in search of a ethical way to deal with spiders

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mossy
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in search of a ethical way to deal with spiders

Post by mossy »

when it rains the spiders like to find a warm dry place. problem is that warm place happens to be my home. now i don't mind little bugs popping in for a visit, but some of the spiders that drop in for a unexpected visit are dangerous. if one of the unknown visitors were to take a nap in my shoes or blankets, i am in for a trip to the hospital when they are surprised and "defend" themselves. in the past my cat would "take care" of uninvited guests. don't know how she did it without getting bit, but she found a way. now that she is older she is not down for chasing a faster bug all over the house. if she cant get it in a few jumps she gives up walks over to me and begs for petting. so now i am faced with a issue, how do i ethically deal (not killing) with the bigger spiders that find a crack to squeeze into my house? i have done the best i can to seal off the outside from getting in, but nature will alwase find its way in to a nice warm place when it is cold outside. i need a way to remove spiders that is fast,reliable, does not require me to be close to them (don't want to get bites) and most of all does not require me to kill them. :thanks:

Fortyeightvows
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Re: in search of a ethical way to deal with spiders

Post by Fortyeightvows »

I often use a cup and a piece of paper to catch small creatures and put outside. For a while I used to have one cup just for this purpose and a postcard with medicine buddha and mantras on it just for this purpose. Just put the cup over them and then slide the paper underneath. It's a pretty good way to catch them.

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Kim O'Hara
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Re: in search of a ethical way to deal with spiders

Post by Kim O'Hara »

Fortyeightvows wrote:I often use a cup and a piece of paper to catch small creatures and put outside. For a while I used to have one cup just for this purpose and a postcard with medicine buddha and mantras on it just for this purpose. Just put the cup over them and then slide the paper underneath. It's a pretty good way to catch them.
That's my method, too, when I bother to remove them. More generally, wildlife will rarely be a nuisance in the house if there's no food to attract it. With spiders, that means no small insects - flies, moths, etc.
With most spiders I'm happy to live and let live ... I actually like spiders, and I'm not particularly house-proud. :tongue:
I'm in the tropical part of Australia, a country that's well known for its dangerous wildlife. Where do you live, Mossy, that's got more deadly spiders than we have?

:namaste:
Kim

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daverupa
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Re: in search of a ethical way to deal with spiders

Post by daverupa »

Kim O'Hara wrote:Where do you live, Mossy, that's got more deadly spiders than we have?
I was going to ask, as well; I prefer to leave spiders alive since they eat almost everything else that might show up in the apartment.
  • "And how is it, bhikkhus, that by protecting oneself one protects others? By the pursuit, development, and cultivation of the four establishments of mindfulness. It is in such a way that by protecting oneself one protects others.

    "And how is it, bhikkhus, that by protecting others one protects oneself? By patience, harmlessness, goodwill, and sympathy. It is in such a way that by protecting others one protects oneself.

- Sedaka Sutta [SN 47.19]

krodha
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Re: in search of a ethical way to deal with spiders

Post by krodha »

I use one of those orange prescription pill bottles to capture them and release them outside.

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mossy
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Re: in search of a ethical way to deal with spiders

Post by mossy »

Black widows are my main fear. They probably won't be a problem now that i am in this new apartment and dont have to deal with a wood pile though.

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Berry
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Re: in search of a ethical way to deal with spiders

Post by Berry »

I always put a glass jar over the spider, slip some cardboard slowly underneath the neck of the jar and then gently upturn the jar ( still covered at the end with the card) and pop the spider outside. I prefer a jar to anything else because then I can have a closer look at the spider before I free it outside.

If you Google 'non-harming spider catcher' there are various contraptions available, though I haven't tried any of them myself.
Leave the polluted water of conceptual thoughts in its natural clarity. Without affirming or denying appearances, leave them as they are. When there is neither acceptance nor rejection, mind is liberated into mahāmudra.

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Mkoll
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Re: in search of a ethical way to deal with spiders

Post by Mkoll »

The jar and index method works for me too.
Namo tassa bhagavato arahato samma sambuddhassa
Namo tassa bhagavato arahato samma sambuddhassa
Namo tassa bhagavato arahato samma sambuddhassa

SeekerNo1000003
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Re: in search of a ethical way to deal with spiders

Post by SeekerNo1000003 »

I found some information about vacuums that remove insects without killing them
(e.g., http://news.cision.com/procter-pest-sto ... m,c9298890)
....something to check out perhaps.

