Coarse language

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Keith__
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Coarse language

Post by Keith__ » Fri Jan 31, 2020 10:10 pm

Greetings,

All too often I find myself slipping into the use of coarse language. I swear too much, habitually. If anyone has any advice on how I might be able to train myself to improve my language, I'd be very grateful to read it.

With kindness

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Johnny Dangerous
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Re: Coarse language

Post by Johnny Dangerous » Fri Jan 31, 2020 10:26 pm

Keith__ wrote:
Fri Jan 31, 2020 10:10 pm
Greetings,

All too often I find myself slipping into the use of coarse language. I swear too much, habitually. If anyone has any advice on how I might be able to train myself to improve my language, I'd be very grateful to read it.

With kindness
Personally my swearing only bothers me at two points: Where it would negatively impact others - not that common, because I work in substance abuse treatment and everyone is cussing. I don't like doing it around my kids, but they actually get on my case about it. The other one is where it comes from anger.

To me the main issue is the anger, we tend to cuss when we feel frustrated or somehow obstructed, sometimes quite literally (think traffic). So in my experience addressing the root causes of that feeling of obstruction or frustration helps with swearing. So...the first question is, why do you swear?
"...if you think about how many hours, months and years of your life you've spent looking at things, being fascinated by things that have now passed away, then how wonderful to spend even five minutes looking into the nature of your own mind."

-James Low

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justsit
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Re: Coarse language

Post by justsit » Fri Jan 31, 2020 10:52 pm

The use of a swear jar is often very effective. Every time you swear or use whatever you consider foul language, you must take $1 from your wallet and put it in the jar - immediately, no doing it "later."

Adhere very strictly to this method - you will stop swearing very quickly (ask me how I know :tongue:)
You can then donate the money to an organization for those with speech impediments.

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Könchok Thrinley
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Re: Coarse language

Post by Könchok Thrinley » Fri Jan 31, 2020 11:16 pm

I have noticed that when somebody swears it kinda disturbs my mind. It makes me uncomfortable and sometimes bit angry. So I try to limit my swearing based on that.
The best training really is to just not do it... with some level of mindfulness in your life it can be done.
“Observing samaya involves to remain inseparable from the union of wisdom and compassion at all times, to sustain mindfulness, and to put into practice the guru’s instructions”. Garchen Rinpoche

Formerly known as Miroku.

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Re: Coarse language

Post by DharmaN00b » Sat Feb 01, 2020 7:54 pm

As children we deal with sadness differently so "when the wind blows.." let's just say we stub our toe then start crying and go to mum and sit on her lap for a while.

Becoming adults there's often a period of fire, brimstone and martial rage! How often have you cursed an inanimate object? Ok.. you're not allowed to deal with sadness as you did so now your sadness belongs to someone or something else.

How about instead we offer the victory to others? Feelings are your cross to bear. Others can fill their boots. You are not dragged along for the ride.

Malcolm
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Re: Coarse language

Post by Malcolm » Sat Feb 01, 2020 8:31 pm

Oh, I enjoy swearing, swearing is fun. Four letter words are immensely flexible and can convey a whole range of sentiment, positive to negative, other words simply cannot match.

F*%$ yeah!

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Re: Coarse language

Post by Virgo » Sat Feb 01, 2020 9:42 pm

Malcolm wrote:
Sat Feb 01, 2020 8:31 pm
Oh, I enjoy swearing, swearing is fun. Four letter words are immensely flexible and can convey a whole range of sentiment, positive to negative, other words simply cannot match.

F*%$ yeah!
:jumping:

Virgo

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Ayu
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Re: Coarse language

Post by Ayu » Sat Feb 01, 2020 10:54 pm

I'm working on it since years but I still berate people when I drive a car or ride my bicycle. My children told me to stop and I try but it comes out like a tourette syndrome as soon as I feel my life to be threatened by other traffic participants.

It became less though, but maybe only because I drive less in the city. City traffic really stresses me. Death is possible every moment.

Edit: It's too strong negative energy. When I become aware of it I tell myself 'this was not okay' and I stop it at least in that moment.
For the benefit and ease of all sentient beings. :heart:

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Re: Coarse language

Post by Virgo » Sat Feb 01, 2020 11:36 pm

Ayu wrote:
Sat Feb 01, 2020 10:54 pm
I'm working on it since years but I still berate people when I drive a car or ride my bicycle. My children told me to stop and I try but it comes out like a tourette syndrome as soon as I feel my life to be threatened by other traffic participants.
As someone who has Tourette's Syndrome I thought this was pretty funny. However, coprolalia is what your actually referring to, which is when someone who has Tourette's has a verbal tic that makes them blurt out profanities. This only occurs in 10% of people with Tourette Syndrome.

