What place does pilgrimage have in Buddhist practice?

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TharpaChodron
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Re: What place does pilgrimage have in Buddhist practice?

Post by TharpaChodron » Fri Mar 09, 2018 2:27 am

Queequeg wrote:
Thu Mar 08, 2018 5:12 pm
Did you accept the invitation?
Life circumstances haven't allowed it yet. But I want to, and in fact, I've wondered if there's the Buddhist version of the Kumbh Mela, or some event that might be particularly good to be a part of. Ideas welcome.

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Malcolm
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Re: What place does pilgrimage have in Buddhist practice?

Post by Malcolm » Fri Mar 09, 2018 4:08 am

Aryjna wrote:
Thu Mar 08, 2018 11:17 pm
Malcolm wrote:
Thu Mar 08, 2018 10:30 pm
Aryjna wrote:
Thu Mar 08, 2018 8:34 pm
Kailash seems to be an important place to visit. I am curious if it would be considered a priority over Bodh Gaya, Sarnath, etc. for Vajrayana practitioners.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mount_Kailash

Image
Buddha was not born at Kailash, nor did he attain awakening there, nor did he teach there, nor did he die there, nor is there any sūtra or tantra that mention it is an important site, even though it is one of the 24 places mentioned in the Cakrasamvara cycle, etc. So, no, it is not more important than these traditional four sites.
It is slightly disappointing that it is not mentioned more in the tantras.
It is mentioned in Sūtras, but not as a place of any special significance, just as a prominent geographical location. On the other hand, the lake near Kailash is held to be the home of Nagaraja Anavatapta, who is held to govern the rivers in India. And of course Kailash has been a common object of veneration for Indians and Himalayan’s for many millennia.
Buddhahood in This Life
འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


[A]nything at all that is well spoken is the word of the Buddha.

-- Ārya-adhyāśaya-sañcodana-nāma-mahāyāna-sūtra

The different sūtras in accord with the emptiness
taught by the Sugata are definitive in meaning;
One can understand that all of those Dharmas in
which a sentient being, individual, or person are taught are provisional in meaning.

-- Samadhirāja Sūtra

Rory1
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Re: What place does pilgrimage have in Buddhist practice?

Post by Rory1 » Fri Mar 09, 2018 5:53 am

Arg my computer crashed and I had to re-register. Anyway in Japan pilgrimage is still popular and for sure I will make the Saigoku Kannon pilgrimage to visit the 33 temples in honour of Kannon-sama. The pilgrimage route dates from the 11th century, probably earlier. each temple is associated with a great miracle involving Kannon.

There are other traditional pilgrimage circuits associated with Kannon: Bando and Chichibu both with 33/34 temples associated with Kannon's forms as is found in the Lotus Sutra.

There is the the famous Shikoku pilgrimage which included 88 sites associated with Kukai, the founder of the Shingon (tantric ) school. It either begins or ends with visiting Mt. Koya, the home of Shingon Shu. There are pilgrimages to Amida Nyorai, Yakushi Nyorai (Medicine Buddha), Jizo...and more.
and here is a list of them:
http://www.onmarkproductions.com/html/h ... rines.html
It's very popular in Japan today, many go on buses, but plenty of people still go on foot. There is special clothing and etiquette. And temples have places for pilgrims to stay. I think this is a very wholeistic experience.
here is a link:
http://www.onmarkproductions.com/html/p ... japan.html

anyway I would encourage you to plan, save and make a pilgrimage
Namu Kannon Bosatsu
gassho
Rory

tenyang
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Re: What place does pilgrimage have in Buddhist practice?

Post by tenyang » Fri Mar 09, 2018 10:29 am

Nyedrag Yeshe wrote:
Tue Mar 06, 2018 9:22 pm
Yes, and I also believe that pilgrimage creates a sort of Devotional mindset that is overall very positive to one's practice and confidence in Dharma. Besides creating a connection with the virtuous activities of Buddhas and past time masters!
I agree with Nyedrag Yeshe. For these reasons, I see pilgrimage as an important part of my practice. I've been to Bodhgaya, Sarnath, Kushinagar, as well as other sites such as Vulture Peak, Nalanda and Vaishali, and I find it was an important experience, both because if was an opportunity to reflect more deeply on the teachings that were once given in that place or the events that unfolded there, and also because it was an opportunity to practice guru devotion, as I've always been on pilgrimage along with my masters.

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Queequeg
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Re: What place does pilgrimage have in Buddhist practice?

