Supreme Efforts in Mahayana/Vajrayana

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Misty
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Supreme Efforts in Mahayana/Vajrayana

Post by Misty » Mon Oct 22, 2018 10:50 pm

Supreme Efforts in Mahayana/Vajrayana

From a Nature of Mind point of view, is the arising of a karmically unwholesome thought not an issue?
As long as its nature is recognized simultaneously with the arising unwholesome thought therefor the thought gains no footing, no effort is made to sustain the karmically unwholesome thought, then no problem? the thought is no longer karmically charged?

Grateful for all guidance and clarification,
Misty

Sentient Light
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Re: Supreme Efforts in Mahayana/Vajrayana

Post by Sentient Light » Wed Oct 24, 2018 6:30 pm

Asanga's Abhidharma-samuccaya goes into this quite a bit, as does Vasubandhu's A Mahayana Demonstration of Action/Karma (I forget the Sanskrit name).

To put it simply: "no" problem is going a little too far, as even the arising of an unwholesome thought has karmically potent results, even if it is not followed through. The arising itself occurs due to conditioned phenomena -- previous actions conditioning the mind's inclinations -- so it is itself indicative of karmic afflictions that we should work on. However, allowing it to drop away upon arising, through attentive mindfulness, is the result of great training in the dharma, is indicative of great wholesome karma, and may be taken as evidence of making progress. The ability to be aware of an unwholesome thought's arising, and then to have the insight and discipline to let it go, should be an encouragement to continue practice and accumulating karmic merit such that the conditions leading to the arising of unwholesome thoughts have all been brought to cessation themselves.
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Crazywisdom
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Re: Supreme Efforts in Mahayana/Vajrayana

Post by Crazywisdom » Wed Oct 24, 2018 6:37 pm

In Vajrayana thoughts arise within the dharmadhatu so seeing that’s like reflections renders them powerless.
Vajra fangs deliver vajra venom to your Mara body.

Misty
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Re: Supreme Efforts in Mahayana/Vajrayana

Post by Misty » Thu Oct 25, 2018 4:31 am

Thank you

Seeker12
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Re: Supreme Efforts in Mahayana/Vajrayana

Post by Seeker12 » Thu Oct 25, 2018 4:37 pm

Therein is nothing to remove
And thereto not the slightest thing to add.
The perfect truth viewed perfectly
And perfectly beheld is liberation.

Uttaratantra Shastra

Misty
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Re: Supreme Efforts in Mahayana/Vajrayana

Post by Misty » Thu Oct 25, 2018 10:35 pm

Thank you for this wise guidance.

Misty
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Re: Supreme Efforts in Mahayana/Vajrayana

Post by Misty » Sat Oct 27, 2018 8:06 pm

Is skillful and unskillful possibly more suitable than wholesome and unwholesome? or is it situational?

Possibly, 'skillful' being thoughts and actions, infused with wisdom and compassion (for self and others), that develop what the Buddha taught and unskillful being that which lacks wisdom and/or compassion and moves us away from developing what the Buddha taught.

For example, having a child facing the challenges of extensive medical needs and procedures, there is a very real possibility serious complications. Acknowledging this as a possible outcome is skillful but worrying about it would be unskillful. For this worrying, unwholesome doesn't feel right somehow. It feels like it implies a subtle judgment of character. Skillful and unskillful feels more like a measuring of capacity to be present in a beneficial way with this challenging situation.

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LastLegend
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Re: Supreme Efforts in Mahayana/Vajrayana

Post by LastLegend » Mon Dec 03, 2018 5:03 pm

The issue isn’t arising the issue is discriminating intention.
None discriminating nature.

Misty
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Re: Supreme Efforts in Mahayana/Vajrayana

Post by Misty » Mon Jan 21, 2019 6:38 pm

recollecting intention, thank you LastLegend

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javier.espinoza.t
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Re: Supreme Efforts in Mahayana/Vajrayana

Post by javier.espinoza.t » Mon Jan 28, 2019 4:23 pm

Misty wrote:
Mon Oct 22, 2018 10:50 pm
Supreme Efforts in Mahayana/Vajrayana

From a Nature of Mind point of view, is the arising of a karmically unwholesome thought not an issue?
As long as its nature is recognized simultaneously with the arising unwholesome thought therefor the thought gains no footing, no effort is made to sustain the karmically unwholesome thought, then no problem? the thought is no longer karmically charged?

Grateful for all guidance and clarification,
Misty
If you involve in conceptuality then it is an issue. Much words aren't usefull here :c long explanations makes things harder to understand.
"Don't profess a view you haven't realized!
Since the view is devoid of viewing, mind essence is an expanse of great emptiness.
Since the meditation is without meditating, leave your individual experience free from fixation.
Since the conduct is without acting, it is unfabricated naturalness.
Since the fruition is without abandoning or achieving, it is the dharmakaya of great bliss.
These four sentences are words from my heart:
Contradict them and you fail to discover the nature of Ati Yoga."


Guru Padmasambhava.
From "Advice from the Lotus-Born".

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Vasana
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Re: Supreme Efforts in Mahayana/Vajrayana

Post by Vasana » Mon Jan 28, 2019 6:25 pm

^ I agree but Sometimes knowing the tibetan words can help narrow things down or at least serve as a means to check you're moving in the right direction.

The distinction is whether a thought arises as sherab or namtog, loosely translated as insight or thought.

"The expression moving as sherab is liberated. The expression moving as namtog is confused.
" - Tulku Urgyen Rinpoche
'When alone, watch your mind. When with others, watch your speech'- Old Kadampa saying.

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javier.espinoza.t
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Re: Supreme Efforts in Mahayana/Vajrayana

Post by javier.espinoza.t » Mon Jan 28, 2019 9:42 pm

Vasana wrote:
Mon Jan 28, 2019 6:25 pm
^ I agree but Sometimes knowing the tibetan words can help narrow things down or at least serve as a means to check you're moving in the right direction.

The distinction is whether a thought arises as sherab or namtog, loosely translated as insight or thought.

"The expression moving as sherab is liberated. The expression moving as namtog is confused.
" - Tulku Urgyen Rinpoche
true. we see teachers makes things easier :)
"Don't profess a view you haven't realized!
Since the view is devoid of viewing, mind essence is an expanse of great emptiness.
Since the meditation is without meditating, leave your individual experience free from fixation.
Since the conduct is without acting, it is unfabricated naturalness.
Since the fruition is without abandoning or achieving, it is the dharmakaya of great bliss.
These four sentences are words from my heart:
Contradict them and you fail to discover the nature of Ati Yoga."


Guru Padmasambhava.
From "Advice from the Lotus-Born".

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