Big messages to deplorables ???

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Rick
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Re: Big messages to deplorables ???

Post by Rick » Wed Jun 27, 2018 7:26 pm

Here's something I wonder about quite a lot:

Do (some, most) pro-Trumpers feel morally/ethically justified in supporting Trumpocracy? Do they feel, like most liberals do, that they are trying to do the RIGHT thing for the country and world? Do liberals appear to them as blatantly immoral/unethical/against-the-spirit-of-America as they do to liberals?

Or ... is it more like: Trumpistos (Trump, Republicans, supporters) recognize they are in effect scamming the system, that they got into power by a fluke and that any/all means of holding onto this power is the goal, and that the opinions/actions they support are self-serving and divisive rather than for the greater good and unity of the country and world?

I guess it boils down to: What % of Trumpistos are striving to do the right thing, promote the greater good, heal all involved ... and what % are passionately and blindly defending, tooth and nail, what they consider to be THEIR hard-won political/social territory?

What % are "We're America, bitch!"ers?
Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily ...

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Karma Dondrup Tashi
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Re: Big messages to deplorables ???

Post by Karma Dondrup Tashi » Fri Jul 06, 2018 9:58 pm

Grigoris wrote:
Mon Jun 25, 2018 8:48 pm
It is not my fault if I point out that "you" are racist or a bigot or a fool. I am just pointing it out. It is up to "you" to work on these issues, if "you" wish too.
My white privilege just got so bored it had to walk to the fridge of its mobile home in between NASCAR commercials while humming the theme to The Beverly Hillbillies to get a Schlitz. Cheers.

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Re: Big messages to deplorables ???

Post by PeterC » Mon Jul 09, 2018 6:53 am

Rick wrote:
Wed Jun 27, 2018 7:26 pm
I guess it boils down to: What % of Trumpistos are striving to do the right thing...
Almost everyone, everywhere, at all times think they are doing the right thing. History is replete with mass murderers who thought they were helping their countries and their people. The human mind is frighteningly good at fabricating moral self-justifications.

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Rick
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Re: Big messages to deplorables ???

Post by Rick » Thu Jul 12, 2018 5:13 pm

Frickin' homo sapiens! Enlightenment is wasted on 'em! :popcorn:

Let's widen the field a bit: What % of Trump supporters are striving to do the right thing for the entire world rather than just America? And what % care about doing what's right for the entire country rather than just their personal tribes?
Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily ...

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Virgo
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Re: Big messages to deplorables ???

Post by Virgo » Thu Jul 12, 2018 5:32 pm

Rick wrote:
Thu Jul 12, 2018 5:13 pm
Let's widen the field a bit: What % of Trump supporters are striving to do the right thing for the entire world rather than just America? And what % care about doing what's right for the entire country rather than just their personal tribes?
They are in fear mode. They think their personal safety, way of life, income, religion, etc. are very much threatened (although they are not). They feel they have to respond to that threat before thinking of anything else. They probably feel that they do not have the luxury of thinking about other problems or other peoples problems. This stems from ignorance at it's root. For example, principled conservatives feel very much that big government will utterly destroy the economy, which threatens them, their kids, and so on. They feel liberalism threatens their social ideals, and they think that people accepting homosexuality in their culture for example will cause the people who are homosexual to go to hell, and possibly anyone who accepts those people to go to hell, etc. In short they feel threatened, under attacked, scared, frightened, etc.

Kevin...

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Rick
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Re: Big messages to deplorables ???

Post by Rick » Thu Jul 12, 2018 6:19 pm

And rather than dispel that fear and rage, Trump feeds it because he thinks it is what will keep him in power, on top of the hill. And Republican congresspeople feed it along with him, for the same reason. Or, less cynically, they have a vision of a tougher, more self-protectionist, better America and are willing to use fear/anger to realize their vision, a means justifies ends kinda deal.
Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily ...

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Re: Big messages to deplorables ???

Post by Virgo » Thu Jul 12, 2018 6:37 pm

Rick wrote:
Thu Jul 12, 2018 6:19 pm
And rather than dispel that fear and rage, Trump feeds it because he thinks it is what will keep him in power, on top of the hill. And Republican congresspeople feed it along with him, for the same reason. Or, less cynically, they have a vision of a tougher, more self-protectionist, better America and are willing to use fear/anger to realize their vision, a means justifies ends kinda deal.
Exactly correct.