Post by Queequeg » Fri Mar 09, 2018 12:57 pm

TharpaChodron wrote:
Fri Mar 09, 2018 2:27 am
Queequeg wrote:
Thu Mar 08, 2018 5:12 pm
Did you accept the invitation?
Life circumstances haven't allowed it yet. But I want to, and in fact, I've wondered if there's the Buddhist version of the Kumbh Mela, or some event that might be particularly good to be a part of. Ideas welcome.
Bodhi Day? Big gathering at Bodhgaya, though not as big or as colorful as Kumbh Mela. Losar in Dharamsala?
Those who, even with distracted minds,
Entered a stupa compound
And chanted but once, “Namo Buddhaya!”
Have certainly attained the path of the buddhas.

-Lotus Sutra, Expedient Means Chapter

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Queequeg
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Re: What place does pilgrimage have in Buddhist practice?

Post by Queequeg » Fri Mar 09, 2018 1:05 pm

Rory1 wrote:
Fri Mar 09, 2018 5:53 am
Saigoku Kannon...Chichibu
My wife and I did about half of the Saigoku when she was doing her dissertation research (she wrote on a genre of pilgrimage mandalas). Two weeks or so driving and walking around Kii peninsula. It was a lot of fun.

My sister has been visiting Chichibu sites over the course of several trips to Japan.

Japan has many many pilgrimage circuits, many within cities like Kyoto and Tokyo that can be walked in a matter of days, as well as special sites. That pilgrimage culture I think contributed to what Alan Grapard called the mandalization of the landscape, adding a Buddhist sacredness to a landscape that has been considered sacred since prehistory.
Those who, even with distracted minds,
Entered a stupa compound
And chanted but once, “Namo Buddhaya!”
Have certainly attained the path of the buddhas.

-Lotus Sutra, Expedient Means Chapter

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Re: What place does pilgrimage have in Buddhist practice?

Post by Nyedrag Yeshe » Fri Mar 09, 2018 1:25 pm

Queequeg wrote:
Fri Mar 09, 2018 1:05 pm
Rory1 wrote:
Fri Mar 09, 2018 5:53 am
Saigoku Kannon...Chichibu
My wife and I did about half of the Saigoku when she was doing her dissertation research (she wrote on a genre of pilgrimage mandalas). Two weeks or so driving and walking around Kii peninsula. It was a lot of fun.

My sister has been visiting Chichibu sites over the course of several trips to Japan.

Japan has many many pilgrimage circuits, many within cities like Kyoto and Tokyo that can be walked in a matter of days, as well as special sites. That pilgrimage culture I think contributed to what Alan Grapard called the mandalization of the landscape, adding a Buddhist sacredness to a landscape that has been considered sacred since prehistory.
The 88 Temples Pilgrimage and Kumano Kodo are a long-treasured dream to mee!
“Whatever has to happen, let it happen!”
“Whatever the situation is, it’s fine!”
“I really don’t need anything!
~Tsangpa Gyare Yeshe Dorje (1161-1211)
ओं पद्मोष्णीष विमले हूँ फट । ओं हनुफशभरहृदय स्वाहा॥
འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔ ཀརྨ་པ་མཁྱེན་ནོ།

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Queequeg
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Re: What place does pilgrimage have in Buddhist practice?

Post by Queequeg » Fri Mar 09, 2018 5:55 pm

Nyedrag Yeshe wrote:
Fri Mar 09, 2018 1:25 pm
Excellent video.

The experience of pilgrimage is in itself wonderful, I think, regardless of the religious tradition. Its probably something human beings have been doing since time immemorial - walk-abouts, vision quests, and modern road trips, back packing. To be lost in the moment, disconnected from the ground you ordinarily live on and to be faced with new contexts and situations, meeting strangers - its extraordinary. Adding the layers of religious meaning enhance that experience, refine it into a spiritual one.

The paintings my wife studies are thought to be Japanese pre-modern advertisements of sorts, encouraging people to make the trip to various religious centers like Ise and Nachi and Fuji etc. When she was researching, she read pilgrim journals, and the things they write about are the same sorts of things the pilgrims in that video experience today - long, lonely hours of walking and contemplation, chance encounters with friendly strangers, the freedom afforded by disconnecting from your everyday life. Its a glimpse of the life gone forth that the Buddha taught -

"Household life is crowded and dusty; life gone forth is wide open. It is not easy, while living in a home, to lead the holy life utterly perfect and pure as a polished shell. Suppose I shave off my hair and beard, put on the yellow robe, and go forth from the home life into homelessness."
-Gautama Buddha

Kerouac's On the Road I think captures a little bit of the exhilaration you find on pilgrimage, albeit in his existential, post-war America kind of way. I really liked Martin Sheen's The Way and thought it also captured the experience of pilgrimage, albeit in the context of European Catholicism.
Those who, even with distracted minds,
Entered a stupa compound
And chanted but once, “Namo Buddhaya!”
Have certainly attained the path of the buddhas.

-Lotus Sutra, Expedient Means Chapter

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Re: What place does pilgrimage have in Buddhist practice?

