Dharma Wheel Heavy Weights

Casual conversation between friends. Anything goes (almost).
Motova
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Re: Dharma Wheel Heavy Weights

Post by Motova » Thu Nov 23, 2017 7:53 pm

Just because Malcolm is cool and accessible doesn't mean one should be a gomer.

Personally, I'm interested in what languages Loppon knows, what his favourite non-Buddhist books are, and what he has memorized.

I bet he has read 1000+ books.
Malcolm wrote:
Fri Jan 24, 2014 3:58 pm
The four means of converting beings to the Dharma are generosity (which itself as four aspects: giving material gifts, conferring fearlessness, loving kindness and teaching Dharma), pleasant speech, conduct and setting an example.

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Malcolm
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Re: Dharma Wheel Heavy Weights

Post by Malcolm » Thu Nov 23, 2017 9:14 pm

Motova wrote:
Thu Nov 23, 2017 7:53 pm
Just because Malcolm is cool and accessible doesn't mean one should be a gomer.

Personally, I'm interested in what languages Loppon knows, what his favourite non-Buddhist books are, and what he has memorized.

I bet he has read 1000+ books.
Just Tibetan and English, smattering of Sanskrit.

I used to read alot of Scifi, but these days I find that boring. I don't read much since I am busy working all day.
Buddhahood in This Life
འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


[A]nything at all that is well spoken is the word of the Buddha.

-- Ārya-adhyāśaya-sañcodana-nāma-mahāyāna-sūtra

The different sūtras in accord with the emptiness
taught by the Sugata are definitive in meaning;
One can understand that all of those Dharmas in
which a sentient being, individual, or person are taught are provisional in meaning.

-- Samadhirāja Sūtra

Motova
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Re: Dharma Wheel Heavy Weights

Post by Motova » Fri Nov 24, 2017 12:34 am

Malcolm wrote:
Thu Nov 23, 2017 9:14 pm
Motova wrote:
Thu Nov 23, 2017 7:53 pm
Just because Malcolm is cool and accessible doesn't mean one should be a gomer.

Personally, I'm interested in what languages Loppon knows, what his favourite non-Buddhist books are, and what he has memorized.

I bet he has read 1000+ books.
Just Tibetan and English, smattering of Sanskrit.

I used to read alot of Scifi, but these days I find that boring. I don't read much since I am busy working all day.
Did Star Wars play any role in your interest in the Dharma?
Malcolm wrote:
Fri Jan 24, 2014 3:58 pm
The four means of converting beings to the Dharma are generosity (which itself as four aspects: giving material gifts, conferring fearlessness, loving kindness and teaching Dharma), pleasant speech, conduct and setting an example.

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Coëmgenu
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Re: Dharma Wheel Heavy Weights

Post by Coëmgenu » Fri Nov 24, 2017 2:12 pm

CedarTree wrote:
Sun Nov 19, 2017 9:37 pm
*Meaning what are you doing, studying, practicing, and how do you see your life and practice as well as others and others practices*
I've already outed myself as someone not qualified to be giving advice as a "heavyweight" or authority of any sort here.

That being said, if I could return back to your OP, CedarTree, what I would say is this:

I came into Buddhism through atheism, of a particularly Dawkinsian "New" variety, but before that, I was raised in a Methodist household. Christians don't have moments where they start going into a Christian "practice" and ending a Christian "practice". Christianity is holistic and effects every waking moment of a Christian's life. I don't see Buddhism as any different, and I'm sure that no one here treats "practice" like an on/off switch of something you "do" and then "don't do". That being said, its interesting that Buddhists generally, on these forums at least, speak of practice in such a way. The highest dimension to Buddhism, in my unqualified opinion, is the realization and fruition of profound practice in the constant waking daily life of the practitioner. I am unlikely to be alone in this. I see "practice" as every thought, every word, every interaction, and every contemplation. Every mindset and every mind-moment.

That being said, it is also something of a brutal criterion under which to judge one's self, but I think it is also a realistic criterion. What did I do after doing "Buddhist stuff"? That is what I look for when reviewing myself. As such, how good I am as a practitioner is very much how good I am as a human being. Sometimes quite good, IMO, sometimes quite bad and not proud of myself at all.

On terms of things I try to do "daily" to stay engaged, I observe a practice that is actually modelled after my Anglican boyfriend's practice, who is much more pious and generally a better human being than me, though that is not related to his piousness directly necessarily. Anglican's pray a set of rotating prayers called the Daily Office. Inspired by my boyfriend's observation of this office (also called the 'Liturgy of the Hours'), I took to incorporating some of the morning service into a parallel morning activity for myself to supplement my visitation to the nearby Dharma Centre I attend a few towns over. "Proper" or "advanced" meditation (i.e. "Buddhist" meditation that goes beyond basic smṛtyupasthāna/establishment of mindfulness via breath, basic stuff, etc.) is not something that I have actually incorporated into my practice at all as of yet. I have significant personal reservations about engaging in what I perceive to be advanced Buddhist meditation.

