Josei Toda

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ananda
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Josei Toda

Post by ananda » Mon Mar 06, 2017 11:57 pm

I created this thread because I wanted to know more about Josei Toda. From what I have gathered so far the man was a mystic who tried to bring spirituality to the masses in a way compatible with working life. Like shortening gongyo and telling them to chant to get things. I remember reading a tidbit of his Lectures on the Sutra on the internet and how he mentioned chanting for a Cadillac or something along those lines. Before I probably thought to myself , well geez that's pretty materialistic! But then I thought about his target audience who were everyday people and now I feel like hmm actually maybe that was a good expedient means to help draw people towards spirituality. Then perhaps after chanting for material stuff and feeling discontent with things they'd chant for abstract qualities like courage or the power to love oneself.

Anyways to know more I'd probably have to read the Human Revolution books but I was hoping that maybe there's more outside of that. Any insights and commentary on the man would be appreciated! I could pore through his Lectures on the Sutra but I felt like this would be a quicker and a more interesting way to get answers. In addition to understand more about the man I'd like to know more about his insights on life.
"Suffer what there is to suffer, enjoy what there is to enjoy. Regard both suffering and joy as facts of life, and continue chanting Namu-myoho-renge-kyo. no matter what happens. How could this be anything other than the boundless joy of the Law? Strengthen your power of faith more than ever." - Nichiren Daishonin

narhwal90
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Re: Josei Toda

Post by narhwal90 » Tue Mar 07, 2017 12:57 am

Its an interesting question- I would also be interested in outside perspectives. The Human Revolution and related SGI pubs are fine as such but are the "official" perspective and only a part of the story. I hope the polemics can be avoided...

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gohonzon
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Re: Josei Toda

Post by gohonzon » Tue Mar 07, 2017 5:17 am

http://www.JoseiToda.org by Soka Gakkai :twothumbsup:
The Dai-Gohonzon of the High Sanctuary of the Essential Teachings is Legally owned & cared for exclusively by the Nichiren Shoshu Orthodox Temple Priesthood. — vowed Temple members are called "Hokkeko". :applause:

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Queequeg
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Re: Josei Toda

Post by Queequeg » Tue Mar 07, 2017 5:07 pm

ananda wrote:I created this thread because I wanted to know more about Josei Toda. From what I have gathered so far the man was a mystic who tried to bring spirituality to the masses in a way compatible with working life. Like shortening gongyo and telling them to chant to get things. I remember reading a tidbit of his Lectures on the Sutra on the internet and how he mentioned chanting for a Cadillac or something along those lines. Before I probably thought to myself , well geez that's pretty materialistic! But then I thought about his target audience who were everyday people and now I feel like hmm actually maybe that was a good expedient means to help draw people towards spirituality. Then perhaps after chanting for material stuff and feeling discontent with things they'd chant for abstract qualities like courage or the power to love oneself.

Anyways to know more I'd probably have to read the Human Revolution books but I was hoping that maybe there's more outside of that. Any insights and commentary on the man would be appreciated! I could pore through his Lectures on the Sutra but I felt like this would be a quicker and a more interesting way to get answers. In addition to understand more about the man I'd like to know more about his insights on life.
Given that he's long dead, reading his lectures is probably the closest you can get to him, particularly his insights on life. If you can meet people who knew him and learned from him directly, that might give you some insight, but those people are disappearing, too. Anything else, including Human Revolution, is certainly an abstraction.

I would not call the guy a mystic. I think calling him a mystic demeans the path of Buddhism and makes him into an "other", something outside and beyond ourselves. What he did was utterly ordinary, and I would argue that is where his greatness is to be found. As Nichiren remarked, "The purpose of the appearance in this world of Shakyamuni Buddha, the lord of teachings, lies in his behavior as a human being." And that is the same for all Hokke Gyoja (Practitioners of the Lotus Sutra).

Nichiren often emphasized the consequences of being willfully ignorant of the Sublime Dharma; this approach was appropriate for the time and place. Toda elected to emphasize the reward of taking refuge in the Sublime Dharma. In particular, he nominally emphasized the material rewards for a Japanese population trying to rebuild life from the rubble of total war; they had just lived through hell and there was no need to tell them about the consequences of following false teachings. That said, Toda was hardly limited to teaching material gain.