Post by Punya » Fri Mar 09, 2018 10:28 pm

conebeckham wrote:
Tue Mar 06, 2018 8:38 pm
...I find great inspiration in spending time in environments where Buddhism has been practiced widely as part of general culture for a long time. I've not been to Tibet, but heartily recommend any Western Vajrayana practitioner make the effort to visit Bhutan, Nepal, and Sikkim. You can thank me later.
Yes, I find them inspirational too. Bodghaya was amazing with waves of practitioners from different parts of the world arriving every few minutes. I met some wonderful monks from Burma/Myanmar there. In Bhutan, with one of my teachers, we visited sites associated with several major figures in Tibetan Buddhism and ancient monastries and practiced, sometimes with awe inspiring results. Beautiful country too. Places to visit around Kathmandu, include Nagarjuna Mountain, the Vajrayogini temple in Pharping and Namo Buddha. I'm planning a visit to Sikkim later in the year and Tibet is still on my bucket list.
May the stupid meditators be awakened from the sleep of ignorance;
May the attacks of the logicians with their sophistries be vanquished.

Chogyam Trungpa Rinpoche in The Rain of Wisdom

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Re: What place does pilgrimage have in Buddhist practice?

Post by rory » Sun Mar 11, 2018 6:03 am

Queequeg

My wife and I did about half of the Saigoku when she was doing her dissertation research (she wrote on a genre of pilgrimage mandalas). Two weeks or so driving and walking around Kii peninsula. It was a lot of fun.

My sister has been visiting Chichibu sites over the course of several trips to Japan.

Japan has many many pilgrimage circuits, many within cities like Kyoto and Tokyo that can be walked in a matter of days, as well as special sites. That pilgrimage culture I think contributed to what Alan Grapard called the mandalization of the landscape, adding a Buddhist sacredness to a landscape that has been considered sacred since prehistory.
Queequeg: Pilgrimage mandalas, so interesting, lucky you to have done Saigoku. And your sister too. Do people do it out of devotion, interest, culture? So many reasons...
I didn't even think of Tokyo or Kyoto. When I was in Ireland I knew quite a few Northern Irish old SGI members and they showed me pictures and talked very nostalgically about making yearly Tozan (the pilgrimage to the Nichiren Shoshu head temple). I really liked that and they acknowledged how much they missed it and the old days. I found it quite sad
gassho
Rory
Namu Kanzeon Bosatsu
Chih-I:
The Tai-ching states "the women in the realms of Mara, Sakra and Brahma all neither abandoned ( their old) bodies nor received (new) bodies. They all received buddhahood with their current bodies (genshin)" Thus these verses state that the dharma nature is like a great ocean. No right or wrong is preached (within it) Ordinary people and sages are equal, without superiority or inferiority
Paul, Groner "The Lotus Sutra in Japanese Culture"eds. Tanabe p. 58
https://www.tendai-usa.org/

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Re: What place does pilgrimage have in Buddhist practice?

Post by The Cicada » Sun Mar 11, 2018 6:50 am

rory wrote:
Sun Mar 11, 2018 6:03 am
Queequeg: Pilgrimage mandalas, so interesting, lucky you to have done Saigoku. And your sister too. Do people do it out of devotion, interest, culture? So many reasons...
I didn't even think of Tokyo or Kyoto. When I was in Ireland I knew quite a few Northern Irish old SGI members and they showed me pictures and talked very nostalgically about making yearly Tozan (the pilgrimage to the Nichiren Shoshu head temple). I really liked that and they acknowledged how much they missed it and the old days. I found it quite sad
gassho
Rory
I know what you mean, Rory. I miss SGI sometimes myself. For me it was a bit like when Gulliver found the Houyhnhnm, but I could never go back for the same reason I could never stifle my eye rolls in a cathedral, fake my way into a lower heaven in a Baptist Church, or convert to Islam despite their strides into the coming social developments of the new millennium: Doctrines.

I miss those daimoku tosos, though.

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Re: What place does pilgrimage have in Buddhist practice?

Post by amanitamusc » Sun Mar 11, 2018 8:20 am

Malcolm wrote:
Thu Mar 08, 2018 10:30 pm
Aryjna wrote:
Thu Mar 08, 2018 8:34 pm
Kailash seems to be an important place to visit. I am curious if it would be considered a priority over Bodh Gaya, Sarnath, etc. for Vajrayana practitioners.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mount_Kailash

Image
Buddha was not born at Kailash, nor did he attain awakening there, nor did he teach there, nor did he die there, nor is there any sūtra or tantra that mention it is an important site, even though it is one of the 24 places mentioned in the Cakrasamvara cycle, etc. So, no, it is not more important than these traditional four sites.
ChNNR went to Kailash and wrote about it.It seems he thought it
was important.
Did he write as extensively about the other places you mention?

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Re: What place does pilgrimage have in Buddhist practice?

