What practices would Madhyamakin and Yogacarins actually have done?

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ItsRaining
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What practices would Madhyamakin and Yogacarins actually have done?

Post by ItsRaining » Mon Dec 25, 2017 4:01 am

Most of the texts produced by early-mid Mahayana schools seem to be on philosophy and theory (or maybe I'm wrong since I'm not too well read) so what practices did they do? Like similar to nikaya schools? Mindfulness of the four foundations? Breath Meditation? Impure Contemplation?

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Astus
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Re: What practices would Madhyamakin and Yogacarins actually have done?

Post by Astus » Mon Dec 25, 2017 10:14 am

1 Myriad dharmas are only mind.
Mind is unobtainable.
What is there to seek?

2 If the Buddha-Nature is seen,
there will be no seeing of a nature in any thing.

3 Neither cultivation nor seated meditation —
this is the pure Chan of Tathagata.

4 With sudden enlightenment to Tathagata Chan,
the six paramitas and myriad means
are complete within that essence.


1 Huangbo, T2012Ap381c1 2 Nirvana Sutra, T374p521b3; tr. Yamamoto 3 Mazu, X1321p3b23; tr. J. Jia 4 Yongjia, T2014p395c14; tr. from "The Sword of Wisdom"

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Vasana
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Re: What practices would Madhyamakin and Yogacarins actually have done?

Post by Vasana » Mon Dec 25, 2017 10:50 am

The end of analysis results in the nonconceptual union of shamatha/vippassana. Correct madhyamika view leads to direct cognition / direct yogic perception.
'When alone, watch your mind. When with others, watch your speech'- Old Kadampa saying.

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Astus
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Re: What practices would Madhyamakin and Yogacarins actually have done?

Post by Astus » Mon Dec 25, 2017 12:15 pm

Vasana wrote:
Mon Dec 25, 2017 10:50 am
The end of analysis results in the nonconceptual union of shamatha/vippassana. Correct madhyamika view leads to direct cognition / direct yogic perception.
That is a fairly late interpretation that fuses Madhyamaka with Yogacara and Pramana, furthermore, it does not specify the methods used.
1 Myriad dharmas are only mind.
Mind is unobtainable.
What is there to seek?

2 If the Buddha-Nature is seen,
there will be no seeing of a nature in any thing.

3 Neither cultivation nor seated meditation —
this is the pure Chan of Tathagata.

4 With sudden enlightenment to Tathagata Chan,
the six paramitas and myriad means
are complete within that essence.


1 Huangbo, T2012Ap381c1 2 Nirvana Sutra, T374p521b3; tr. Yamamoto 3 Mazu, X1321p3b23; tr. J. Jia 4 Yongjia, T2014p395c14; tr. from "The Sword of Wisdom"

ItsRaining
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Re: What practices would Madhyamakin and Yogacarins actually have done?

Post by ItsRaining » Mon Dec 25, 2017 1:36 pm

Astus wrote:
Mon Dec 25, 2017 10:14 am
See: Dhyāna sutras and Samādhi sutras.
Thanks! Any particular sutra out of these you recommend?

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Astus
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Re: What practices would Madhyamakin and Yogacarins actually have done?

Post by Astus » Mon Dec 25, 2017 8:27 pm

ItsRaining wrote:
Mon Dec 25, 2017 1:36 pm
Any particular sutra out of these you recommend?
Unless you read Chinese, just go through everything available in English. Also, there are mainly two additions to what was already taught in the sravaka texts: the contemplation (through visualisation and recitation) of buddhas and bodhisattvas, and the contemplation (through analysis) of the emptiness of appearances. Because of the latter addition, Madhyamika and Yogacarin works are also instructions for meditation.

Some meditation focused scriptures and a treatise:

- The Sutra on the Concentration of Sitting Meditation
- The Pratyutpanna Samādhi Sutra and The Śūraṅgama Samādhi Sutra
- The Three Pure Land Sutras
- Sūtra of Mahā-Prajñā-Pāramitā Pronounced by Mañjuśrī Bodhisattva
- Sūtra of Immeasurable Meaning
- Kumārajīva: The Essential Explanation of The Method of Dhyāna
1 Myriad dharmas are only mind.
Mind is unobtainable.
What is there to seek?

2 If the Buddha-Nature is seen,
there will be no seeing of a nature in any thing.

3 Neither cultivation nor seated meditation —
this is the pure Chan of Tathagata.

4 With sudden enlightenment to Tathagata Chan,
the six paramitas and myriad means
are complete within that essence.


1 Huangbo, T2012Ap381c1 2 Nirvana Sutra, T374p521b3; tr. Yamamoto 3 Mazu, X1321p3b23; tr. J. Jia 4 Yongjia, T2014p395c14; tr. from "The Sword of Wisdom"

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Malcolm
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Re: What practices would Madhyamakin and Yogacarins actually have done?

