who's ngondro is it anyway

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michaelb
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Re: who's ngondro is it anyway

Post by michaelb »

Malcolm wrote: It represents the elimination of obstacles. Likewise, if you dream of monks, it is usually a sign of gyalpo provocation.
Thanks, Malcolm. I dreamt that my lama had died years ago, and it really shit me up.
I also had a dream of a "well-known" monk who went to strangle me with a khata and that shit me up, too.

Going back to the topic of this thread, I think I had the first dream whilst I was doing Vajrasattva part of ngondro. I was so concerned I phoned my lama from Tso Pema to check he was alright.
Malcolm
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Re: who's ngondro is it anyway

Post by Malcolm »

michaelb wrote:
Malcolm wrote: It represents the elimination of obstacles. Likewise, if you dream of monks, it is usually a sign of gyalpo provocation.
Thanks, Malcolm. I dreamt that my lama had died years ago, and it really shit me up.
I also had a dream of a "well-known" monk who went to strangle me with a khata and that shit me up, too.

Going back to the topic of this thread, I think I had the first dream whilst I was doing Vajrasattva part of ngondro. I was so concerned I phoned my lama from Tso Pema to check he was alright.
The first sounds like a good dream. The second sounds terrible.
michaelb
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Re: who's ngondro is it anyway

Post by michaelb »

Malcolm wrote:
michaelb wrote:
Malcolm wrote: It represents the elimination of obstacles. Likewise, if you dream of monks, it is usually a sign of gyalpo provocation.
Thanks, Malcolm. I dreamt that my lama had died years ago, and it really shit me up.
I also had a dream of a "well-known" monk who went to strangle me with a khata and that shit me up, too.

Going back to the topic of this thread, I think I had the first dream whilst I was doing Vajrasattva part of ngondro. I was so concerned I phoned my lama from Tso Pema to check he was alright.
The first sounds like a good dream. The second sounds terrible.
Maybe it's not good to say too much, but in the second dream I dreamt I was in Siliguri. HH Dalai Lama was in town. Lots of crowds and people everywhere. I tried to avoid the "circus", as I called it. I turned a corner in some backstreet with light blue flakey painted shop fronts. Suddenly, HH Dalai Lama was right in front of me and put a khata around my neck and pulled it tight. I woke up gasping for breath.
On the face of it, it was a good dream, as I was blessed by HH Dalai Lama, but I don't think it was actually HH Dalai Lama. I also had a bad headache and felt angry for a while after the dream.

I always wondered about why it was very explicitly Siliguri (I was in Tso Pema at the time.) More recently I read about HH Dudjom Rinpoche being arrested in Siliguri and I wondered if there was a connection.

Anyway, sometimes dreams are just dreams. Not sure how far I had got with my ngondro when I had that dream.
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conebeckham
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Re: who's ngondro is it anyway

Post by conebeckham »

Siliguri is a pit. That's why.



(Sorry--just had to toss that out there...)
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It is realized through the blessing grace of the Guru and fortunate Karmic potential.
Like this, mistaken ideas of discriminating wisdom are clarified."
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pemachophel
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Re: who's ngondro is it anyway

Post by pemachophel »

"I don't think it was actually HH Dalai Lama."

IMO, Gyalpo.
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michaelb
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Re: who's ngondro is it anyway

Post by michaelb »

conebeckham wrote:Siliguri is a pit. That's why.

(Sorry--just had to toss that out there...)
True, it is, a proper pit. But any worse than, say, Gorakpur? Specified locations in dreams are odd, especially as I had never spent too long in Siliguri. I only ever used it as a way of getting to Kathmandu. Anyway, maybe I shouldn't have disclosed, but it was one of those really vivid dreams (like the dying lama one).

Anyway...
michaelb
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Re: who's ngondro is it anyway

Post by michaelb »

pemachophel wrote:"I don't think it was actually HH Dalai Lama."

IMO, Gyalpo.
Well, yes. That's what I thought at the time, as well. But who knows? I remember one lama told me that when he had his photo taken with HH Dalai Lama, HH grabbed his neck really tightly, so maybe HH is prone to a bit of strangling?
pael
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Re: who's ngondro is it anyway

Post by pael »

Malcolm wrote:
michaelb wrote:
Malcolm wrote: It represents the elimination of obstacles. Likewise, if you dream of monks, it is usually a sign of gyalpo provocation.
Thanks, Malcolm. I dreamt that my lama had died years ago, and it really shit me up.
I also had a dream of a "well-known" monk who went to strangle me with a khata and that shit me up, too.

