Best translation of Moonbeams of Mahamudra?

Post Reply
Temicco
Posts: 117
Joined: Sat Jul 11, 2015 8:47 am

Best translation of Moonbeams of Mahamudra?

Post by Temicco » Sun Nov 06, 2016 7:42 am

I hope this is the right place to post this. There seem to be a few different translations of Tashi Namgyal's Moonbeams of Mahamudra:

Mahamudra: The Moonlight (trans. Lhalungpa)

Moonbeams of Mahamudra (trans. Kyabgon)

Essentials of Mahamudra (w/ Khenchen Thrangu's commentary)

I might be missing one or two, I'm not sure.

Does anyone have any opinion of the pros/cons of each?

Also, any recommendations for books that talk about the history and/or theory of Mahamudra, and the differences in how it's taught between different schools? I already have "Mind of Mahamudra" and "The Royal Seal of Mahamudra", but these are very practice oriented and I'm looking for something more meta so long as I don't yet have a teacher.
"It is just a matter of never letting there be even a moment's interruption in your awareness of your real nature."
--Yuanwu Keqin

"As long as you let go and entrust with belief, your daily life itself can be meditation."
--Daehaeng Kun Sunim

crazy-man
Posts: 376
Joined: Wed Aug 26, 2015 2:22 pm

Re: Best translation of Moonbeams of Mahamudra?

Post by crazy-man » Sat Nov 19, 2016 1:35 pm


gb9810
Posts: 41
Joined: Mon Jun 27, 2016 12:28 am

Re: Best translation of Moonbeams of Mahamudra?

Post by gb9810 » Mon Oct 30, 2017 5:06 am

I'd wait for this one too, which should be coming out soon

"Mahamudra Compendium: Moonbeams; Dispelling the Darkness of Ignorance by Dakpo Tashi Namgyal and the Ninth Karmapa, Wangchuk Dorje"

http://tsadra-wp.tsadra.org/translators ... -callahan/

passel
Posts: 196
Joined: Sat Sep 29, 2012 5:30 am

Re: Best translation of Moonbeams of Mahamudra?

Post by passel » Tue Oct 31, 2017 7:09 pm

I’d go with the Traleg. It will have benefited from the mistakes of the Lalungpha. It’s what Mingyur’s mahamudra sangha uses
"I have made a heap of all that I have met"- Svetonious

User avatar
anjali
Global Moderator
Posts: 1225
Joined: Sat Sep 10, 2011 10:33 pm

Re: Best translation of Moonbeams of Mahamudra?

Post by anjali » Tue Oct 31, 2017 8:15 pm

passel wrote:
Tue Oct 31, 2017 7:09 pm
I’d go with the Traleg. It will have benefited from the mistakes of the Lalungpha. It’s what Mingyur’s mahamudra sangha uses
Temicco, I have both published versions. If you only buy one version, I would go with the Traleg suggestion as well. I'm sure Callahan's translation will be excellent when it comes out, but it is not out yet, and as far as I know, no publication date has been set.

To give you a bit of flavor for the different translations, here is an extended excerpt from both texts:
Lhalungpha translation wrote:THE REASON WHY MEDITATION ON INSIGHT IS NECESSARY

Seekers of liberation and of all-knowing awareness would do well to meditate on insight—which perceives the nonselfhood of dualism—rather than remain content only with tranquil absorption. Without meditation on insight, tranquility alone cannot bring about liberation from the round of existence, because it can only bring about temporary pacification of inbred defilements and is incapable of eliminating them. The middle Bhavanakrama maintains:
Yogins cannot completely eliminate inner defilements by accomplishing tranquility alone. It temporarily pacifies, but cannot destroy defilements until and unless wisdom [insight] illuminates.
The Arya-sammdhinirmocana-sutra reaffirms:
Concentrative absorption subdues inner defilements whereas wisdom destroys their inbred sediments.
For these reasons those who wish to eliminate all defilements and attain the pure awareness should meditate on wisdom after having perfected settled tranquility. The Samadhraja says:
Even though men of the world meditate on tranquil absorption,
Since this does not destroy consciousness of the self,
Mental defilements will again stir up violently,
As in Udraka's meditation on tranquil absorption.
One determines from every mode the selflessness of all things
And meditates on discerning wisdom.
One will achieve nirvana through this source of fulfillment;
No others will lead to such peace.
People on the mundane level meditate on tranquil absorption, such as the four kinds of concentration, but tranquility by itself cannot destroy clinging to a self, which is the root of cyclic existence. The power of self-delusion causes the root and attendant defilements to arise, which, in turn, lead one to commit harmful deeds and consequently to wander in the lower realms. The analogy for this is to be found in the meditation of such ascetics as Udraka who believed in an external creator. On the other hand, the determination of nonselfhood [in one's psychophysical aggregates] through discerning intellect followed by meditation will result in attaining permanent peace. No other means can completely eliminate misery and defilement.

