Bodhi seed malas

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Rroman
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Bodhi seed malas

Post by Rroman » Mon Apr 06, 2015 2:43 pm

The bodhi seed mala is one of the most sought after malas with in the Tibetan buddhist tradition. It is said to enhance ones practice and increase mantra recitation infallibly. Used in both peaceful and wrathful practices.

Nepali bodhi seed is the most sought after because of is almost perfect wualites of Nicely round shaped And esthetics perfect.
It's close cousin nips the bodhi seed from India, which is not as esthetic lay perfect..not as perfectly round and some hole marks from various bugs.
The Chinese have been buying Nepali bodhi seed mala which has caused the price to increase to prices unheard of just five years ago. A good quality 8mm Nepali bodhi seed mala can go for as much as 3,000 to 4,000 dollars. The slightly larger malas, 11mm, have now increased to 200.00
The Indian counterparts are much cheaper, but not as perfect as the Nepali bodhi seed malas. An 8mm mala would go for 100.00 and the 11mm malas for around 80.00. Even cheaper because the makers of some of these malas sand the beads down to achieve a perfect shape and size, making a much more estheticly perfect bead...but compromising naturalness of the bead. Which brings the quality and cost down for these sanded Indian bodhi seed malas down to around 28.00 dollars.

I am wondering if the high quality Nepali bodhi seed malas are truly worth it.

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Thomas Amundsen
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Re: Bodhi seed malas

Post by Thomas Amundsen » Tue Apr 07, 2015 12:59 am

Rroman wrote:I am wondering if the high quality Nepali bodhi seed malas are truly worth it.
Me, too. I bought this one from Amazon for $23. I believe the seeds are from India. I haven't seen a convincing argument why an expensive one would be better.

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heart
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Re: Bodhi seed malas

Post by heart » Tue Apr 07, 2015 5:13 am

They used to be the cheapest malas you could get. difficult to imagine these current high prices can remain, after all it is a renewable source.

/magnus
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Kunzang
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Re: Bodhi seed malas

Post by Kunzang » Tue Apr 07, 2015 8:13 am

It appears that many different species are used to make "bodhi seed" malas.

Here's an interesting article about it: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3914368/

A lot of places still say they are seeds from the bodhi tree (Ficus religiosa) which would make a very tiny mala - the seeds are only .5 mm x 1 mm! See bodhi tree seeds here: http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File: ... igiosa.jpg

The kind I have look like what's called "phoenix eye"; I got it around 25 years ago for about $20.

Since it's said (in Gyatrul Rinpoche's Generation Stage in Buddhist Tantra which has been quoted all over the web) that bodhi seed malas "manifest limitless benefits for any form of practice" and many lamas recommend bodhi seed malas, I imagine this could be driving demand up and the price up and causing there to be so many types of "bodhi seed". :shrug:
Critics slap labels on you and then expect you to talk inside their terms. - Doris Lessing

philji
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Re: Bodhi seed malas

Post by philji » Tue Apr 07, 2015 9:01 am

What is the difference between the dark Bodhi and the lighter Bodhi( as shown in previous photo).
I have a 108 bead dark mala which I bought about 10 years ago in UK for £18($25) and also a wrist mala picked for me by a Lama in India for about 150 rps.

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Tsultrim T.
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Re: Bodhi seed malas

Post by Tsultrim T. » Wed Apr 08, 2015 12:26 am

Most Lamas I know (mainly from Dudjom and various Kagyu traditions) really only consider what was called the Phoenix Eye bodhi in the article quoted as being authentic. I bought the smallest one available about 9 years ago in Nepal just as the prices were going up. Back then that size bodhi was going for close to $100 US, I cant imagine what they go for now. Also only the 6 Mukhi Rudraksha malas were considered appropriate for Buddhist use and were therefore very expensive and hard to come by. They were only available from around the Pashupatinath temple outside of Boudha. I have not ever come across more than one or two of these quality since.

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Kim O'Hara
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Re: Bodhi seed malas

Post by Kim O'Hara » Wed Apr 08, 2015 1:25 am

Kunzang wrote:It appears that many different species are used to make "bodhi seed" malas.

Here's an interesting article about it: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3914368/

A lot of places still say they are seeds from the bodhi tree (Ficus religiosa) which would make a very tiny mala - the seeds are only .5 mm x 1 mm! See bodhi tree seeds here: http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File: ... igiosa.jpg

The kind I have look like what's called "phoenix eye"; I got it around 25 years ago for about $20.

