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by Malcolm
Thu Aug 16, 2018 10:37 pm
Forum: East Asian Buddhism
Topic: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?
Replies: 64
Views: 783

Re: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?

Nope, Chang is mistaken. It is very clear that Hua Yen rejects this idea. http://buddhism.org/kr/koan/Robert_Sharf-e.htm Not quite. The article suggests that the Hua-yen view sidesteps the issue in order to remain literally faithful to the Mahaparinirvana. No, they do not sidestep the issue at all....
by Malcolm
Thu Aug 16, 2018 10:27 pm
Forum: East Asian Buddhism
Topic: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?
Replies: 64
Views: 783

Re: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?

Had to step out for a moment... Now, substance. Depends on which Indian Buddhist view we are discussing. There is for example, Karana-hetu, the principle that all phenomena are causes of all other phenomena apart from themselves. This still does not make rocks capable of buddhahood. Nor does it mak...
by Malcolm
Thu Aug 16, 2018 9:07 pm
Forum: East Asian Buddhism
Topic: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?
Replies: 64
Views: 783

Re: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?

The thesis originated with Jizang, one of the seminal masters of the Sanlun/Madhyamika tradition, who originally wrote of it: “Not only sentient beings have buddha-nature; grasses and trees also have buddha-nature” Justifiable perhaps on the basis of the MMK: Whatever is the Tatāgata's nature, that...
by Malcolm
Thu Aug 16, 2018 9:04 pm
Forum: East Asian Buddhism
Topic: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?
Replies: 64
Views: 783

Re: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?

Tell, what is your point in including this throwaway line? Don't be an ass. I am stating that perhaps some of Zhi Yi's arguments, as presented by you, are not as sound as you think they are. That they don't stand up to analysis and criticism as well as his exponents imagine. Bad arguments can't be ...
by Malcolm
Thu Aug 16, 2018 9:03 pm
Forum: East Asian Buddhism
Topic: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?
Replies: 64
Views: 783

Re: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?

Thank you Queequeg for the in depth explanation, very useful. I would emphatically say "cannot be traced to Indian roots" does not equal false. It's derived from an Indian basis via some further philosophical speculation, which is very subtle. No, it is not derived from any Indian basis at all. Als...
by Malcolm
Thu Aug 16, 2018 8:16 pm
Forum: East Asian Buddhism
Topic: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?
Replies: 64
Views: 783

Re: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?

I think I’m only responding to myself but maybe somebody else will bite: Dogen being the most prominent later exegete of this doctrine, isn’t his point not that the insentient HAVE buddha nature, but that they ARE buddha nature? Which I take just to mean that the phenomenal world is implicated in a...
by Malcolm
Thu Aug 16, 2018 6:50 pm
Forum: East Asian Buddhism
Topic: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?
Replies: 64
Views: 783

Re: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?

Maybe, maybe not. there are a lot of renowned Buddhist savants in history who have put forward some pretty bad arguments -- like Sapan's argument that ants lack eyes. Just embarrassing. Tell, what is your point in including this throwaway line? Don't be an ass. I am stating that perhaps some of Zhi...
by Malcolm
Thu Aug 16, 2018 6:29 pm
Forum: East Asian Buddhism
Topic: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?
Replies: 64
Views: 783

Re: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?

What does it really mean to say that rocks have buddhanature? As far as I can tell, not much. It's a pretty meaningless statement. You might as well ask, does Zyklon B have buddhanature? The implications drawn from these different meanings might lead to different ends. I guess that's the whole deba...
by Malcolm
Thu Aug 16, 2018 6:25 pm
Forum: East Asian Buddhism
Topic: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?
Replies: 64
Views: 783

Re: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?

In Tiantai, the full blown mutuality between beings and their environment is brought out in Mohezhikuan. In the Indian view, the world arises from the mind. So, rocks are defined as functions of the mind. In the Tiantai view, the mind is also a function of the rock. Depends on which Indian Buddhist...
by Malcolm
Thu Aug 16, 2018 6:08 pm
Forum: East Asian Buddhism
Topic: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?
Replies: 64
Views: 783

Re: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?