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Re: Big messages to deplorables ???

Post by Virgo » Thu Jul 12, 2018 6:48 pm

It's also important not to focus on it too much, as it is depressing. We need to give ourselves space, to preserve life.

Kevin...

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Re: Big messages to deplorables ???

Post by Johnny Dangerous » Thu Jul 12, 2018 7:10 pm

Rick wrote:
Thu Jul 12, 2018 5:13 pm
Frickin' homo sapiens! Enlightenment is wasted on 'em! :popcorn:

Let's widen the field a bit: What % of Trump supporters are striving to do the right thing for the entire world rather than just America? And what % care about doing what's right for the entire country rather than just their personal tribes?
I'd hazard a guess that the smarter conservatives (admittedly, many are probably not Trump supporters) would argue that the implied claim here that the other side knows how to do the right thing for the entire world is probably a pretty dubious one. I feel that way too, though probably very different reasons that the Trumpists. Further, while jingoistic propaganda is fairly easy to see on the right, many people on the mainstream liberal left have a problem seeing their own jingoism, for instance the idea that the policies or ideologies they support "do the right thing for the whole world"..is a huge claim to make, and is often easily disproven by the very effect of the policies they advocate.

The last 30 years or so of Neoliberal fiscal policy (which has to be acknowledged as at least part of what brought us where we are now) also claimed it knew what was best for the whole world. Apparently it did not.
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Re: Big messages to deplorables ???

Post by Johnny Dangerous » Thu Jul 12, 2018 7:14 pm

Malcolm wrote:
Tue Jun 26, 2018 12:28 am
Sādhaka wrote:
Mon Jun 25, 2018 11:25 pm
I don’t think you’re incorrect on that point.

My point is, who would trump get replaced with? Only another bush, obama, or clinton?

Yea people like Bernie Sanders, Cynthia McKinney, Ron Paul, and Ralph Nader might be a little better than all of the above; but I still think we’re going to have to do even better than that, to slow down the crash course that we’re on. Perhaps as Dharma practitioners, or aspiring ones, leaving politics alone altogether for now is the best course.

Or mostly focus on the issues that I mentioned in my previous post.
The reality is that we have to curb the power of the presidency. It has become unbalanced. This is the problem.

*This*. If there is any positive result of the Trump presidency I hope it will be this, executive power has been growing since at least Clinton, and it is -way- out of hand.
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Mantrik
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Re: Big messages to deplorables ???

Post by Mantrik » Thu Jul 12, 2018 8:20 pm

Love the way Trump lands in the EU and thinks only of soundbites for his homies.

UK - you're in chaos.
Germany - you're controlled by Russia.
USA -we make the best armaments in the world.
Putin - is a business rival, not an enemy, but I would have stopped him invading others.

Soo......if there's a quick buck in it for the Trump family and its portfolio, expect discounted arms to be sold to Pootn in return for exclusive condo contracts, all sweetened by a few pussies.
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Thanno Garuda Prachodayath

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Re: Big messages to deplorables ???

Post by Dan74 » Thu Jul 12, 2018 9:03 pm

Mantrik wrote:
Thu Jul 12, 2018 8:20 pm
Love the way Trump lands in the EU and thinks only of soundbites for his homies.

UK - you're in chaos.
Germany - you're controlled by Russia.
USA -we make the best armaments in the world.
Putin - is a business rival, not an enemy, but I would have stopped him invading others.

Soo......if there's a quick buck in it for the Trump family and its portfolio, expect discounted arms to be sold to Pootn in return for exclusive condo contracts, all sweetened by a few pussies.
:lol:

I am likely hopelessly naive but I still think there's a possibility that someone with a colossal ego like Trump, would care about how he would appear in the history books and actually try to make a positive impact for that reason.

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Rick
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Re: Big messages to deplorables ???

Post by Rick » Thu Jul 12, 2018 10:04 pm

Johnny Dangerous wrote:
Thu Jul 12, 2018 7:10 pm
Rick wrote:
Thu Jul 12, 2018 5:13 pm
Let's widen the field a bit: What % of Trump supporters are striving to do the right thing for the entire world rather than just America? And what % care about doing what's right for the entire country rather than just their personal tribes?
I'd hazard a guess that the smarter conservatives (admittedly, many are probably not Trump supporters) would argue that the implied claim here that the other side knows how to do the right thing for the entire world is probably a pretty dubious one.
I am not convinced anti-Trumpistos (Dems, liberals, indies) know how to do the right thing on a global level. But from everything I’ve seen since The Donald landed, anti-Trumpers *care* more about the global picture, whether that global refers to all of America or all of the world. It’s more of a we than us-vs.-them view.
Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily ...

