Search found 788 matches

by tobes
Fri Feb 21, 2020 4:05 am
Forum: Kagyu
Topic: All or nothing?
Replies: 5
Views: 130

Re: All or nothing?

Sounds strange, but I aspire to this.

If we take 'casual' to mean 'relaxed, natural and trusting your relationship with both sacred and mundane worlds.'

As opposed to: flippant, careless, arrogant and superficial.
by tobes
Tue Feb 18, 2020 3:56 am
Forum: Media
Topic: Buddhism's class "problem"
Replies: 44
Views: 1127

Re: Buddhism's class "problem"

Well tkp67 - evidence is evidence, and that is more than I have to offer! I wonder if it has something to do with competition. Some family have returned from NYC after a year working there, and their impressions of American culture is that deep competition permeates at every level. So maybe those ne...
by tobes
Tue Feb 18, 2020 12:48 am
Forum: Media
Topic: Buddhism's class "problem"
Replies: 44
Views: 1127

Re: Buddhism's class "problem"

PadmaVonSambhava: I take your point on class consciousness. I think what I meant was class identity. i.e. only associating with those of your particular social class; not being able to cut through appearances; seeing others as higher or lower dependent on the car the drive, the clothes they wear etc...
by tobes
Tue Feb 18, 2020 12:44 am
Forum: Media
Topic: Buddhism's class "problem"
Replies: 44
Views: 1127

Re: Buddhism's class "problem"

One of the biggest differentiators today in regards to class and Buddhism has to do suffering. People who are above average in resource including education, wealth and lineage (a minority demographic) do not experience the same suffering as those without. This lack of suffering does not warm people...
by tobes
Mon Feb 17, 2020 3:13 am
Forum: Media
Topic: Buddhism's class "problem"
Replies: 44
Views: 1127

Re: Buddhism's class "problem"

If you or others have the wealth and time to practice Dharma and donate to Dharmic causes: this is something to rejoice in. It's very hard to have the favourable conditions for practice: isn't that why there is danaparamita, mandala practices etc? Most of us need to accumulate more merit. Conversati...
by tobes
Thu Feb 13, 2020 7:26 am
Forum: Kagyu
Topic: Where is ‘Mind’?
Replies: 210
Views: 4615

Re: Where is ‘Mind’?

These statements are leaving you all with very absurd consequences. Let's take for a moment nirvana with remainder. What remains? The rupaskandha (until death). What has ceased? The namaskandhas, and the afflictions which depend upon them. By the logic of Malcom, Smcj, Virgo etc, when one attains n...
by tobes
Thu Feb 13, 2020 5:00 am
Forum: Kagyu
Topic: Where is ‘Mind’?
Replies: 210
Views: 4615

Re: Where is ‘Mind’?

These statements are leaving you all with very absurd consequences. Let's take for a moment nirvana with remainder. What remains? The rupaskandha (until death). What has ceased? The namaskandhas, and the afflictions which depend upon them. By the logic of Malcom, Smcj, Virgo etc, when one attains ni...
by tobes
Thu Feb 13, 2020 1:16 am
Forum: Kagyu
Topic: Where is ‘Mind’?
Replies: 210
Views: 4615

Re: Where is ‘Mind’?

No, I am saying that a cessation is necessarily a nonarising, for example, the shoot of a burnt seed. So you're talking about the nature of cessation itself; but this reifies a process , because cessation cannot be thought of independently from something which abides. i.e it is the end of that thin...
by tobes
Wed Feb 12, 2020 11:08 am
Forum: Kagyu
Topic: Where is ‘Mind’?
Replies: 210
Views: 4615

Re: Where is ‘Mind’?

There isn’t any annihilation, because a cessation necessarily entails that no ceased entity’s nonexistence can be properly described. It’s a contradiction in terms to speak of the nonexistence of something which never existed at all, since it never arose. For example the shoot of a burnt seed. Are ...
by tobes
Wed Feb 12, 2020 4:33 am
Forum: Kagyu
Topic: Where is ‘Mind’?
Replies: 210
Views: 4615

Re: Where is ‘Mind’?

Not annihilation, absolute cessation of the continuum of the aggregates. What else could it be, if there is nothing else apart from the aggregates upon which an a self is imputed. Peter Harvey, in Selfless Persons, argues that an unconditioned consciousness continues, but he is not a classical shra...
by tobes
Wed Feb 12, 2020 2:24 am
Forum: Kagyu
Topic: Where is ‘Mind’?
Replies: 210
Views: 4615

Re: Where is ‘Mind’?

