is a home made statue acceptable?

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gingercatni
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is a home made statue acceptable?

Post by gingercatni » Fri May 25, 2018 10:08 pm

Hi everyone,

I have 3 large buddha statues at home and recently I have been wanting to have a female presence on my shrine table. I am only beginning to understand the role kwan yin has and I have decided to add her to my shrine. I don't want a tiny statue as it would look odd next to my very large buddha statues so I've been looking at similar sized kwan yin statues online, very eye watering prices attached to them ranging from $399 to $799 for a 16" figure. So I was thinking about sculpting my own, I'm no artist but I did dabble with sculpting in clay when I was younger. Is it ok to put a homemade image on a shrine table is it disrespectful?

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Virgo
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Re: is a home made statue acceptable?

Post by Virgo » Fri May 25, 2018 10:12 pm

gingercatni wrote:
Fri May 25, 2018 10:08 pm
Hi everyone,

I have 3 large buddha statues at home and recently I have been wanting to have a female presence on my shrine table. I am only beginning to understand the role kwan yin has and I have decided to add her to my shrine. I don't want a tiny statue as it would look odd next to my very large buddha statues so I've been looking at similar sized kwan yin statues online, very eye watering prices attached to them ranging from $399 to $799 for a 16" figure. So I was thinking about sculpting my own, I'm no artist but I did dabble with sculpting in clay when I was younger. Is it ok to put a homemade image on a shrine table is it disrespectful?
Sure it's okay, why wouldn't it be?

Kevin...
ངོ་རང་ཐོག་ཏུ་སྤྲད། །
ཐག་གཅིག་ཐོག་ཏུ་བཅད། །
གདེང་གྲོལ་ཐོག་ཏུ་བཅའ། །

https://www.youtube.com/user/TheYoungTurks/videos
http://caretoclick.com/save-the-rainfor ... orestation
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=otGs4ZMOyq4

gingercatni
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Re: is a home made statue acceptable?

Post by gingercatni » Fri May 25, 2018 10:21 pm

Virgo wrote:
Fri May 25, 2018 10:12 pm
gingercatni wrote:
Fri May 25, 2018 10:08 pm
Hi everyone,

I have 3 large buddha statues at home and recently I have been wanting to have a female presence on my shrine table. I am only beginning to understand the role kwan yin has and I have decided to add her to my shrine. I don't want a tiny statue as it would look odd next to my very large buddha statues so I've been looking at similar sized kwan yin statues online, very eye watering prices attached to them ranging from $399 to $799 for a 16" figure. So I was thinking about sculpting my own, I'm no artist but I did dabble with sculpting in clay when I was younger. Is it ok to put a homemade image on a shrine table is it disrespectful?
Sure it's okay, why wouldn't it be?

Kevin...
I thought they had to be produced in a certai way, my buddhas have seals at the bottom of them. When I finally get round to making kwan yin I'll post some pictures!:)

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Virgo
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Re: is a home made statue acceptable?

Post by Virgo » Fri May 25, 2018 10:48 pm

gingercatni wrote:
Fri May 25, 2018 10:21 pm

I thought they had to be produced in a certai way, my buddhas have seals at the bottom of them. When I finally get round to making kwan yin I'll post some pictures!:)
There are certain traditional standards, but that is more because art was taught in more of a scientific and very specific and technical way in certain Eastern traditions, more so than it was in Western traditions. It is really not necessary to worry about all the proportions being exactly correct and so on. The Buddhas certainly will not be offended. Of course, they wouldn't mind if you did it the other way either. :twothumbsup:

We would love to see pics. :smile:

Kevin...
ངོ་རང་ཐོག་ཏུ་སྤྲད། །
ཐག་གཅིག་ཐོག་ཏུ་བཅད། །
གདེང་གྲོལ་ཐོག་ཏུ་བཅའ། །

https://www.youtube.com/user/TheYoungTurks/videos
http://caretoclick.com/save-the-rainfor ... orestation
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=otGs4ZMOyq4

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Ayu
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Re: is a home made statue acceptable?

Post by Ayu » Fri May 25, 2018 11:21 pm

The Lamrim teachings say: firstly, Buddha statues cannot be judged by outward appearance. Every statue is worth the due respect.
And secondly, it is a very meritious deed to make a statue or paint a picture of a Buddha or a diety.
I have decided to stick with love.
Hate is too great a burden to bear.
- Martin Luther King, Jr. -

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javier.espinoza.t
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Re: is a home made statue acceptable?