Going back to the topic of this thread, I think I had the first dream whilst I was doing Vajrasattva part of ngondro. I was so concerned I phoned my lama from Tso Pema to check he was alright.
The first sounds like a good dream. The second sounds terrible.
I once saw in my dream globe and then in same dream I falled into hell and there were many demons.
Is this bad?
May all beings be free from suffering and causes of suffering
MiphamFan
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Re: who's ngondro is it anyway

Post by MiphamFan »

I once had a fairly scary dream of meeting a "lama" surrounded by monks dressed elaborately like one of those peoples in the Sichuan border between Tibetan and Chinese cultural areas (rgyalrongic?). I was passing through a multi-storey building where "its" group of monks was performing some ritual and I took a look. It gripped my wrists and promised me power if I followed it but gave me a bad vibe. I don't remember all of the dream so clearly but I eventually self-transformed and chased the entity away.
Malcolm
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Re: who's ngondro is it anyway

Post by Malcolm »

michaelb wrote:Suddenly, HH Dalai Lama was right in front of me and put a khata around my neck and pulled it tight. I woke up gasping for breath.

Tulku Drakpa Gyaltsen was murdered with a white kata. Sounds like the Gyalpo to me.
emaho
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Re: who's ngondro is it anyway

Post by emaho »

Wasn't Chatral Rinpoche attacked by someone who tried to strangle him with a khata?
"I struggled with some demons, They were middle class and tame..." L. Cohen
Malcolm
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Re: who's ngondro is it anyway

Post by Malcolm »

emaho wrote:Wasn't Chatral Rinpoche attacked by someone who tried to strangle him with a khata?
Yes, a gyalpo worshipper from the West.
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Re: who's ngondro is it anyway

Post by emaho »

Thanks for the info, I didn't know about the Gyalpo background. Unfortunately the guy was from the West. I was in India around that time and the incident has led to an upsurge of open racism against Westerners in the exile Tibetan community.
"I struggled with some demons, They were middle class and tame..." L. Cohen
pemachophel
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Re: who's ngondro is it anyway

Post by pemachophel »

"the incident has led to an upsurge of open racism against Westerners in the exile Tibetan community."

Even though the guy was totally indoctrinated by Tibetan teachers.

BTW, I thought it was a knife attack, not a khata.

I know the unfortunate student who brought this whack-job to see Chatral Rinpoche. They were immediately put into a three-month Vajrasattva retreat even though they had no idea what this person intended.

When I was treating Chatral Rinpoche (sometimes every day), it took a year before I was ever let alone with Him.

Once when I was doing a three-month retreat in the Catskills, I had a dream where a demon was strangling me. I woke in a panic gasping for air. In that case, there was no doubt about it being a malevolent spirit. Could've been a Gyalpo. After that retreat, I developed heart disease which one Teacher diagnosed as Gyalpo nying-lung, Gyalpo heart wind.
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Könchok Thrinley
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Re: who's ngondro is it anyway

Post by Könchok Thrinley »

Was that attack a reason why Chatral Rinpoche was so hard on westerners or was he like that to anyone?
“Observing samaya involves to remain inseparable from the union of wisdom and compassion at all times, to sustain mindfulness, and to put into practice the guru’s instructions”. Garchen Rinpoche

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goodness is what comes to pass.
For those who do non-virtuous actions,
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michaelb
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Re: who's ngondro is it anyway

Post by michaelb »

Malcolm wrote:
michaelb wrote:Suddenly, HH Dalai Lama was right in front of me and put a khata around my neck and pulled it tight. I woke up gasping for breath.
Tulku Drakpa Gyaltsen was murdered with a white kata. Sounds like the Gyalpo to me.
Yes, I know, but I'm not sure if I knew about the cause of Drakpa Gyaltsen's death at the time when I had my dream.