Post by Malcolm » Mon Dec 25, 2017 10:22 pm

ItsRaining wrote:
Mon Dec 25, 2017 4:01 am
Most of the texts produced by early-mid Mahayana schools seem to be on philosophy and theory (or maybe I'm wrong since I'm not too well read) so what practices did they do?
They would have practiced the six perfections.
Buddhahood in This Life
འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


[A]nything at all that is well spoken is the word of the Buddha.

-- Ārya-adhyāśaya-sañcodana-nāma-mahāyāna-sūtra

The different sūtras in accord with the emptiness
taught by the Sugata are definitive in meaning;
One can understand that all of those Dharmas in
which a sentient being, individual, or person are taught are provisional in meaning.

-- Samadhirāja Sūtra

Sentient Light
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Re: What practices would Madhyamakin and Yogacarins actually have done?

Post by Sentient Light » Tue Dec 26, 2017 5:14 pm

Yogacara texts tend to describe meditative practices routinely, even in its more generic texts. These were actually generally all more practically-oriented (it's in the name; Yoga-cara = "practice of yoga"), with the theoretical elements more like gentle guidance for contemplation of one's practice in order to lead to insight and direct perception of reality.

The first half of the Samdhinirmocana Sutra goes into the relationship between practice and theory. The second half of the Samdhinirmocana Sutra includes instructions on samatha-vipasyana, an outline of the bhumis, and an outline of the six perfections.

The Yogacarabhumi-sastra also includes meditation instructions and an outline of the bhumis. So does the second half of Asvagosha's poem, the Saundarananda (arguably Yogacara, but generally recognised as Sautrantika).
:buddha1: Nam mô A di đà Phật :buddha1:
:bow: Nam mô Quan Thế Âm Bồ tát :bow:
:bow: Nam mô Đại Thế Chi Bồ Tát :bow:

:buddha1: Nam mô Bổn sư Thích ca mâu ni Phật :buddha1:
:bow: Nam mô Di lặc Bồ tát :bow:
:bow: Nam mô Địa tạng vương Bồ tát :bow:

thecowisflying
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Re: What practices would Madhyamakin and Yogacarins actually have done?

Post by thecowisflying » Wed Dec 27, 2017 12:02 am

Malcolm wrote:
Mon Dec 25, 2017 10:22 pm
ItsRaining wrote:
Mon Dec 25, 2017 4:01 am
Most of the texts produced by early-mid Mahayana schools seem to be on philosophy and theory (or maybe I'm wrong since I'm not too well read) so what practices did they do?
They would have practiced the six perfections.
Guess we all got that in common :twothumbsup:

Nebetmiw
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Re: What practices would Madhyamakin and Yogacarins actually have done?

Post by Nebetmiw » Wed Dec 27, 2017 5:06 pm

Astus wrote:
Mon Dec 25, 2017 8:27 pm
ItsRaining wrote:
Mon Dec 25, 2017 1:36 pm
Any particular sutra out of these you recommend?
Unless you read Chinese, just go through everything available in English. Also, there are mainly two additions to what was already taught in the sravaka texts: the contemplation (through visualisation and recitation) of buddhas and bodhisattvas, and the contemplation (through analysis) of the emptiness of appearances. Because of the latter addition, Madhyamika and Yogacarin works are also instructions for meditation.

Some meditation focused scriptures and a treatise:

- The Sutra on the Concentration of Sitting Meditation
- The Pratyutpanna Samādhi Sutra and The Śūraṅgama Samādhi Sutra
- The Three Pure Land Sutras
- Sūtra of Mahā-Prajñā-Pāramitā Pronounced by Mañjuśrī Bodhisattva
- Sūtra of Immeasurable Meaning
- Kumārajīva: The Essential Explanation of The Method of Dhyāna
Thanks for those links. That first one was very educational and interesting. :namaste:

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Javierfv1212
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Re: What practices would Madhyamakin and Yogacarins actually have done?

Post by Javierfv1212 » Wed Dec 27, 2017 7:27 pm

The practices are outlined in the Yogacarabhumi and Sravakabhumi
It is quite impossible to find the Buddha anywhere other than in one's own mind.
~Padmasambhava

Amid those who are self-constrained, the Stable One would not posit as categorically true or false
anything seen, heard, or sensed, clung to and considered truth by others.
Since they have already seen this dart to which people cling and adhere,
saying “I know, I see, it is just so,”
the Tathāgatas cling to nothing.
-Kalaka sutta

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