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by Malcolm
Sat Aug 18, 2018 7:13 pm
Forum: Dzogchen
Topic: Dzogchen and Zen on enlightenment and post-enlightenment
Replies: 45
Views: 1324

Re: Dzogchen and Zen on enlightenment and post-enlightenment

The qualities of a master upon whom to rely... He must be expert in meditation and practice, know how to explain the four branches of approach and accomplishment, and have produced skills in repelling disturbances with mantras of exhortation, curses, and slaying. -Buddhahood in This Life Yes. A Dzo...
by Malcolm
Sat Aug 18, 2018 5:59 pm
Forum: Dzogchen
Topic: Dzogchen and Zen on enlightenment and post-enlightenment
Replies: 45
Views: 1324

Re: Dzogchen and Zen on enlightenment and post-enlightenment

Crazywisdom wrote:
Sat Aug 18, 2018 4:25 pm
So... buddha’s Four actions? How does primordially liberated “yogi” do?

Activities are effortless
due to the natural perfection of awakening,


-- Kun byed rgyal po.
by Malcolm
Sat Aug 18, 2018 5:20 pm
Forum: East Asian Buddhism
Topic: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?
Replies: 81
Views: 1290

Re: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?

If by suchness, you meant dependent arising, then your statement above implies that both inanimate things and sentient beings are dependently arisen. No problem here. By suchness, I mean emptiness, śūnyatā. The rest of your questions are irrelevant. My questions are irrelevant because sunyata is no...
by Malcolm
Sat Aug 18, 2018 5:00 pm
Forum: East Asian Buddhism
Topic: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?
Replies: 81
Views: 1290

Re: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?

We are emphasizing different things. It is correct to say, "in a way" in the context of Tiantai thought because dependent origination is not the whole story, except, in a way, from a particular vantage point. Like light being particles, absolutely, in a way, but also being waves, absolutely, in a w...
by Malcolm
Sat Aug 18, 2018 4:38 pm
Forum: Lounge
Topic: Two Truths Sauvignon Blanc
Replies: 14
Views: 190

Re: Two Truths Sauvignon Blanc

The real question is -- do you drink it all at once, or gradually.
by Malcolm
Fri Aug 17, 2018 9:15 pm
Forum: Dzogchen
Topic: Dzogchen and Zen on enlightenment and post-enlightenment
Replies: 45
Views: 1324

Re: Dzogchen and Zen on enlightenment and post-enlightenment

Crazywisdom wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 9:12 pm
Malcolm wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 8:52 pm
Temicco wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 12:37 am


What does it come from, then?
Liberation does not come from anywhere. Everything is already liberated, just as it is.
Sure. But defiled beings have to get into some method.
Sure. But that has nothing to do with liberation, from a Dzogchen perspective.
by Malcolm
Fri Aug 17, 2018 8:52 pm
Forum: Dzogchen
Topic: Dzogchen and Zen on enlightenment and post-enlightenment
Replies: 45
Views: 1324

Re: Dzogchen and Zen on enlightenment and post-enlightenment

Temicco wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 12:37 am
Malcolm wrote:
Wed Aug 15, 2018 11:48 pm
Dzogchen is not a sudden school. It argues that liberation does not come from realization.
What does it come from, then?
Liberation does not come from anywhere. Everything is already liberated, just as it is.
by Malcolm
Fri Aug 17, 2018 6:42 pm
Forum: East Asian Buddhism
Topic: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?
Replies: 81
Views: 1290

Re: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?

I'm not familiar with Karana-hetu, but all phenomena are indeed causes of all others, in a way. Not in a way, directly. We are emphasizing different things. It is correct to say, "in a way" in the context of Tiantai thought because dependent origination is not the whole story, except, in a way, fro...
by Malcolm
Fri Aug 17, 2018 3:44 pm
Forum: East Asian Buddhism
Topic: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?
Replies: 81
Views: 1290

Re: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?

PeterC wrote:
Fri Aug 17, 2018 9:27 am
What Chinese writers said on the topic is not relevant to that particular question.
It is only relevant in so far as it was not a universally held principle in Sinitic Buddhism, even though it appears to be very widely diffused among Japanese Sects.
by Malcolm
Fri Aug 17, 2018 2:36 pm
Forum: Lounge
Topic: Dharma government?
Replies: 84
Views: 1066

Re: Dharma government?