Post by javier.espinoza.t » Mon May 28, 2018 4:37 pm

Ayu wrote:
Fri May 25, 2018 11:21 pm
The Lamrim teachings say: firstly, Buddha statues cannot be judged by outward appearance. Every statue is worth the due respect.
And secondly, it is a very meritious deed to make a statue or paint a picture of a Buddha or a diety.
I agree, it is far much significant, meritorious.

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Malcolm
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Re: is a home made statue acceptable?

Post by Malcolm » Mon May 28, 2018 5:09 pm

In general, this is s bad idea.

gingercatni wrote:
Fri May 25, 2018 10:08 pm
Hi everyone,

I have 3 large buddha statues at home and recently I have been wanting to have a female presence on my shrine table. I am only beginning to understand the role kwan yin has and I have decided to add her to my shrine. I don't want a tiny statue as it would look odd next to my very large buddha statues so I've been looking at similar sized kwan yin statues online, very eye watering prices attached to them ranging from $399 to $799 for a 16" figure. So I was thinking about sculpting my own, I'm no artist but I did dabble with sculpting in clay when I was younger. Is it ok to put a homemade image on a shrine table is it disrespectful?
Buddhahood in This Life
འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


[A]nything at all that is well spoken is the word of the Buddha.

-- Ārya-adhyāśaya-sañcodana-nāma-mahāyāna-sūtra

The different sūtras in accord with the emptiness
taught by the Sugata are definitive in meaning;
One can understand that all of those Dharmas in
which a sentient being, individual, or person are taught are provisional in meaning.

-- Samadhirāja Sūtra

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Malcolm
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Re: is a home made statue acceptable?

Post by Malcolm » Mon May 28, 2018 5:10 pm

Ayu wrote:
Fri May 25, 2018 11:21 pm
The Lamrim teachings say: firstly, Buddha statues cannot be judged by outward appearance. Every statue is worth the due respect.
And secondly, it is a very meritious deed to make a statue or paint a picture of a Buddha or a diety.
It is very demeritorious to make images of the Buddha, etc., that do not correspond to the proper proportions.
Buddhahood in This Life
འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


[A]nything at all that is well spoken is the word of the Buddha.

-- Ārya-adhyāśaya-sañcodana-nāma-mahāyāna-sūtra

The different sūtras in accord with the emptiness
taught by the Sugata are definitive in meaning;
One can understand that all of those Dharmas in
which a sentient being, individual, or person are taught are provisional in meaning.

-- Samadhirāja Sūtra

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Mantrik
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Re: is a home made statue acceptable?

Post by Mantrik » Mon May 28, 2018 5:26 pm

gingercatni wrote:
Fri May 25, 2018 10:08 pm
Hi everyone,

I have 3 large buddha statues at home and recently I have been wanting to have a female presence on my shrine table. I am only beginning to understand the role kwan yin has and I have decided to add her to my shrine. I don't want a tiny statue as it would look odd next to my very large buddha statues so I've been looking at similar sized kwan yin statues online, very eye watering prices attached to them ranging from $399 to $799 for a 16" figure. So I was thinking about sculpting my own, I'm no artist but I did dabble with sculpting in clay when I was younger. Is it ok to put a homemade image on a shrine table is it disrespectful?
I have occasionally bought large bronze statues from Chinese sellers on Ebay. Not only were they incredibly cheap, they actually arrived and were good quality.
But they are just lumps of metal until properly filled etc. and this would be true with a home made one I guess. A local dharma centre would probably fill the statue for a small donation.
http://www.khyung.com

Micchāmi Dukkaḍaṃ (मिच्छामि दुक्कडम्)

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Virgo
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Re: is a home made statue acceptable?

Post by Virgo » Mon May 28, 2018 6:34 pm

gingercatni wrote:
Fri May 25, 2018 10:08 pm
Hi everyone,

I have 3 large buddha statues at home and recently I have been wanting to have a female presence on my shrine table. I am only beginning to understand the role kwan yin has and I have decided to add her to my shrine. I don't want a tiny statue as it would look odd next to my very large buddha statues so I've been looking at similar sized kwan yin statues online, very eye watering prices attached to them ranging from $399 to $799 for a 16" figure. So I was thinking about sculpting my own, I'm no artist but I did dabble with sculpting in clay when I was younger. Is it ok to put a homemade image on a shrine table is it disrespectful?
Hi Ginger, I apologize for giving you bad information. I would recommend following Malcolm's advice, as he is a learned and respected teacher. His advice is always very good.