Post by kirtu » Sun Mar 11, 2018 12:36 pm

amanitamusc wrote:
Sun Mar 11, 2018 8:20 am
ChNNR went to Kailash and wrote about it.It seems he thought it
was important.
Mount Kailash and the Lost Kingdom of Shang Shung
In 1988 Brian Beresford and Judith Allen undertook a pilgrimmag to Tibet under the guidance of revered Tibetan Dzogchen Master, Chogyal Namkahi Norbu. A journey of historical, archeologically vital discoveries and self awakening. This beautiful film records the journey – not as a documentary, more as a pilgrimage diary of discovery.
{/quote]
Kirt's Tibetan Translation Notes

"Even if you practice only for an hour a day with faith and inspiration, good qualities will steadily increase. Regular practice makes it easy to transform your mind. From seeing only relative truth, you will eventually reach a profound certainty in the meaning of absolute truth."
Kyabje Dilgo Khyentse Rinpoche.

"Only you can make your mind beautiful."
HH Chetsang Rinpoche

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Malcolm
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Re: What place does pilgrimage have in Buddhist practice?

Post by Malcolm » Sun Mar 11, 2018 5:34 pm

amanitamusc wrote:
Sun Mar 11, 2018 8:20 am

ChNNR went to Kailash and wrote about it.It seems he thought it
was important.
Did he write as extensively about the other places you mention?
ChNN's interest is more related to Tibetan culture and the location of Zhang Zhung than Dharma.
Buddhahood in This Life
འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


[A]nything at all that is well spoken is the word of the Buddha.

-- Ārya-adhyāśaya-sañcodana-nāma-mahāyāna-sūtra

The different sūtras in accord with the emptiness
taught by the Sugata are definitive in meaning;
One can understand that all of those Dharmas in
which a sentient being, individual, or person are taught are provisional in meaning.

-- Samadhirāja Sūtra

amanitamusc
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Re: What place does pilgrimage have in Buddhist practice?

Post by amanitamusc » Mon Mar 12, 2018 6:58 am

Malcolm wrote:
Sun Mar 11, 2018 5:34 pm
amanitamusc wrote:
Sun Mar 11, 2018 8:20 am

ChNNR went to Kailash and wrote about it.It seems he thought it
was important.
Did he write as extensively about the other places you mention?
ChNN's interest is more related to Tibetan culture and the location of Zhang Zhung than Dharma.
Ok?

zhufawuwo
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Re: What place does pilgrimage have in Buddhist practice?

Post by zhufawuwo » Tue Mar 20, 2018 5:13 am

Urgh now I want to go everywhere.

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kirtu
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Re: What place does pilgrimage have in Buddhist practice?

Post by kirtu » Tue Mar 20, 2018 8:33 am

One day my Sakya lama, Khenpo Kalsang, took us on a pilgrimage to local temples in the DC area. We drove to at least four different temples, visiting them and offering prayers and incense.

Kirt
Kirt's Tibetan Translation Notes

"Even if you practice only for an hour a day with faith and inspiration, good qualities will steadily increase. Regular practice makes it easy to transform your mind. From seeing only relative truth, you will eventually reach a profound certainty in the meaning of absolute truth."
Kyabje Dilgo Khyentse Rinpoche.

"Only you can make your mind beautiful."
HH Chetsang Rinpoche

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石正 Marcus
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Re: What place does pilgrimage have in Buddhist practice?

Post by 石正 Marcus » Thu May 31, 2018 11:47 am

Queequeg wrote:
Fri Mar 09, 2018 1:05 pm
Rory1 wrote:
Fri Mar 09, 2018 5:53 am
Saigoku Kannon...Chichibu
My sister has been visiting Chichibu sites over the course of several trips to Japan.
The Chichibu Pilgrimage is amazing. Me and my wife started doing it on weekends when we are both off work last year and are now about half way through (it's not one to rush). Some of the best temples I've ever seen (and I've seen a lot) and in a region that is deeply devoted to Kannon. Her presence is everywhere.
南無観世音菩薩

Summers
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Re: What place does pilgrimage have in Buddhist practice?

Post by Summers » Thu May 31, 2018 7:22 pm

Aryjna wrote:
Thu Mar 08, 2018 8:34 pm
Kailash seems to be an important place to visit. I am curious if it would be considered a priority over Bodh Gaya, Sarnath, etc. for Vajrayana practitioners.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mount_Kailash

Image
What Bodhigaya is to Buddhists, Mt. Kailash is to Bönpo.

philji
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Re: What place does pilgrimage have in Buddhist practice?

Post by philji » Thu May 31, 2018 8:23 pm

Can someone remind me why Mt Kailash is significant to Buddhists. Hindus and jains i belive have clear reasons why they go on pilgrimage there.
Last edited by philji on Thu May 31, 2018 8:27 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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