So I get the two truths theory formulated by Nagarjuna. There is ultimate truth (i.e. insight into emptiness) and then there is conventional truth, which, which useful, is ultimately false. So there is a sort of hierarchy: ultimate truth > conventional truth
But then in in tientai there are three truths: emptiness, conventional truth and the middle way. These three are not only equal but also imply the other two. Now I've been reading tientai for months and I still don't get anything I've said in this paragraph...
I don't get anything about the threefold truth. I can make sense of the two truths but not the threefold truth...?
nagarjuna two truths to tientai threefold truth. How?
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nichiren-123
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Re: nagarjuna two truths to tientai threefold truth. How?
The non-differentiation between samsara and nirvana of Ven Nagarjuna is treated as it's own "truth" in Tiantai. A "third".nichiren-123 wrote: ↑Sun Mar 25, 2018 4:02 pm So I get the two truths theory formulated by Nagarjuna. There is ultimate truth (i.e. insight into emptiness) and then there is conventional truth, which, which useful, is ultimately false. So there is a sort of hierarchy: ultimate truth > conventional truth
But then in in tientai there are three truths: emptiness, conventional truth and the middle way. These three are not only equal but also imply the other two. Now I've been reading tientai for months and I still don't get anything I've said in this paragraph...
I don't get anything about the threefold truth. I can make sense of the two truths but not the threefold truth...?
Then, the monks uttered this gāthā:
These bodies are like foam.
Them being frail, who can rejoice in them?
The Buddha attained the vajra-body.
Still, it becomes inconstant and ruined.
The many Buddhas are vajra-entities.
All are also subject to inconstancy.
Quickly ended, like melting snow --
how could things be different?
The Buddha passed into parinirvāṇa afterward.
(T1.27b10 Mahāparinirvāṇasūtra DĀ 2)
These bodies are like foam.
Them being frail, who can rejoice in them?
The Buddha attained the vajra-body.
Still, it becomes inconstant and ruined.
The many Buddhas are vajra-entities.
All are also subject to inconstancy.
Quickly ended, like melting snow --
how could things be different?
The Buddha passed into parinirvāṇa afterward.
(T1.27b10 Mahāparinirvāṇasūtra DĀ 2)
Re: nagarjuna two truths to tientai threefold truth. How?
It simply means one plus one equals to three...nichiren-123 wrote: ↑Sun Mar 25, 2018 4:02 pm I don't get anything about the threefold truth. I can make sense of the two truths but not the threefold truth...?
TRUTH 1 - Ultimate Truth (an insight into one side of the coin).
TRUTH 2 - Conventional Truth (an insight into another side of the coin).
TRUTH 3 - Middle Way Truth (an insight into the two sides of the same coin concurrently).
The wise Buddha has laid emphasis that one should see in all angles of things or matters while pursuing the ultimate truth. Without it, any conclusions made out of one’s observation would not be balanced or in a wholesome nature. In Buddhism, wholesome would mean in totality of perspective (skillful) and unwholesome would mean in non-totality of perspective (unskillful). There is no holy or sinful thought or act in the eyes of the Buddha.
In fact, the Buddha has recommended Middle Path as an ideal approach when addressing a problem. Middle Path is all about focusing on core, neutral, balance and upright. It means to investigate and break through the core of life and all things without any attitudes of favouritism. Any investigations must commence based on unbiased grounds i.e. on neutral and upright positions. In other words, one needs to investigate the problem from various angles, analyse the findings, understand the truth thoroughly, and find a reasonable conclusion.
So, the TRUTH 3 lies within the so-called 'reasonable conclusion'.
~ Ignorance triumphs when wise men do nothing ~
Re: nagarjuna two truths to tientai threefold truth. How?
See Swanson's Tientai Philosophy and Ng's Tientai and Early Madhyamika.
Also, you might find Jikai's notes and the discussion in the MoHo Chih Kuan discussion thread interesting.
Also, you might find Jikai's notes and the discussion in the MoHo Chih Kuan discussion thread interesting.
There is no suffering to be severed. Ignorance and klesas are indivisible from bodhi. There is no cause of suffering to be abandoned. Since extremes and the false are the Middle and genuine, there is no path to be practiced. Samsara is nirvana. No severance achieved. No suffering nor its cause. No path, no end. There is no transcendent realm; there is only the one true aspect. There is nothing separate from the true aspect.
-Guanding, Perfect and Sudden Contemplation,
-Guanding, Perfect and Sudden Contemplation,