Traleg translation wrote:WHY INSIGHT MEDITATION IS NECESSARY

You should not be content to practice only tranquillity meditation because that will never result in liberation or enlightenment. You may be able to pacify and control your mental defilements and conflicting emotions through tranquility meditation but you will never cut them off at the root and they will continue to exert an influence over you even when hidden from consciousness. Only insight meditation leads to genuine insight into the absence of an enduring and permanent self. This recognition of selflessness is the only thing that can permanently eradicate your delusion and conflicting emotions and liberate your mind from samsaric existence. The middle Bhavanakrama says:
Yogis pacify their conflicting emotions through the practice of tranquillity meditation but these emotions will not be eradicated through tranquillity alone. Without insight, yogis will remain unaware of their delusions which continue to operate at an uncouscious level.
The Samadhinirmocana Sutra says,
When we establish stability of mind through tranquillity,
Conflicting emotions subside.
When we practise insight meditation,
Conflicting emotions and delusions are completely uprooted.
We should engage in the practice of insight meditation with the intentions of eradicating all of our mental defilements and obscurations. Only insight has the power to cut these defilements at the root and thereby remove them completely. The Samadhraja Sutra says:
This may temporarily pacify their obscruations,
But it will not give rise to insight.
They will fail to perceive their own true nature,
And their obscurations will rise again in due course.
If tranquillity is coupled with insight meditation,
You will come to understand that the nature of self
And the nature of reality are devoid of essence.
Only insight will deliver nirvana.
You might experience all the states of dullness in tranquillity meditation, but these states will not give rise to insight into self. You will never abandon your misconceptions about the self through this type of meditation. As long as you retain that fundamental misconception, all the primary and secondary conflicting emotions will continue to arise and you will wander endlessly in the samsaric condition, propelled this way and that by unresolved delusions. On the other hand, if through insight meditation you can realise the nature of self has no enduring essence, you will be able to free yourselves from your samsaric delusions and as a result you will attain nirvana. There is no other cause for the attainment of nirvana. When we have gained this insight into the inherent selflessness of the self, all the root conflicting emotions are also eradicated.

In my opinion, Traleg's translation plus Khenchen Thrangu Rinpoche's commentary on the text, Looking Directly at the Mind: The moonlight of Mahamudra, is an outstanding combination for study.

User avatar
Lingpupa
Posts: 148
Joined: Tue Jul 05, 2011 10:13 am

Re: Best translation of Moonbeams of Mahamudra?

Post by Lingpupa » Wed Nov 01, 2017 4:32 pm

gb9810 wrote:
Mon Oct 30, 2017 5:06 am
I'd wait for this one too, which should be coming out soon

"Mahamudra Compendium: Moonbeams; Dispelling the Darkness of Ignorance by Dakpo Tashi Namgyal and the Ninth Karmapa, Wangchuk Dorje"

http://tsadra-wp.tsadra.org/translators ... -callahan/
Worth waiting for, I feel sure. Publication is likely to be "about the end of 2018". Patience, guys, patience!
All the best
Alex Wilding
"Kathmandu report" at http://alex-wilding.com/
Blog struggling for rebirth at http://chagchen.org/
Benchen and Back digital edition still on Amazon - see http://tinyurl.com/78rdcoy

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Soma999 and 9 guests