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Kim O'Hara
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Re: in search of a ethical way to deal with spiders

Post by Kim O'Hara »

By the way, if you have a fast-moving, madly active spider (or insect) in a box and want to slow it down without hurting it, put the box in the fridge for a while. Its metabolic rate drops with temperature and you will be able to handle it more easily. :zzz:

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monktastic
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Re: in search of a ethical way to deal with spiders

Post by monktastic »

Many species of spiders cannot live outside, apparently. Seems too strange to be true, I admit, but it seems to be true anyway:

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-edi ... e-19962187
House spiders that are thrown into the garden by well meaning householders will die from the cold, an expert has warned.
Only relevant if you live in a cold place, like I do right now.
This undistracted state of ordinary mind
Is the meditation.
One will understand it in due course.

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Kim O'Hara
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Re: in search of a ethical way to deal with spiders

Post by Kim O'Hara »

monktastic wrote:Many species of spiders cannot live outside, apparently. Seems too strange to be true, I admit, but it seems to be true anyway:

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-edi ... e-19962187
House spiders that are thrown into the garden by well meaning householders will die from the cold, an expert has warned.
Only relevant if you live in a cold place, like I do right now.
It only seems strange because you're not taking into account the fact that many of our spiders couldn't and wouldn't live in some parts of the world without the (built) environment we provide. We provide nice warm habitats in cold climates, the spiders and their prey species move in, and everyone lives happily ever after. :smile:
No houses = no spiders, or not so many and not so many species.

:namaste:
Kim

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monktastic
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Re: in search of a ethical way to deal with spiders

Post by monktastic »

Well, those spiders must have either evolved from native species, or traveled with us as we colonized new areas. Both seem pretty amazing to me! But then, I am far from being an entomologist. Or arachnologist. Or whatever :smile:

Anyway, my current "solution" is to pretend not to see them. And hope they don't crawl up my nose as I sleep. I'm utterly terrified of spiders.
This undistracted state of ordinary mind
Is the meditation.
One will understand it in due course.

--Gampopa

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Lindama
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Re: in search of a ethical way to deal with spiders

Post by Lindama »

Black Widows don't live inside... if you are concerned, get a Black Widow homeopathic from Hannah Kroeger. I have some, I was very sick. As far as ethics, spiders have no such ethics and they can cause harm. I bring them out if I can or I say thank you very much and squish. Many have given me big lumps in my bed... I sometimes make an agreement about boundaries, otherwise. it's squish or down the drain. Is it ethical to eat a carrot? What is the ethical system that you observe? Is it ethical to take antibiotics?
Not last night,
not this morning,
melon flowers bloomed.
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Kim O'Hara
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Re: in search of a ethical way to deal with spiders

Post by Kim O'Hara »

monktastic wrote:Well, those spiders must have either evolved from native species, or traveled with us as we colonized new areas. Both seem pretty amazing to me! But then, I am far from being an entomologist. Or arachnologist. Or whatever :smile:
Travelled with us, mostly. Just think of the way the rat has travelled all round the world with people, and throw in the thought that spiders can also travel as eggs - almost invisible and not needing food - and you will see how easy it has been for them.
monktastic wrote:Anyway, my current "solution" is to pretend not to see them. And hope they don't crawl up my nose as I sleep. I'm utterly terrified of spiders.
That sounds more like arachnophobia than any realistic caution or fear. Learning more about them is one way to reduce it. One science journalist was so scared of them it was ruining her life (okay, I will admit it, she was an Aussie and we do have lots of spiders) and she cured herself that way, to the point that she is now as arachnophilic as she was arachnophobic. Take a look at her book about it http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/6556220-spiders or her home page (note her spider-themed jewellery :smile: ) http://www.lynnekelly.com.au/Lynne_Kelly/Home.html

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Kim

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treehuggingoctopus
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Re: in search of a ethical way to deal with spiders

Post by treehuggingoctopus »

monktastic wrote:Many species of spiders cannot live outside, apparently. Seems too strange to be true, I admit, but it seems to be true anyway:

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-edi ... e-19962187
House spiders that are thrown into the garden by well meaning householders will die from the cold, an expert has warned.
Only relevant if you live in a cold place, like I do right now.
Argh. A few months ago I read a piece whose author - apparently a biologist - eloquently argued that we should take them outside so that they do not starve... Does it not depend on the species? I am living right now with at the very least four kinds of Tegenaria:

These guys live mostly inside (and they are too small to bother me):
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tegenaria_domestica

These guys are occasionally to be found inside (and then they get transported outside ASAP) but there are dozens of them in the garden, mostly along the walls:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Giant_house_spider
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tegenaria_parietina

These guys live almost solely in the garden:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hobo_spider

Winters here can be freezing... Last year temperature dropped below - 25 C...
To offer care and affection to sentient beings
In desperate situations who lack protection
Brings just as much merit as the meditation
On emptiness with compassion as its core—
So it has been said by glorious Lord Atisha.

