muni]

why do you think even less effort cannot be useful for anybody?

There is a wide variety of medicines for the variety of confusion. There is something for all of us. I was reading the text about higher faculties and less. There are many texts so mentioning and for me there are only different medicines as help, appropriate to fade the different confusions.

The given example about peaceful space, not yet sleeping was an example of do not seek it somewhere far away.

Thank you for your compassion for all.

[Saoshun]

There is no different faculties, they only seem to be there. That an idea of faculties, either you are introduced or recognized yourself or not.

[muni]

There is no different faculties, they only seem to be there. That an idea of faculties, either you are introduced or recognized yourself or not.

Seem, yes. It shouldn't be taken literary which then turns into an existing on its' own- one with high faculty and one with less. There is not such. Either recognized or not, I cannot reject that but then effortless compassion shines, which is never exhausted and is as many medicines as long as there is need for.

_/\_

[tomschwarz]

thank you all, insightful

thank you muni:

Look how suffering arises. Look how all is passing and when grasping-desiring is freezing object, which is causing repeatedly many pain and harm. Look how all happens in thoughts, there is no beloved one or not beloved one outside of them, there is no pain or pleasure outside of them, there is no samsara or nirvana outside of them. There is no thing outside of them. Look how thoughts are non substantial, or having no owner, are having no existence on their own and are having no any power on their own. Look where they arise-subside, be there and let them arise-subside.
Thoughts are empty. Whatever their stories may be, they have no existence on their own and are therefore as nightly passing dreams.
The all-embracing sky lets clouds free, whatever stories they may contain.

Silence.

we got this!!!! 3 hours of meditation tonight!!!!