If you go and read his lectures, you'll find he emphasized much more profound teachings. The promise of a Cadillac was for people preoccupied with having nothing. His actual teaching had to do with the awakening he had in prison. It was not a "mystic" experience. Its an experience open to anyone who earnestly and devotedly follows the path of NMRK.

If you're going to read the Human Revolution, I recommend getting a hold of the original versions.
“Once you have given up the ghost, everything follows with dead certainty, even in the midst of chaos.”
-Henry Miller

"Language is the liquid that we're all dissolved in.
Great for solving problems, after it creates the problems."
-Modest Mouse

"Wake up to find out that you are the eyes of the world!"
-The Grateful Dead

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Re: Josei Toda

Post by JazzIsTvRicky » Sat Sep 09, 2017 1:06 am

This is Mr. Toda's finest works on Nichiren's Teachings

http://www.geocities.ws/chris_holte/Bud ... l#contents

There are numerous accounts of Toda's words in Buddhism in Action Vol 1-7

A Great Man and Mystical indeed! His vision was unusual and profoundly motivating.

His Greatest Achievement was the compilation of Nichiren Daishonin's Gosho Zenshu which is now being translated Worldwide in many different languages.
A فوتاري أوف ذي غوهونزون أوف نام ميوهو رينج كيو

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Minobu
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Re: Josei Toda

Post by Minobu » Fri Sep 29, 2017 7:07 am

for me he was a man of principal and went to prison for his beliefs...
not your ordinary fellow.

after the war he was a tremendous help to hundred of thousands of people , and he helped them onto the platform of Lotus Buddhism for ever.
I guess he did not know about what we know today about stuff like the dai gohonzon and the eternal buddha...but his times were different and pressing life and death matters were dealt with...prosperity ensued and people's faith grew...

really a marvel and a True Bodhisattva accomplished his mission.
loved by all..served the priesthood of his sect.

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Minobu
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Re: Josei Toda

Post by Minobu » Fri Sep 29, 2017 7:10 am

JazzIsTvRicky wrote:
Sat Sep 09, 2017 1:06 am

His Greatest Achievement was the compilation of Nichiren Daishonin's Gosho Zenshu which is now being translated Worldwide in many different languages.
i guess he did not know about the fake ones and other fake news.

I bet if he did it would never have got to first base..he had integrity and guts.

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Re: Josei Toda

Post by JazzIsTvRicky » Fri Sep 29, 2017 5:40 pm

Minobu wrote:
Fri Sep 29, 2017 7:10 am
JazzIsTvRicky wrote:
Sat Sep 09, 2017 1:06 am

His Greatest Achievement was the compilation of Nichiren Daishonin's Gosho Zenshu which is now being translated Worldwide in many different languages.
i guess he did not know about the fake ones and other fake news.

I bet if he did it would never have got to first base..he had integrity and guts.
Once again you come ‘Without Sutra in Hand’ or any proof of your accusations of ‘Fake ones’!

Prove to us which of Nichiren’s Teachings which are recognized by Nichiren Shoshu are Fake!

I am asking you to provide documents and actual evidence of your declaration!

Provide the almost 12000 who are interested and deeply studying The Debate on Gongyo as Practiced by Nichiren Buddhism Sects proof of your unsubstantiated statements concerning The Gosho Zenshu and The Writings of Nichiren Daishonin which are available online and in bookstores!

Nothing you offer is backed by any substantial evidence other than your own personal views! :shrug:
Sincerely
A فوتاري أوف ذي غوهونزون أوف نام ميوهو رينج كيو

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Minobu
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Re: Josei Toda

Post by Minobu » Fri Sep 29, 2017 5:49 pm

JazzIsTvRicky wrote:
Fri Sep 29, 2017 5:40 pm
Minobu wrote:
Fri Sep 29, 2017 7:10 am
JazzIsTvRicky wrote:
Sat Sep 09, 2017 1:06 am

His Greatest Achievement was the compilation of Nichiren Daishonin's Gosho Zenshu which is now being translated Worldwide in many different languages.
i guess he did not know about the fake ones and other fake news.