Since it's said (in Gyatrul Rinpoche's Generation Stage in Buddhist Tantra which has been quoted all over the web) that bodhi seed malas "manifest limitless benefits for any form of practice" and many lamas recommend bodhi seed malas, I imagine this could be driving demand up and the price up and causing there to be so many types of "bodhi seed". :shrug:
Great article! :thanks:
It's something I never thought about before but it makes perfect sense: fig seeds are tiny, far too small to make malas for any creature bigger than a mouse.
So "bodhi seeds" are "enlightenment seeds" not "seeds of the bodhi tree".

:namaste:
Kim

Rroman
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Re: Bodhi seed malas

Post by Rroman » Wed Apr 08, 2015 7:56 am

Yes, great article.

A mala that size now costs as much as 2 to 3 thousand. I have also heard that Chatral Rinpoche has said the three eye are the best. Three eye representing the three kayas. They too are getting expensive, even the larger sized beads. Though I am finding really nice quality India bodhi seed that hasn't been sanded, which are natural and with either one eye or three eye.

And there are plenty of six face rudraksha in Pashupati. I never heard of the six face as being best for Buddhists. Why is that? Most people I see have five face. Actually, rudraksha are growing in popularity. There Are some very nice, high quality malas in Pashupati.

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Ayu
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Re: Bodhi seed malas

Post by Ayu » Wed Apr 08, 2015 8:01 am

Kim O'Hara wrote:
Kunzang wrote:It appears that many different species are used to make "bodhi seed" malas.

Here's an interesting article about it: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3914368/

A lot of places still say they are seeds from the bodhi tree (Ficus religiosa) which would make a very tiny mala - the seeds are only .5 mm x 1 mm! See bodhi tree seeds here: http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File: ... igiosa.jpg

The kind I have look like what's called "phoenix eye"; I got it around 25 years ago for about $20.

Since it's said (in Gyatrul Rinpoche's Generation Stage in Buddhist Tantra which has been quoted all over the web) that bodhi seed malas "manifest limitless benefits for any form of practice" and many lamas recommend bodhi seed malas, I imagine this could be driving demand up and the price up and causing there to be so many types of "bodhi seed". :shrug:
Great article! :thanks:
It's something I never thought about before but it makes perfect sense: fig seeds are tiny, far too small to make malas for any creature bigger than a mouse.
So "bodhi seeds" are "enlightenment seeds" not "seeds of the bodhi tree".

:namaste:
Kim
It seems to me, that "seeds" is the wrong word.
The "bodhi seed" beads look like made from the bodhi fruits (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ficus_reli ... 4_Asit.jpg ), which have many small wholes for the actual tiny seeds. These seed-wholes seem to be the black spots on bodhi seed beads.
(Sorry, I didn't read the article.)
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Kunzang
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Re: Bodhi seed malas

Post by Kunzang » Wed Apr 08, 2015 7:14 pm

The "bodhi seed" beads look like made from the bodhi fruits (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ficus_reli ... 4_Asit.jpg ), which have many small wholes for the actual tiny seeds. These seed-wholes seem to be the black spots on bodhi seed beads.
(Sorry, I didn't read the article.)
None of the 52 types of beads collected as "bodhi seeds" were from any type of Ficus. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/article ... /table/T1/
Critics slap labels on you and then expect you to talk inside their terms. - Doris Lessing

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Ayu
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Re: Bodhi seed malas

Post by Ayu » Wed Apr 08, 2015 8:24 pm

Ah, I see. They are from the Rudraksha tree, Elaeocarpus ganitrus, wikipedia also says.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rudraksha
The beads must have been polished to become smooth.
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shanehanner
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Re: Bodhi seed malas

Post by shanehanner » Thu Apr 09, 2015 3:18 am

Does anyone know where we can buy the seeds online and make them ourselves?

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Ayu
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Re: Bodhi seed malas

Post by Ayu » Thu Apr 09, 2015 8:38 am

shanehanner wrote:Does anyone know where we can buy the seeds online and make them ourselves?
I once found a shop via google and bought some seeds, but they need a temperature of 25 to 28°C in order to sprout. So this project failed at my place.
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Re: Bodhi seed malas

Post by heart » Thu Apr 09, 2015 8:53 am

Ayu wrote:Ah, I see. They are from the Rudraksha tree, Elaeocarpus ganitrus, wikipedia also says.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rudraksha
The beads must have been polished to become smooth.
Rudraksha beads are not Bodhi beads, that is for sure.