Meditation aside, I do not consider this morning activity of mine "Buddhist practice", as no Buddhist teacher has ever suggested to me that I start doing this, it's simply "what I do", based on what some other people "do". I suppose that is what practice is, though, what one "does".

I adapted the sequence from the morning service, like I mentioned earlier.

Currently I do:

1) Incense gāthā
2) Śūraṅgama dhāraṇī (this one is more of a challenge to myself than something I actually chant in it's fulness every day. I would like to have it eventually memorized. As such, I only use what I have memorized currently, which is the firstmost section, which then leads directly into 3) instead of the other dhāraṇī.)
3) Heart Sūtra

That is clipping off the middle and end of the proper monastic observance of the morning service, which includes numerous other sections. Maybe if some day I find myself having fully memorized and more-or-less "used to" the above, I may add more or change it up, but if I can at least do the 3 up there, then at the very least, I did "something". That being said, the Śūraṅgama dhāraṇī is rather massive, and I have set myself quite the task to memorize it, given that short-term memory and long-term memorization have always been my most horrible skills.
世尊在靈山會上拈華示眾眾皆默然唯迦葉破顏微笑世尊云
The Lord dwelt at the Vulture Peak with the assembly and plucked a flower as a teaching. The myriad totality were silent, save for Kāśyapa, whose face cracked in a faint smile. The Lord spoke.

吾有正法眼藏涅槃妙心實相無相微妙法門不立文字教外別傳付囑摩訶迦葉。
I have the treasure of the true dharma eye, I have nirvāṇa as wondrous citta, I know signless dharmatā, the subtle dharma-gate, which is not standing on written word, which is external to scriptures, which is a special dispensation, which is entrusted to Mahākāśyapa.

Motova
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Re: Dharma Wheel Heavy Weights

Post by Motova » Fri Nov 24, 2017 3:44 pm

Coëmgenu wrote:
Fri Nov 24, 2017 2:12 pm
That being said, the Śūraṅgama dhāraṇī is rather massive, and I have set myself quite the task to memorize it, given that short-term memory and long-term memorization have always been my most horrible skills.
You should research mnemonics.
Malcolm wrote:
Fri Jan 24, 2014 3:58 pm
The four means of converting beings to the Dharma are generosity (which itself as four aspects: giving material gifts, conferring fearlessness, loving kindness and teaching Dharma), pleasant speech, conduct and setting an example.

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CedarTree
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Re: Dharma Wheel Heavy Weights

Post by CedarTree » Fri Nov 24, 2017 5:54 pm

Astus wrote:
Thu Nov 23, 2017 6:07 pm
CedarTree wrote:
Thu Nov 23, 2017 5:24 pm
Only one thing you mentioned was unclear to me and I would like you to explore it a bit. "This bamboo is long, that one is short". I have an idea but I rather you show me your understanding and the origin of this teaching.
Master Yunmen quoted Dharma teacher [Seng] Zhao’s words:
"All individual entities (dharmas) are without difference — [yet] one must not stretch the duck’s [legs] and shorten the crane’s, level the peaks and fill up the valleys, and then think that they are not different!"

(Record of Yunmen, p 193, tr App)

"Within and without (the cosmos) is calm. Co-operation has ceased.
Thus, restoring the union, the Sage withdraws into silence.
Therefore a sutra says: 'Dharma do not differ (from each other)'. Does it tell us 'to stretch the legs of the duck and cut short those of the crane', to pull down the mountains and fill up the valleys in order to smooth out life? If only you can understand that the diverse is of the relative order then it loses its diversity. Therefore a Sutra says: 'Marvellous, World-honoured One, taking your stand in oneness you say that the dharma vary'. It also says: 'Prajna and the dharma are neither one nor two'. This we may believe."

(Chao Lun, ch 3, p 79, tr Liebenthal)

"He who holds to True Rightness does not lose the original form of his inborn nature. So for him, joined things are not webbed toes; things forking off are not superfluous fingers; the long is never too much; the short is never too little. 9 The duck’s legs are short, but to stretch them out would worry him; the crane’s legs are long, but to cut them down would make him sad. What is long by nature needs no cutting off; what is short by nature needs no stretching. That would be no way to get rid of worry."
(Zhuangzi, ch 8, p 61, tr Watson)
Thanks for sharing, been reading the old Chan cases and strangely enough this one hasn't been present and all types of obscure ones have been listed. :)

Practice, Practice, Practice

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Drenpa
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Re: Dharma Wheel Heavy Weights

Post by Drenpa » Wed Feb 21, 2018 10:47 pm

Astus wrote:
Wed Nov 22, 2017 8:49 am
CedarTree wrote:
Sun Nov 19, 2017 9:37 pm
Tell us about your practice history, what were some big stand out things that you think happened or insights or things you learned or experienced and so forth that helped bring you to where you are now.


I can mention some generic titles, but I'm not at the point of working on my autobiography.