Chatral Sangye Dorje Rinpoche

If you cannot generate an altruistic mind, even extensive retreat will be of not much benefit.
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Kim O'Hara
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Re: in search of a ethical way to deal with spiders

Post by Kim O'Hara »

treehuggingoctopus wrote:
monktastic wrote:Many species of spiders cannot live outside, apparently. Seems too strange to be true, I admit, but it seems to be true anyway:

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-edi ... e-19962187
House spiders that are thrown into the garden by well meaning householders will die from the cold, an expert has warned.
Only relevant if you live in a cold place, like I do right now.
Argh. A few months ago I read a piece whose author - apparently a biologist - eloquently argued that we should take them outside so that they do not starve... Does it not depend on the species?
Species and location and season ... and how much food they can find in your house. :tongue:
Most spiders and insects work it out pretty well for themselves, and if they don't then nature takes care of them in the good old Darwinian fashion. It's a good argument for letting them live where they like - unless, of course, they bother you.
I am living right now with at the very least four kinds of Tegenaria:

These guys live mostly inside (and they are too small to bother me):
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tegenaria_domestica

These guys are occasionally to be found inside (and then they get transported outside ASAP) but there are dozens of them in the garden, mostly along the walls:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Giant_house_spider
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tegenaria_parietina

These guys live almost solely in the garden:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hobo_spider

Winters here can be freezing... Last year temperature dropped below - 25 C...
I really don't know how spiders make it through winters like that (we don't even have winters, by those standards) but I think they will find well-insulated spaces under rocks (and houses are just big rocks, right?) or in hollow trees (and houses are just big hollow trees, right?) where the temperature doesn't go so low. And they probably hibernate, anyway ... metabolism dropping to nearly zero.
Or maybe they meditate.
:meditate:

:namaste:
Kim

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Johnny Dangerous
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Re: in search of a ethical way to deal with spiders

Post by Johnny Dangerous »

mossy wrote:when it rains the spiders like to find a warm dry place. problem is that warm place happens to be my home. now i don't mind little bugs popping in for a visit, but some of the spiders that drop in for a unexpected visit are dangerous. if one of the unknown visitors were to take a nap in my shoes or blankets, i am in for a trip to the hospital when they are surprised and "defend" themselves. in the past my cat would "take care" of uninvited guests. don't know how she did it without getting bit, but she found a way. now that she is older she is not down for chasing a faster bug all over the house. if she cant get it in a few jumps she gives up walks over to me and begs for petting. so now i am faced with a issue, how do i ethically deal (not killing) with the bigger spiders that find a crack to squeeze into my house? i have done the best i can to seal off the outside from getting in, but nature will alwase find its way in to a nice warm place when it is cold outside. i need a way to remove spiders that is fast,reliable, does not require me to be close to them (don't want to get bites) and most of all does not require me to kill them. :thanks:

Most spiders are not dangerous, nor are the aggressive. Certainly to make it a trip to the hospital, you'd either need to get bit a black widow, or a brown recluse...if you don't have either of those, there really is not much danger. There is some claim that hobo spiders are dangerous a,d have nercotizing venom, but it seems like that's disputed. If I can't leave them be, then I just put a glass over them, slide paper underneath, and put them outside, I try to do it near the house..as I think these are of the variety (giant house spider - looks scary, evidently not very dangerous, eats other spiders!) that need structures of some sort to live in..that's the best i've figured out. There is almost no way to get bitten doing this, and again, they're much more likely to run from you than they are to attack you.

Honestly from a logical standpoint (rather than a creepiness one) worrying about spiders is nonsensical unless they are right in the middle of what you are doing, spiders don't go around looking for humans and other giant creatures to bite.
"...if you think about how many hours, months and years of your life you've spent looking at things, being fascinated by things that have now passed away, then how wonderful to spend even five minutes looking into the nature of your own mind."

-James Low

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Redfaery
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Re: in search of a ethical way to deal with spiders

Post by Redfaery »

I agree with this. When I was a teenager, my sister and I would often get small house spiders that set up in the nooks and crannies of our room. They did an excellent job of controlling the vinegar ant population - which was a problem, as we were both rather slovenly girls.
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Karma_Yeshe
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Re: in search of a ethical way to deal with spiders

Post by Karma_Yeshe »

We use this tool to catch insects we cannot allow to stay at our home:

http://www.amazon.de/Snapy-10099-Insekt ... ten+snappy

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