Take the U$ for example: 73.3% of the population identifies as Christian and only 18.2% identify as having no religion. The effect of this statistic is that although there is a split between church and state, in reality the U$ functions as a Christian nation. This does not mean they are Christians ...
by Malcolm
Fri Aug 17, 2018 2:31 pm
Forum: East Asian Buddhism
Topic: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?
Replies: 81
Views: 1290

Re: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?

Not quite. The article suggests that the Hua-yen view sidesteps the issue in order to remain literally faithful to the Mahaparinirvana. No, they do not sidestep the issue at all. They make a well known distinction, also made by Indian Buddhists, between the suchness of inanimate things and sentient...
by Malcolm
Thu Aug 16, 2018 10:37 pm
Forum: East Asian Buddhism
Topic: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?
Replies: 81
Views: 1290

Re: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?

Nope, Chang is mistaken. It is very clear that Hua Yen rejects this idea. http://buddhism.org/kr/koan/Robert_Sharf-e.htm Not quite. The article suggests that the Hua-yen view sidesteps the issue in order to remain literally faithful to the Mahaparinirvana. No, they do not sidestep the issue at all....
by Malcolm
Thu Aug 16, 2018 10:27 pm
Forum: East Asian Buddhism
Topic: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?
Replies: 81
Views: 1290

Re: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?

Had to step out for a moment... Now, substance. Depends on which Indian Buddhist view we are discussing. There is for example, Karana-hetu, the principle that all phenomena are causes of all other phenomena apart from themselves. This still does not make rocks capable of buddhahood. Nor does it mak...
by Malcolm
Thu Aug 16, 2018 9:07 pm
Forum: East Asian Buddhism
Topic: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?
Replies: 81
Views: 1290

Re: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?

The thesis originated with Jizang, one of the seminal masters of the Sanlun/Madhyamika tradition, who originally wrote of it: “Not only sentient beings have buddha-nature; grasses and trees also have buddha-nature” Justifiable perhaps on the basis of the MMK: Whatever is the Tatāgata's nature, that...
by Malcolm
Thu Aug 16, 2018 9:04 pm
Forum: East Asian Buddhism
Topic: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?
Replies: 81
Views: 1290

Re: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?

Tell, what is your point in including this throwaway line? Don't be an ass. I am stating that perhaps some of Zhi Yi's arguments, as presented by you, are not as sound as you think they are. That they don't stand up to analysis and criticism as well as his exponents imagine. Bad arguments can't be ...
by Malcolm
Thu Aug 16, 2018 9:03 pm
Forum: East Asian Buddhism
Topic: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?
Replies: 81
Views: 1290

Re: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?

Thank you Queequeg for the in depth explanation, very useful. I would emphatically say "cannot be traced to Indian roots" does not equal false. It's derived from an Indian basis via some further philosophical speculation, which is very subtle. No, it is not derived from any Indian basis at all. Als...
by Malcolm
Thu Aug 16, 2018 8:16 pm
Forum: East Asian Buddhism
Topic: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?
Replies: 81
Views: 1290

Re: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?

I think I’m only responding to myself but maybe somebody else will bite: Dogen being the most prominent later exegete of this doctrine, isn’t his point not that the insentient HAVE buddha nature, but that they ARE buddha nature? Which I take just to mean that the phenomenal world is implicated in a...
by Malcolm
Thu Aug 16, 2018 6:50 pm
Forum: East Asian Buddhism
Topic: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?
Replies: 81
Views: 1290

Re: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?

Maybe, maybe not. there are a lot of renowned Buddhist savants in history who have put forward some pretty bad arguments -- like Sapan's argument that ants lack eyes. Just embarrassing. Tell, what is your point in including this throwaway line? Don't be an ass. I am stating that perhaps some of Zhi...
by Malcolm
Thu Aug 16, 2018 6:29 pm
Forum: East Asian Buddhism
Topic: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?
Replies: 81
Views: 1290

Re: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?

What does it really mean to say that rocks have buddhanature? As far as I can tell, not much. It's a pretty meaningless statement. You might as well ask, does Zyklon B have buddhanature? The implications drawn from these different meanings might lead to different ends. I guess that's the whole deba...
by Malcolm
Thu Aug 16, 2018 6:25 pm
Forum: East Asian Buddhism
Topic: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?
Replies: 81
Views: 1290

Re: Buddhahood of Insentient Beings Exclusively East-Asian?

In Tiantai, the full blown mutuality between beings and their environment is brought out in Mohezhikuan. In the Indian view, the world arises from the mind. So, rocks are defined as functions of the mind. In the Tiantai view, the mind is also a function of the rock. Depends on which Indian Buddhist...

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