I bet if he did it would never have got to first base..he had integrity and guts.
Once again you come ‘Without Sutra in Hand’ or any proof of your accusations of ‘Fake ones’!

Prove to us which of Nichiren’s Teachings which are recognized by Nichiren Shoshu are Fake!

I am asking you to provide documents and actual evidence of your declaration!

Provide the almost 12000 who are interested and deeply studying The Debate on Gongyo as Practiced by Nichiren Buddhism Sects proof of your unsubstantiated statements concerning The Gosho Zenshu and The Writings of Nichiren Daishonin which are available online and in bookstores!

Nothing you offer is backed by any substantial evidence other than your own personal views! :shrug:
Sincerely
well i will ask you this then..
are all gosho published by Gakki proven to be authentic?
Is the Dai gohonzon really everything it is claimed to be.
did Gakki change their mind on either of these questions.
Do you believe in the whole Buddha of Kuon Ganjo thing ?

answer those in your own words before dictating that you know everything and are 100% correct.

Gakki views changed dude...edicts are now fake. they no longer teach the high priset of Nichiren shoShu is a treasure or that the dai gohonzon is a secret law.

so how much of this have you changed in your thinking and view.

what did you believe to be true and now fake?

all are watching for a non politician style answer from you.

cheers

JazzIsTvRicky
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Re: Josei Toda

Post by JazzIsTvRicky » Fri Sep 29, 2017 6:11 pm

Minobu wrote:
Fri Sep 29, 2017 5:49 pm
JazzIsTvRicky wrote:
Fri Sep 29, 2017 5:40 pm
Minobu wrote:
Fri Sep 29, 2017 7:10 am

i guess he did not know about the fake ones and other fake news.

I bet if he did it would never have got to first base..he had integrity and guts.
Once again you come ‘Without Sutra in Hand’ or any proof of your accusations of ‘Fake ones’!

Prove to us which of Nichiren’s Teachings which are recognized by Nichiren Shoshu are Fake!

I am asking you to provide documents and actual evidence of your declaration!

Provide the almost 12000 who are interested and deeply studying The Debate on Gongyo as Practiced by Nichiren Buddhism Sects proof of your unsubstantiated statements concerning The Gosho Zenshu and The Writings of Nichiren Daishonin which are available online and in bookstores!

Nothing you offer is backed by any substantial evidence other than your own personal views! :shrug:
Sincerely
well i will ask you this then..
are all gosho published by Gakki proven to be authentic?
Is the Dai gohonzon really everything it is claimed to be.
did Gakki change their mind on either of these questions.
Do you believe in the whole Buddha of Kuon Ganjo thing ?

answer those in your own words before dictating that you know everything and are 100% correct.

Gakki views changed dude...edicts are now fake. they no longer teach the high priset of Nichiren shoShu is a treasure or that the dai gohonzon is a secret law.

so how much of this have you changed in your thinking and view.

what did you believe to be true and now fake?

all are watching for a non politician style answer from you.

cheers
Prove your accusations and declaration My Friend! :shrug:

Nothing you offer is backed by any substantial evidence other than your own personal views! :tantrum:
Sincerely
A فوتاري أوف ذي غوهونزون أوف نام ميوهو رينج كيو

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Minobu
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Re: Josei Toda

Post by Minobu » Fri Sep 29, 2017 6:38 pm

JazzIsTvRicky wrote:
Fri Sep 29, 2017 6:11 pm
Minobu wrote:
Fri Sep 29, 2017 5:49 pm
JazzIsTvRicky wrote:
Fri Sep 29, 2017 5:40 pm


Once again you come ‘Without Sutra in Hand’ or any proof of your accusations of ‘Fake ones’!

Prove to us which of Nichiren’s Teachings which are recognized by Nichiren Shoshu are Fake!

I am asking you to provide documents and actual evidence of your declaration!