I only bring this up because this is a thread about profanity and this might come up again. I just want to educate people.

Virgo

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明安 Myoan
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Re: Coarse language

Post by 明安 Myoan » Sun Feb 02, 2020 3:53 am

Hello, Keith.

Swearing from anger can be approached through the teachings on patience, such as patience with the faults of samsara and the faults of others, or the Paramita of Patience (ch. 6).
When anger is recognized as such, then calling any Dharma teaching to mind, a buddha name, the Three Jewels, or a mantra is like letting go of a poisonous snake, because you hold on to a wholesome object instead.
The Lojong Slogans are excellent for anger also, because they are short, easy to remember, and they get to the point.

Swearing out of habit can be approached through the gate of speech.
If you habituate your speech to a mantra or buddha's name or koan or verse,
even if you just talk to yourself about some teachings you've read recently,
then the way you talk to others (and to yourself) changes, too.
It's like the old metaphor: if you walk in the fog, your sleeves get wet.
With a heart wandering in ignorance down this path and that, to guide me I simply say Namu-Amida-Butsu. -- Ippen

Reciting the nembutsu and believing in birth in the Pure Land naturally give rise to the Three Minds and the Four Modes of Practice. -- Master Hōnen

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Re: Coarse language

Post by muni » Sun Feb 02, 2020 9:06 am

Oh well, swearing, using colorful words? Could be less harmful than telling the truth. Most wars started by "truths".

However like said to use mantra..., ask for particular practices, can help in so called post-meditation to free us from these habits, which are like sudden waterfalls.

Damned. Don't harm.
Phenomena adorn emptiness, but never corrupt it.

Only if you have developed the love and compassion of relative bodhichitta can absolute bodhichitta – the very essence of the Great Perfection and the Great Seal – ever take birth in your being. Dilgo Khyentse Rinpoche.

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Re: Coarse language

Post by Simon E. » Sun Feb 02, 2020 10:01 am

It really doesn’t f****** matter. The exception is if you are in the company of those who mind it. There is no point in upsetting people gratuitously.
What constitutes “coarse” language is pretty much subjective and cultural.
“The difference between us and Tara is that she knows she doesn’t exist”.

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Re: Coarse language

Post by Ayu » Sun Feb 02, 2020 10:22 am

Virgo wrote:
Sat Feb 01, 2020 11:36 pm
Ayu wrote:
Sat Feb 01, 2020 10:54 pm
I'm working on it since years but I still berate people when I drive a car or ride my bicycle. My children told me to stop and I try but it comes out like a tourette syndrome as soon as I feel my life to be threatened by other traffic participants.
As someone who has Tourette's Syndrome I thought this was pretty funny. However, coprolalia is what your actually referring to, which is when someone who has Tourette's has a verbal tic that makes them blurt out profanities. This only occurs in 10% of people with Tourette Syndrome.

I only bring this up because this is a thread about profanity and this might come up again. I just want to educate people.

Virgo
Thank you for correcting this.
I was just searching for words to discribe it and to transfer German thoughts into English words. _() _

It starts with the thought e. g. the car driver in front of me should lower the lights as we meet on a lonely small road at dark fields. And he doesn't, because he's curious who is there in the night in the middle of nowhere on a bike. Then I can't see anything but I know there is a ditch just besides the road. And suddenly I hear myself shouting "You bloody A*****e!!!" And then once it happened that one of the lights were damaged immediately.

Of course I'm not able to damage cars by cursing but this incident made me aware that it is not okay to use verbal violence even if nobody can hear me. I can hear it.

So, my only tool right now is to become aware of this behavior and try to keep my mouth shut. Maybe this thread can give better advice.

(Edit) Mantra doesn't work yet. I'm always chanting on the bike. This seems additionally odd to me: Chanting - short loud curse - than chanting again. In my estimation this is not the best way to practice.
For the benefit and ease of all sentient beings. :heart:

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Re: Coarse language

Post by pemachophel » Sun Feb 02, 2020 5:24 pm

I don't think we can separate the rampant use of profanity and the ills of uncivil discourse we are currently experiencing in the U.S. Profanity is non-virtuous activity and will have its inevitable karma fruit. It may seem like a joke to some, but I don't think it actually is.

I say this with full recognition and disclosure of my own long-standing habit of profane speech.
Pema Chophel པདྨ་ཆོས་འཕེལ

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Re: Coarse language

Post by Virgo » Sun Feb 02, 2020 5:43 pm

Ayu wrote:
Sun Feb 02, 2020 10:22 am

It starts with the thought e. g. the car driver in front of me should lower the lights as we meet on a lonely small road at dark fields. And he doesn't, because he's curious who is there in the night in the middle of nowhere on a bike. Then I can't see anything but I know there is a ditch just besides the road. And suddenly I hear myself shouting "You bloody A*****e!!!" And then once it happened that one of the lights were damaged immediately.