Not so, mutuality is addressed by the container traces in the minds of sentient beings which produce the appearances of all six realms. Since we have these traces, we have mutual appearances of trees, rocks, etc., or river of pus and blood, etc., or hell guardians, etc. This is what I mean. You don...
by Malcolm
Thu Aug 16, 2018 5:37 pm
Forum: Lounge
Topic: Dharma government?
Replies: 60
Views: 577

Re: Dharma government?

Queequeg wrote:
Thu Aug 16, 2018 5:19 pm

The Oculus is, hands down, the greatest architectural achievement in NYC, ever (IMO :)).
I would argue that the great architectural achievement in NYC, ever, is Central Park.
by Malcolm
Thu Aug 16, 2018 5:09 pm
Forum: Lounge
Topic: Dharma government?
Replies: 60
Views: 577

Re: Dharma government?

Since it depends on the munificence of kings, it does not really go very far at all. Yes. This is a problem with it. The values, though, could be drawn out as a political policy. One of the recommendations that struck me when I first read it, and its still a point of fascination to me - He tells th...
by Malcolm
Thu Aug 16, 2018 5:04 pm
Forum: Lounge
Topic: Dharma government?
Replies: 60
Views: 577

Re: Dharma government?

I am advocating the introduction of Buddhist ideas and values into the public sphere and by extension into the political process and government policies. Such as? One of the problems with the secular governments we have now is that they are fundamentally materialist. There are historical reasons fo...
by Malcolm
Thu Aug 16, 2018 4:58 pm
Forum: Lounge
Topic: Dharma government?
Replies: 60
Views: 577

Re: Dharma government?

I was pointing out that there are many moving parts. We don't really know what is going wrong. I tend to think that Islam is not particularly good as a personal or social value system, but that is admittedly an opinion, based on observation and experience. Most of us here are pretty ignorant of Isl...
by Malcolm
Thu Aug 16, 2018 4:54 pm
Forum: Lounge
Topic: Dharma government?
Replies: 60
Views: 577

Re: Dharma government?

That's the point -- it is a Mahāyāna polemical treatise—— not even all Buddhists would go along with it. And under a government implementing the Jeweled Garland they'd have the liberty to disagree and pursue their dharmas. They'd even be encouraged and supported. But I'm not particularly interested...
by Malcolm
Thu Aug 16, 2018 4:51 pm
Forum: East Asian Buddhism
Topic: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?
Replies: 64
Views: 783

Re: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?

I disagree. If you think I did not address your point, you should point out what point I did not address. Be concise. You just stated views you hold. But let's go on. Mutuality, for one. Not so, mutuality is addressed by the container traces in the minds of sentient beings which produce the appeara...
by Malcolm
Thu Aug 16, 2018 4:48 pm
Forum: East Asian Buddhism
Topic: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?
Replies: 64
Views: 783

Re: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?

When the Buddha appeared in India, he had to work with the language and ideas current around him. As the Dharma is transmitted to people of different cultures, its expression changes. The ills of the people are different and so their cures differ. Not really. Everyone suffers from same three afflic...
by Malcolm
Thu Aug 16, 2018 4:24 pm
Forum: Lounge
Topic: Dharma government?
Replies: 60
Views: 577

Re: Dharma government?

Queequeg wrote:
Thu Aug 16, 2018 4:12 pm
Malcolm wrote:
Thu Aug 16, 2018 4:06 pm
The Ratnavali is Mahāyāna polemical text.
I never said it wasn't.
That's the point -- it is a Mahāyāna polemical treatise—— not even all Buddhists would go along with it.
by Malcolm
Thu Aug 16, 2018 4:23 pm
Forum: East Asian Buddhism
Topic: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?
Replies: 64
Views: 783

Re: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?

Are you explaining Tiantai views? East Asian? Take note where you are posting. The question originally was open. The doctrine is strictly East Asian, and finds no basis in Indian Buddhism at all. Specifically, your presentation does not add up, which is why I rebutted it. :smile: You didn't actuall...
by Malcolm
Thu Aug 16, 2018 4:22 pm
Forum: East Asian Buddhism
Topic: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?
Replies: 64
Views: 783

Re: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?

Thank you Queequeg for the in depth explanation, very useful. I would emphatically say "cannot be traced to Indian roots" does not equal false. It's derived from an Indian basis via some further philosophical speculation, which is very subtle. No, it is not derived from any Indian basis at all. Als...

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