Provide the almost 12000 who are interested and deeply studying The Debate on Gongyo as Practiced by Nichiren Buddhism Sects proof of your unsubstantiated statements concerning The Gosho Zenshu and The Writings of Nichiren Daishonin which are available online and in bookstores!

Nothing you offer is backed by any substantial evidence other than your own personal views! :shrug:
Sincerely
well i will ask you this then..
are all gosho published by Gakki proven to be authentic?
Is the Dai gohonzon really everything it is claimed to be.
did Gakki change their mind on either of these questions.
Do you believe in the whole Buddha of Kuon Ganjo thing ?

answer those in your own words before dictating that you know everything and are 100% correct.

Gakki views changed dude...edicts are now fake. they no longer teach the high priset of Nichiren shoShu is a treasure or that the dai gohonzon is a secret law.

so how much of this have you changed in your thinking and view.

what did you believe to be true and now fake?

all are watching for a non politician style answer from you.

cheers
Prove your accusations and declaration My Friend! :shrug:

Nothing you offer is backed by any substantial evidence other than your own personal views! :tantrum:
Sincerely
they are not accusations...they are historic fact that you cannot deny...
Toda did not know at the time .
The gakki had to disregard certain Shoshu fake teachings.
you believed in those at one time...now you don't

you deflect from others inquiries and repudiate your self at every posting.

once you repudiate your own being you are in trouble.
big time..
seek the truth and it will set you free
drop the fanatical copy paste nothing posting and stop repudiating your very person.

Bois de Santal
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Re: Josei Toda

Post by Bois de Santal » Fri Sep 29, 2017 8:54 pm

JazzIsTvRicky wrote:
Fri Sep 29, 2017 5:40 pm

Provide the almost 12000 who are interested and deeply studying The Debate on Gongyo as Practiced by Nichiren Buddhism Sects proof of your unsubstantiated statements concerning The Gosho Zenshu and The Writings of Nichiren Daishonin which are available online and in bookstores!
Just as a point of perspective - 12,000 people are neither interested in nor studying the 'The Debate on Gongyo as Practiced by Nichiren Buddhism Sects ' thread.

There have been around 11,600 accumulated page views of around 250 messages. I don't know the implementation details, but 11,600 divided by 250 gives us around 46 people, assuming each person read each message just once. My guess is that the number that have read each posting is much, much less, but the total number that have eyeballed the thread at least once will be greater. I think it would be generous to say that the thread is being followed by even a hundred people.

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Ayu
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Re: Josei Toda

Post by Ayu » Sun Oct 01, 2017 7:46 am

I removed some posts containing personal attacks and the responses to them.
I have decided to stick with love.
Hate is too great a burden to bear.
- Martin Luther King, Jr. -

JazzIsTvRicky
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Re: Josei Toda

Post by JazzIsTvRicky » Wed Oct 11, 2017 10:32 pm

Bois de Santal wrote:
Fri Sep 29, 2017 8:54 pm
JazzIsTvRicky wrote:
Fri Sep 29, 2017 5:40 pm

Provide the almost 12000 who are interested and deeply studying The Debate on Gongyo as Practiced by Nichiren Buddhism Sects proof of your unsubstantiated statements concerning The Gosho Zenshu and The Writings of Nichiren Daishonin which are available online and in bookstores!
Just as a point of perspective - 12,000 people are neither interested in nor studying the 'The Debate on Gongyo as Practiced by Nichiren Buddhism Sects ' thread.

There have been around 11,600 accumulated page views of around 250 messages. I don't know the implementation details, but 11,600 divided by 250 gives us around 46 people, assuming each person read each message just once. My guess is that the number that have read each posting is much, much less, but the total number that have eyeballed the thread at least once will be greater. I think it would be generous to say that the thread is being followed by even a hundred people.
I am so happy you broke this down scientifically and that so many people are now learning Nichiren’s True Teachings by studying Gongyo as Practiced by Nichiren Buddhism Sects which Mr. Josei Toda Lectures On profusely!

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A فوتاري أوف ذي غوهونزون أوف نام ميوهو رينج كيو

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