Thank you,

Kevin...
ངོ་རང་ཐོག་ཏུ་སྤྲད། །
ཐག་གཅིག་ཐོག་ཏུ་བཅད། །
གདེང་གྲོལ་ཐོག་ཏུ་བཅའ། །

https://www.youtube.com/user/TheYoungTurks/videos
http://caretoclick.com/save-the-rainfor ... orestation
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=otGs4ZMOyq4

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Mantrik
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Re: is a home made statue acceptable?

Post by Mantrik » Mon May 28, 2018 6:50 pm

Malcolm wrote:
Mon May 28, 2018 5:10 pm
Ayu wrote:
Fri May 25, 2018 11:21 pm
The Lamrim teachings say: firstly, Buddha statues cannot be judged by outward appearance. Every statue is worth the due respect.
And secondly, it is a very meritious deed to make a statue or paint a picture of a Buddha or a diety.
It is very demeritorious to make images of the Buddha, etc., that do not correspond to the proper proportions.
As gingercatni is a Theravada Buddhist on a bit of a quest to find if Pure Land would be fruitful, would Tibetan statue proportions, fillings etc. be the only meritorious ones to follow, or are those of other traditions acceptable?

Kwan Yin offers quite a range of statuary considered proper in different traditions.
http://www.khyung.com

Micchāmi Dukkaḍaṃ (मिच्छामि दुक्कडम्)

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Ayu
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Re: is a home made statue acceptable?

Post by Ayu » Tue May 29, 2018 3:57 pm

Malcolm wrote:
Mon May 28, 2018 5:10 pm
Ayu wrote:
Fri May 25, 2018 11:21 pm
The Lamrim teachings say: firstly, Buddha statues cannot be judged by outward appearance. Every statue is worth the due respect.
And secondly, it is a very meritious deed to make a statue or paint a picture of a Buddha or a diety.
It is very demeritorious to make images of the Buddha, etc., that do not correspond to the proper proportions.
I was told differently. Do you have any quote? What are you talking about exactly?
:popcorn:
I have decided to stick with love.
Hate is too great a burden to bear.
- Martin Luther King, Jr. -

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liuzg150181
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Re: is a home made statue acceptable?

Post by liuzg150181 » Wed May 30, 2018 2:30 am

Ayu wrote:
Tue May 29, 2018 3:57 pm
Malcolm wrote:
Mon May 28, 2018 5:10 pm
Ayu wrote:
Fri May 25, 2018 11:21 pm
The Lamrim teachings say: firstly, Buddha statues cannot be judged by outward appearance. Every statue is worth the due respect.
And secondly, it is a very meritious deed to make a statue or paint a picture of a Buddha or a diety.
It is very demeritorious to make images of the Buddha, etc., that do not correspond to the proper proportions.
I was told differently. Do you have any quote? What are you talking about exactly?
:popcorn:
I remember there is a sutra with regards to this matter.

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Ayu
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Re: is a home made statue acceptable?

Post by Ayu » Wed May 30, 2018 8:17 am

liuzg150181 wrote:
Wed May 30, 2018 2:30 am
Ayu wrote:
Tue May 29, 2018 3:57 pm
Malcolm wrote:
Mon May 28, 2018 5:10 pm


It is very demeritorious to make images of the Buddha, etc., that do not correspond to the proper proportions.
I was told differently. Do you have any quote? What are you talking about exactly?
:popcorn:
I remember there is a sutra with regards to this matter.
It's most easy to find prove about the merits of making statues. Here you go:
”The Benefits of Making Statues” : http://www.lamayeshe.com/article/benefi ... ng-statues

"The most powerful merit one can accumulate, and accumulate so easily, is in relation to holy objects of Buddha. By making statues of Buddha and making offerings to statues of Buddha, one accumulates infinite, inconceivable merit that immediately becomes a cause of enlightenment."
I have decided to stick with love.
Hate is too great a burden to bear.
- Martin Luther King, Jr. -

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liuzg150181
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Re: is a home made statue acceptable?

