proof of nirvana?

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Ayu
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Re: proof of nirvana?

Post by Ayu » Sat Apr 13, 2019 3:19 pm

Supramundane wrote:
Mon Jan 14, 2019 7:24 am
A friend of mine naively asked me the other day, "is there any proof of Nirvana? can you show it to me?"

Before i tell you how i answered, i am curious to know your answers.
Can we prove the existence of Nirvana, either through logic or sutras?

it is a fair question after all.




Btw, I answered in the affirmative:)
I think it is a deluded sentiment to think everything can be proven scientifically. There are countless things we assume without any scientific proof. Just think of the philosophy of human science... Nothing is proven there, but one philosopher quotes the former colleagues and like this a whole complicated science is being built up. :smile:
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Supramundane
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Re: proof of nirvana?

Post by Supramundane » Sun Apr 14, 2019 6:15 am

Caoimhghín wrote:
Fri Apr 12, 2019 4:00 pm
Supramundane wrote:
Fri Apr 12, 2019 6:05 am
Caoimhghín wrote:
Thu Apr 11, 2019 6:04 am
Nirvāṇa isn't really a "verb," it's a noun derived from a past participle of a verb (√vā, to blow --> vāna, blown) with a prefix added to the front (nis/nir, out).

Nirvāṇa, the "out-blown," or the "extinguished."
ah very true.
i should have said, "Nibutti", which i believe is the verb i was looking for.
It's rather difficult to find but I think the Sanskrit corresponding to that Pāli is nivṛtti.
Very useful, thank u

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Supramundane
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Re: proof of nirvana?

Post by Supramundane » Mon Apr 15, 2019 3:55 am

Ayu wrote:
Sat Apr 13, 2019 3:19 pm
Supramundane wrote:
Mon Jan 14, 2019 7:24 am
A friend of mine naively asked me the other day, "is there any proof of Nirvana? can you show it to me?"

Before i tell you how i answered, i am curious to know your answers.
Can we prove the existence of Nirvana, either through logic or sutras?

it is a fair question after all.




Btw, I answered in the affirmative:)
I think it is a deluded sentiment to think everything can be proven scientifically. There are countless things we assume without any scientific proof. Just think of the philosophy of human science... Nothing is proven there, but one philosopher quotes the former colleagues and like this a whole complicated science is being built up. :smile:
Hi Ayu

I think we are all familiar of the metaphor of the self as a wave in the ocean; meaning that the wave has no instrinsic existence: it is but a transcient formation of certain aggregates. But when the wave is gone, when the aggregates are gone ---there is still something there--- that something is Nirvana.

After the extinguishing of the senses, what remains is Nirvana. The Buddha refused idealism; he refused nihilism. It is exactly in the Middle Way, that something else that Nirvana resides.

I agree with you that the only meaningful ‘proof’ is direct experience...

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Supramundane
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Re: proof of nirvana?

Post by Supramundane » Wed Apr 24, 2019 2:22 am

Stop the presses: maybe i have (reverse) proof of Nirvana:

What if we accept that the Self is the opposite of Nirvana; that we reach Nirvana by comprehending the illusory nature of self, that it is mere illusion and the root cause of misery by clinging to this delusion.

If we posit them as being diametrically opposed, then if we can disprove the existence of Self then we can prove Nirvana.

and any good Buddhist worth his salt can disprove the integrity of the Self or the concept of a True Self.

have i discovered a 'negative proof' of Nirvana?

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