Of course I'm not able to damage cars by cursing but this incident made me aware that it is not okay to use verbal violence even if nobody can hear me. I can hear it.

So, my only tool right now is to become aware of this behavior and try to keep my mouth shut. Maybe this thread can give better advice.

(Edit) Mantra doesn't work yet. I'm always chanting on the bike. This seems additionally odd to me: Chanting - short loud curse - than chanting again. In my estimation this is not the best way to practice.
I certainly appreciate your frustration, Ayu.

Virgo

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Re: Coarse language

Post by Simon E. » Sun Feb 02, 2020 5:54 pm

pemachophel wrote:
Sun Feb 02, 2020 5:24 pm
I don't think we can separate the rampant use of profanity and the ills of uncivil discourse we are currently experiencing in the U.S. Profanity is non-virtuous activity and will have its inevitable karma fruit. It may seem like a joke to some, but I don't think it actually is.

I say this with full recognition and disclosure of my own long-standing habit of profane speech.
Could you define “ profane” in this context?
“The difference between us and Tara is that she knows she doesn’t exist”.

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Re: Coarse language

Post by Malcolm » Sun Feb 02, 2020 6:16 pm

pemachophel wrote:
Sun Feb 02, 2020 5:24 pm
I don't think we can separate the rampant use of profanity and the ills of uncivil discourse we are currently experiencing in the U.S. Profanity is non-virtuous activity and will have its inevitable karma fruit. It may seem like a joke to some, but I don't think it actually is.

I say this with full recognition and disclosure of my own long-standing habit of profane speech.
There has always been cussing and swearing. I don't think it is worse now then before.

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Re: Coarse language

Post by pemachophel » Sun Feb 02, 2020 8:01 pm

Loppon-la,

I also agree there has always been cursing and cussing, but I think there was a definite up-tick in the use of swear-words with the Baby Boomers, especially in the 60s and 70s. Before us, I think so-called gentlemen and gentlewomen (what a concept!) did not swear so openly and constantly. Definitely men tended not to swear in front of women and most "respectable" women simply didn't swear. I just have to think of my grandmothers, aunts, and my mother to know that swearing was not acceptable behavior. I clearly remember getting in serious trouble when my friend and I (12 years old, 1958) were overheard using the word "screw" on the front porch when we thought no one was around. Yeah, definitely, I do think our speech and behavior have coarsened and I do think that is having its karmic repercussions.
Pema Chophel པདྨ་ཆོས་འཕེལ

Malcolm
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Re: Coarse language

Post by Malcolm » Sun Feb 02, 2020 8:52 pm

pemachophel wrote:
Sun Feb 02, 2020 8:01 pm
Loppon-la,

I also agree there has always been cursing and cussing, but I think there was a definite up-tick in the use of swear-words with the Baby Boomers, especially in the 60s and 70s. Before us, I think so-called gentlemen and gentlewomen (what a concept!) did not swear so openly and constantly. Definitely men tended not to swear in front of women and most "respectable" women simply didn't swear. I just have to think of my grandmothers, aunts, and my mother to know that swearing was not acceptable behavior. I clearly remember getting in serious trouble when my friend and I (12 years old, 1958) were overheard using the word "screw" on the front porch when we thought no one was around. Yeah, definitely, I do think our speech and behavior have coarsened and I do think that is having its karmic repercussions.
This just reflects your upper middle class background. Working class people have always cussed and sworn. These mores came to the fore only when the new middle class Americans began to ape Victorian mores. Before that, there was a lot of cussing and swearing.

Also, I just want to point out that the large majority of our more offensive swear words are normal Anglo-Saxon words that were in regular use in common language prior the Norman invasion, and only became deprecated due to systematic oppression of Anglo-Saxon language by the Normans. So, also, we can understand swearing as a social revolt against our "betters."

For your consideration:

Holy Sh*t: A Brief History of Swearing

Swearing : A Social History of Foul Language, Oaths, and Profanity in English

Simon E.
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Re: Coarse language

Post by Simon E. » Sun Feb 02, 2020 8:54 pm

I was born and raised in a solidly working class family in Southern England. There was a good deal of swearing, mostly good humoured, from both women and men. It was almost like a class signifier. Many of those enthusiastic swearers were actually kindly and good natured and would do a good turn for their neighbours if they could.
Given that karma vipaka is determined by motive and intention I find it difficult to accept that swearing in and of itself is a cause of negative karma vipaka. In English working class communities it has little emotional charge.
“The difference between us and Tara is that she knows she doesn’t exist”.

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