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Malcolm
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Re: Big messages to deplorables ???

Post by Malcolm » Fri Jul 13, 2018 12:52 am

Rick wrote:
Thu Jul 12, 2018 5:13 pm
Frickin' homo sapiens! Enlightenment is wasted on 'em! :popcorn:

Let's widen the field a bit: What % of Trump supporters are striving to do the right thing for the entire world rather than just America? And what % care about doing what's right for the entire country rather than just their personal tribes?
0%
Buddhahood in This Life
འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


[A]nything at all that is well spoken is the word of the Buddha.

-- Ārya-adhyāśaya-sañcodana-nāma-mahāyāna-sūtra

The different sūtras in accord with the emptiness
taught by the Sugata are definitive in meaning;
One can understand that all of those Dharmas in
which a sentient being, individual, or person are taught are provisional in meaning.

-- Samadhirāja Sūtra

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Re: Big messages to deplorables ???

Post by Mantrik » Fri Jul 13, 2018 12:36 pm

Crime and terrorism is a problem across all major European cities, so why has Trump singled out Sadiq Khan, Mayor of London for a barrage of insults?

Simple.....when Trump wanted all Muslims to be prevented from entering the USA, Khan vocally opposed him and the two have rowed ever since. I'm not saying Trump is a racist bigot.... I don't have to.

Revenge for the Scrotus brain farts has come in the form of the Trump blimp showing him as a baby, now floating near Parliament. A huge stinking over-inflated gobbet of gaudy plastic filled with hot air.
Then there's the balloon........... ;)

Meanwhile Stormy has been arrested for assaulting undercover cops with her tits. Apparently, under Ohio state law, stripping is allowed but sexual contact in such a venue is illegal, unless it is with a family member. I presume such sexual contact with other family members in the past resulted in the births of those who voted Trump.
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Re: Big messages to deplorables ???

Post by Simon E. » Fri Jul 13, 2018 2:22 pm

Central London is teeming with thousands of anti-Trump protesters. All round Blenheim Palace where Trump spent the night there are many more with placards, horns, and percussion instruments.

His movements are being monitored by protesters who are racing to get to venues before he does.
Trumps response? 'They like me over there' says the Orange One.

I have met no British person..not one..with a good word for him.

Contrast that with visits by Obama when thousands turned out to cheer..even post scandal Clinton was welcomed warmly..As was Reagan.
Back to fishin' folks... :namaste:

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Rick
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Re: Big messages to deplorables ???

Post by Rick » Fri Jul 13, 2018 2:45 pm

Simon E. wrote:
Fri Jul 13, 2018 2:22 pm
I have met no British person..not one..with a good word for him.
Fake news!

The proof: 'They like me over there' says the Orange One.

“It is the leaders of the country who determine the policy and it is always a simple matter to drag the people along, whether it is a democracy or a fascist dictatorship or a Parliament or a Communist dictatorship. ... Voice or no voice, the people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them they are being attacked and denounce the pacifists for lack of patriotism and exposing the country to danger. It works the same way in any country.” Hermann Göring
Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily ...

Simon E.
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Re: Big messages to deplorables ???

Post by Simon E. » Fri Jul 13, 2018 3:05 pm

That, of course, is less likely to work as a strategy when visiting the population of another country. :smile:
Back to fishin' folks... :namaste:

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Re: Big messages to deplorables ???

Post by Motova » Fri Jul 13, 2018 3:07 pm

Out of all his names, my favourite is still 'Twitler'.
To become a rain man one must master the ten virtues and sciences.

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Rick
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Re: Big messages to deplorables ???

Post by Rick » Fri Jul 13, 2018 3:12 pm

Simon E. wrote:
Fri Jul 13, 2018 3:05 pm
That, of course, is less likely to work as a strategy when visiting the population of another country. :smile:
Let's hope so! ;-)

I was referring to my fellow 'merikans believing (or pretending to) whatever The Orange One and his Fox News Shills say. 100 distinguished scholars from all sides of the political spectrum could say X, and if Orange-Ade said "Y!" his fanboys/gurls would choose to believe him.
Merrily, merrily, merrily, merrily ...

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