- Nanquan's cat & satipatthana
- Nothing is still something
- One mind and no mind
- This bamboo is long, that one is short
- The mind cannot be found
- Karma is thoughts
And where are you now? *Meaning what are you doing, studying, practicing, and how do you see your life and practice as well as others and others practices*
This week I began to read The Great Commentary by Vimalamitra.
I saw this old thread and wanted to ask you Astus - Have you commented here on DW at greater length about the insights gained from these stories/koans? I'm very interested in the way oral fragments are passed along in Zen and other traditions, and the way they can act as touchstones (or at times, hand grenades for the mind) for those of later generations who come across them.

If you or anyone cares to point to a thread I'd really like to check it out. I did some searching, but with DW's more prolific posters it's not so easy to always pinpoint things.

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Astus
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Re: Dharma Wheel Heavy Weights

Post by Astus » Thu Feb 22, 2018 11:18 am

Drenpa wrote:
Wed Feb 21, 2018 10:47 pm
Have you commented here on DW at greater length about the insights gained from these stories/koans?
No, I have not. But if there is a koan you want to discuss with others, why not open a topic for that in the Zen section?
1 Myriad dharmas are only mind.
Mind is unobtainable.
What is there to seek?

2 If the Buddha-Nature is seen,
there will be no seeing of a nature in any thing.

3 Neither cultivation nor seated meditation —
this is the pure Chan of Tathagata.

4 With sudden enlightenment to Tathagata Chan,
the six paramitas and myriad means
are complete within that essence.


1 Huangbo, T2012Ap381c1 2 Nirvana Sutra, T374p521b3; tr. Yamamoto 3 Mazu, X1321p3b23; tr. J. Jia 4 Yongjia, T2014p395c14; tr. from "The Sword of Wisdom"

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fuki
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Re: Dharma Wheel Heavy Weights

Post by fuki » Thu Feb 22, 2018 11:21 am

People (including me) would appreciate your input on zen1.space too Astus.
meldpunt seksueel misbruik in boeddhistische gemeenschappen nederland.
https://meldpuntbg.nl/

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catmoon
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Re: Dharma Wheel Heavy Weights

Post by catmoon » Fri Feb 23, 2018 12:55 pm

I couldn't help but notice the title of this thread refers not to heavyweights but rather to heavy weights. :rolling:
Sergeant Schultz knew everything there was to know.

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Mantrik
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Re: Dharma Wheel Heavy Weights

Post by Mantrik » Fri Feb 23, 2018 3:09 pm

catmoon wrote:
Fri Feb 23, 2018 12:55 pm
I couldn't help but notice the title of this thread refers not to heavyweights but rather to heavy weights. :rolling:
Yes. Personally I can lift over 100Kg - every time I stand up!
http://www.khyung.com

Micchāmi Dukkaḍaṃ (मिच्छामि दुक्कडम्)

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catmoon
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Re: Dharma Wheel Heavy Weights

Post by catmoon » Sat Feb 24, 2018 4:12 am

Mantrik wrote:
Fri Feb 23, 2018 3:09 pm
catmoon wrote:
Fri Feb 23, 2018 12:55 pm
I couldn't help but notice the title of this thread refers not to heavyweights but rather to heavy weights. :rolling:
Yes. Personally I can lift over 100Kg - every time I stand up!
That's nothing. I lift a whole planet every time I stand up. It's all about your frame of reference you see.
Sergeant Schultz knew everything there was to know.

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Mantrik
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Re: Dharma Wheel Heavy Weights

Post by Mantrik » Sat Feb 24, 2018 10:07 am

catmoon wrote:
Sat Feb 24, 2018 4:12 am
Mantrik wrote:
Fri Feb 23, 2018 3:09 pm
catmoon wrote:
Fri Feb 23, 2018 12:55 pm
I couldn't help but notice the title of this thread refers not to heavyweights but rather to heavy weights. :rolling:
Yes. Personally I can lift over 100Kg - every time I stand up!
That's nothing. I lift a whole planet every time I stand up. It's all about your frame of reference you see.
Indeed, it is very impressive to lift Uranus. :)

Isn't the whole idea of 'heavyweights' on a forum divisive and dualistic? It's as if somebody thought it might be useful to identify people who are worth asking about Dharma, thereby implying that there may be people on the forum who talk bollocks. Heaven forfend!
http://www.khyung.com

Micchāmi Dukkaḍaṃ (मिच्छामि दुक्कडम्)

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Drenpa
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Re: Dharma Wheel Heavy Weights

Post by Drenpa » Wed Mar 14, 2018 3:42 am

Astus wrote:
Thu Feb 22, 2018 11:18 am
Drenpa wrote:
Wed Feb 21, 2018 10:47 pm
Have you commented here on DW at greater length about the insights gained from these stories/koans?
No, I have not. But if there is a koan you want to discuss with others, why not open a topic for that in the Zen section?
Sorry Astus, even though you used the quote function, I rely on but missed the alert (if there was one) that you'd replied and just saw this now as I happened to think of it and check.

I suppose I could do as you suggest, but I feel a little shy as I know absolutely nothing about Zen at all, outside of a few stories and koans I've heard, other than an experience as a young man meeting a modern-day hermit/mystic who for whatever reason made a real impression on me.

My interest stems mostly from that encounter, so maybe I'll take you up on your suggestion. Thanks.

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