/magnus
"We are all here to help each other go through this thing, whatever it is."
~Kurt Vonnegut

"The principal practice is Guruyoga. But we need to understand that any secondary practice combined with Guruyoga becomes a principal practice." ChNNR (Teachings on Thun and Ganapuja)

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Re: Bodhi seed malas

Post by Ayu » Thu Apr 09, 2015 10:52 am

heart wrote:
Ayu wrote:Ah, I see. They are from the Rudraksha tree, Elaeocarpus ganitrus, wikipedia also says.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rudraksha
The beads must have been polished to become smooth.
Rudraksha beads are not Bodhi beads, that is for sure.

/magnus
:shrug: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buddhist_prayer_beads
... Some beads can be used for all purposes and all kinds of mantras. These beads can be made from the wood of the Bodhi tree (Ficus religiosa), or from 'Bodhi seeds', which come from the Rudraksha (Elaeocarpus ganitrus) and not the Bodhi tree. ...
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Thomas Amundsen
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Re: Bodhi seed malas

Post by Thomas Amundsen » Thu Apr 09, 2015 5:24 pm

Ayu wrote:
heart wrote:
Ayu wrote:Ah, I see. They are from the Rudraksha tree, Elaeocarpus ganitrus, wikipedia also says.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rudraksha
The beads must have been polished to become smooth.
Rudraksha beads are not Bodhi beads, that is for sure.

/magnus
:shrug: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buddhist_prayer_beads
... Some beads can be used for all purposes and all kinds of mantras. These beads can be made from the wood of the Bodhi tree (Ficus religiosa), or from 'Bodhi seeds', which come from the Rudraksha (Elaeocarpus ganitrus) and not the Bodhi tree. ...
Sure.. but rudraksha beads are used for wrathful mantras, as far as I know. They certainly are not the general-purpose bodhi seed beads recommended in tantras.

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Tongnyid Dorje
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Re: Bodhi seed malas

Post by Tongnyid Dorje » Thu Apr 09, 2015 8:01 pm

i think its polished rudraksha. if you check this e-shop, i could hardly say difference between bodhi seed and polished rudraksha:

http://www.garudashop.com/Mala_Beads_Se ... d_s/10.htm

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heart
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Re: Bodhi seed malas

Post by heart » Thu Apr 09, 2015 9:26 pm

Tongnyid Dorje wrote:i think its polished rudraksha. if you check this e-shop, i could hardly say difference between bodhi seed and polished rudraksha:

http://www.garudashop.com/Mala_Beads_Se ... d_s/10.htm
It isn't. Real bodhi seeds, have a sticky point on each bead.No idea where they comes from though, but it isn't the Ficus religiosa either it seems like.

/magnus
"We are all here to help each other go through this thing, whatever it is."
~Kurt Vonnegut

"The principal practice is Guruyoga. But we need to understand that any secondary practice combined with Guruyoga becomes a principal practice." ChNNR (Teachings on Thun and Ganapuja)

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Kim O'Hara
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Re: Bodhi seed malas

Post by Kim O'Hara » Thu Apr 09, 2015 10:52 pm

heart wrote:
Tongnyid Dorje wrote:i think its polished rudraksha. if you check this e-shop, i could hardly say difference between bodhi seed and polished rudraksha:

http://www.garudashop.com/Mala_Beads_Se ... d_s/10.htm
It isn't. Real bodhi seeds, have a sticky point on each bead.No idea where they comes from though, but it isn't the Ficus religiosa either it seems like.

/magnus
The notion of "real bodhi seeds" looks fairly dubious given that seeds of the Bodhi tree are definitely not used for malas and seeds of 50 or so other species (as per Kunzang's first link here http://dharmawheel.net/viewtopic.php?f= ... 21#p277099 are used. How can we define "real" in this situation?

:namaste:
Kim

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Re: Bodhi seed malas

Post by heart » Fri Apr 10, 2015 5:32 am

Well, when you hear Tibetan lamas talk about Bodhi seeds, they do mean a particular kind of rather dark seeds that have none or very little polish. I think these are from Nepal. Like I mentioned before these seeds have a little sticky point on them if they are not polished. I don't know what tree they come from but they are quite distinct. There are also a large amount of polished beads or seeds that are called Bodhi seeds but that are obviously not the same.

/magnus
"We are all here to help each other go through this thing, whatever it is."
~Kurt Vonnegut

"The principal practice is Guruyoga. But we need to understand that any secondary practice combined with Guruyoga becomes a principal practice." ChNNR (Teachings on Thun and Ganapuja)

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