There has been no dispute at all, from my side, about the proposition that Shravaka cessation = absolute cessation of the aggregates. The Shravakayana says that there is nothing other than the aggregates. So when the aggregates stop, what do you suggest continues? Remember the 8th consciousness is ...
by tobes
Wed Feb 12, 2020 1:23 am
Forum: Kagyu
Topic: Where is ‘Mind’?
Replies: 210
Views: 4615

Re: Where is ‘Mind’?

What's in dispute: the claim that there is literally nothing at all from that point; total annihilation, nothingness, non-existence. i.e. you go beyond the 4 jhanas into absolute death. Not annihilation, absolute cessation of the continuum of the aggregates. What else could it be, if there is nothi...
by tobes
Tue Feb 11, 2020 5:33 am
Forum: Kagyu
Topic: Where is ‘Mind’?
Replies: 210
Views: 4615

Re: Where is ‘Mind’?

Hindus have always accused Buddhism of nihilism, even though Buddhist assert that śūnyatā=/=nothingness. Here's a journal article which spells out this accusation in detail - Sunyavada - a Reinterpretation (.pdf), Harsh Narain, Philosophy East and West, Vol. 13, No. 4 (Jan., 1964), pp. 311-338. I d...
by tobes
Tue Feb 11, 2020 5:30 am
Forum: Kagyu
Topic: Where is ‘Mind’?
Replies: 210
Views: 4615

Re: Where is ‘Mind’?

Well yes, of course: the extinction in Theravada is precisely the extinction of the skandhas (including nama and rupa), karma and the duhkha that arises on their basis. I don't think that this has been in dispute at all in this thread. What do you think it is that survives? What remains after the “...
by tobes
Tue Feb 11, 2020 3:50 am
Forum: Kagyu
Topic: Where is ‘Mind’?
Replies: 210
Views: 4615

Re: Where is ‘Mind’?

Additionally, the Theravāda school definitely held that after final cessation, neither mind nor matter ever arise again. This is clear within the commentarial tradition, although I don't have any quotes handy. They argued that this wasn't an extinction at all because there never really was a being ...
by tobes
Tue Feb 11, 2020 2:09 am
Forum: Kagyu
Topic: Where is ‘Mind’?
Replies: 210
Views: 4615

Re: Where is ‘Mind’?

Happy to have a look at this when I have time. In the meantime, I'll note that when I have asked for evidence for which Sravakas themselves assert that they are aiming for total extinction, you provide a Sarvastivadan-Abdhidharmika critique of the Sautantrikas - who themselves reject the Abhidharma....
by tobes
Tue Feb 11, 2020 12:27 am
Forum: Kagyu
Topic: Where is ‘Mind’?
Replies: 210
Views: 4615

Re: Where is ‘Mind’?

I deeply suspect that if there were practicing Sautrantikas around to speak for themselves, none of them would assert that they are aiming for total extinction. Why? Because the idea does not appeal to you? No, because it is totally antithetical to the word of the Buddha, which that school in parti...
by tobes
Mon Feb 10, 2020 11:35 pm
Forum: Kagyu
Topic: Where is ‘Mind’?
Replies: 210
Views: 4615

Re: Where is ‘Mind’?

In which there is also the non-existence of unchanging peace, bliss etc? I suspect not. Otherwise, may as well be a Charvaka and at least enjoy some wine..... Ok, supposing you have Pruden's translation of the Abhidharmakośabhāṣyaṃ , the discussion in the Indriya chapter where the Sarvāstivādins re...
by tobes
Mon Feb 10, 2020 11:23 pm
Forum: Kagyu
Topic: Where is ‘Mind’?
Replies: 210
Views: 4615

Re: Where is ‘Mind’?

This is in the Kagyu forum. The Karma Kagyu has been a Shentong school since Karmapa III. So you’re preaching to the choir about seeing things in positive terms. It’s also a common Karma Kagyu teaching that Arhats are mistaken about Nibbana. The extinction they believe as being Nibbana is really a ...
by tobes
Mon Feb 10, 2020 5:51 am
Forum: Kagyu
Topic: Where is ‘Mind’?
Replies: 210
Views: 4615

Re: Where is ‘Mind’?

This is in the Kagyu forum. The Karma Kagyu has been a Shentong school since Karmapa III. So you’re preaching to the choir about seeing things in positive terms. It’s also a common Karma Kagyu teaching that Arhats are mistaken about Nibbana. The extinction they believe as being Nibbana is really a ...

Go to advanced search