Post by liuzg150181 » Wed May 30, 2018 8:42 am

Ayu wrote:
Wed May 30, 2018 8:17 am
liuzg150181 wrote:
Wed May 30, 2018 2:30 am
Ayu wrote:
Tue May 29, 2018 3:57 pm

I was told differently. Do you have any quote? What are you talking about exactly?
:popcorn:
I remember there is a sutra with regards to this matter.
It's most easy to find prove about the merits of making statues. Here you go:
”The Benefits of Making Statues” : http://www.lamayeshe.com/article/benefi ... ng-statues

"The most powerful merit one can accumulate, and accumulate so easily, is in relation to holy objects of Buddha. By making statues of Buddha and making offerings to statues of Buddha, one accumulates infinite, inconceivable merit that immediately becomes a cause of enlightenment."
The sutra I had in mind mentioned the protocols as to how to make buddha statues.

Sādhaka
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Re: is a home made statue acceptable?

Post by Sādhaka » Wed May 30, 2018 8:47 am

.
Last edited by Sādhaka on Wed May 30, 2018 9:24 am, edited 1 time in total.
“...we should try to acquire clairvoyance. Without it, we are like a baby bird whose wings are undeveloped and has not yet grown feathers and remains stuck in its nest, unable to fly. Without clairvoyance, we cannot work for other sentient beings.” — Khunu Lama
“Just as a bird can not fly without both wings,
The welfare of others cannot be accomplished without the higher faculties of perception,
So diligently strive for your own wellbeing, whilst mentally considering the welfare of others.” — Longchenpa

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Mantrik
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Re: is a home made statue acceptable?

Post by Mantrik » Wed May 30, 2018 9:18 am

Whist all this advice may be wonderful, I fear it is irrelevant because the OP is a Theravada practitioner flirting with Pure Land and NOT A VAJRAYANA practitioner, according to their previous posts.
Last edited by Mantrik on Wed May 30, 2018 9:57 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Micchāmi Dukkaḍaṃ (मिच्छामि दुक्कडम्)

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liuzg150181
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Re: is a home made statue acceptable?

Post by liuzg150181 » Wed May 30, 2018 9:21 am

Sādhaka wrote:
Wed May 30, 2018 8:47 am
liuzg150181 wrote:
Wed May 30, 2018 8:42 am
Ayu wrote:
Wed May 30, 2018 8:17 am

It's most easy to find prove about the merits of making statues. Here you go:
”The Benefits of Making Statues” : http://www.lamayeshe.com/article/benefi ... ng-statues

"The most powerful merit one can accumulate, and accumulate so easily, is in relation to holy objects of Buddha. By making statues of Buddha and making offerings to statues of Buddha, one accumulates infinite, inconceivable merit that immediately becomes a cause of enlightenment."
The sutra I had in mind mentioned the protocols as to how to make buddha statues.

That would be useful to study.

What Malcolm wrote above is right.

Making Buddha statues without these instructions, would be like people “making Mandalas” of their own whim which Namkhai Norbu Rinpoche mentions sometimes.
Found it,but only the Chinese title 佛说造像量度经:
http://www.fjfoxiang.com/fo-zhao-xiang/1544.html

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Ayu
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Re: is a home made statue acceptable?

Post by Ayu » Wed May 30, 2018 12:15 pm

So, it depends on which tradition we are talking about.
In Vajrayana, making statues is a wonderful thing. Tsatsa making is even a practice.

And it sounds rather like a joke, if Buddhists have statues everywhere, but those who made them are doomed? I fail to understand the intention of this teaching that forbids making statues. Sounds rather absurd to me. But I can't judge it, because I can't read Chinese.
I have decided to stick with love.
Hate is too great a burden to bear.
- Martin Luther King, Jr. -

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liuzg150181
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Re: is a home made statue acceptable?

Post by liuzg150181 » Wed May 30, 2018 4:01 pm

Ayu wrote:
Wed May 30, 2018 12:15 pm
So, it depends on which tradition we are talking about.
In Vajrayana, making statues is a wonderful thing. Tsatsa making is even a practice.

And it sounds rather like a joke, if Buddhists have statues everywhere, but those who made them are doomed? I fail to understand the intention of this teaching that forbids making statues. Sounds rather absurd to me. But I can't judge it, because I can't read Chinese.
The Chinese articles merely states the standard by which buddha statues should be created, not that one would go to lower realm for not adhering to the standard. Treat it more like ISO9002 instead of penal law.
Otherwise, what do we make of this?
Image

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