Regarding the attack on Chatral Sangye Dorje, an American monk I met in Tso Pema says he was there at the time. He said Chatral Sangye Dorje wrestled with his attacker who tried to strangle him, and eventually, with others' help, tied him to a tree before the police arrived. This American monk I knew, Dennis Tenzin, a long-time student of Dilgo Khyentse and Trulshik Rinpoche and family friend of Chatral Sangye Dorje, was full of talk about the gyalpo. He said he felt as if he was being attacked after he had dinner at a Tibetan friend's house and found out that friend was a student of a gyalpo lama. After that he had fallen down some stone steps, been hit by an auto-rickshaw and suffered other misfortunes. This was around 2002. He was in Tso Pema to do some Drolo practice. By time I left India/Nepal in 2005 he was dying of cirrosis of the liver.

I think it was Dennis' regular talk about the gyalpo that led to me being more worried about it and possibly led to the dream. (I had attended NKT classes in the '90s and Dennis was certain that something bad would befall me if I didn't get this empowerment or a blessing from that lama.)

On a 'positive' note, I'm pretty sure I had the dream about my lama dying after I had the Dalai Lama strangling me dream. Maybe that was the obstacle that was being cleared. But it's all quite a long while ago, and hanging around somewhere like Tso Pema, you can have lots of apparently important dreams.
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Re: who's ngondro is it anyway

Post by Punya »

Malcolm wrote:
michaelb wrote:
Malcolm wrote: The reasons for such signs being good or bad are rarely indicated.
Yes but, why, though? Maybe you could indicate now?
It represents the elimination of obstacles. Likewise, if you dream of monks, it is usually a sign of gyalpo provocation.
What about a dakini? A bare breasted young woman recently appeared in a dream, which I subsequently took to be a dakini. I approached her thinking she was my granddaughter (I don't have any grandchildren).
We abide nowhere. We possess nothing.
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Grigoris
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Re: who's ngondro is it anyway

Post by Grigoris »

michaelb wrote:
Malcolm wrote:
michaelb wrote:Suddenly, HH Dalai Lama was right in front of me and put a khata around my neck and pulled it tight. I woke up gasping for breath.
Tulku Drakpa Gyaltsen was murdered with a white kata. Sounds like the Gyalpo to me.
Yes, I know, but I'm not sure if I knew about the cause of Drakpa Gyaltsen's death at the time when I had my dream.

Regarding the attack on Chatral Sangye Dorje, an American monk I met in Tso Pema says he was there at the time. He said Chatral Sangye Dorje wrestled with his attacker who tried to strangle him, and eventually, with others' help, tied him to a tree before the police arrived. This American monk I knew, Dennis Tenzin, a long-time student of Dilgo Khyentse and Trulshik Rinpoche and family friend of Chatral Sangye Dorje, was full of talk about the gyalpo. He said he felt as if he was being attacked after he had dinner at a Tibetan friend's house and found out that friend was a student of a gyalpo lama. After that he had fallen down some stone steps, been hit by an auto-rickshaw and suffered other misfortunes. This was around 2002. He was in Tso Pema to do some Drolo practice. By time I left India/Nepal in 2005 he was dying of cirrosis of the liver.

I think it was Dennis' regular talk about the gyalpo that led to me being more worried about it and possibly led to the dream. (I had attended NKT classes in the '90s and Dennis was certain that something bad would befall me if I didn't get this empowerment or a blessing from that lama.)

On a 'positive' note, I'm pretty sure I had the dream about my lama dying after I had the Dalai Lama strangling me dream. Maybe that was the obstacle that was being cleared. But it's all quite a long while ago, and hanging around somewhere like Tso Pema, you can have lots of apparently important dreams.
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Re: who's ngondro is it anyway

Post by DGA »

Here's a funny dream for your amusement.

12 years ago I was relatively new to Vajrayana and doing my best to practice and study. My best wasn't very good. My practice and presence were full of holes.

I knock off one night and who appears in my dream but a well-known Karma Kagyu lama, a Khenpo. I was seated on the floor and he was standing over me, and he really read me the riot act, pointing out every mistake I'd made and was in the habit of making. It was an intense dressing-down.

I promised I would stop doing the bad things and only do the good things from now on, and that seemed to satisfy him but you could tell he was suspicious of me.

A few years after that I took empowerment from this same Khenpo after moving across the US.

:shrug:
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Re: who's ngondro is it anyway

Post by KristenM »

I've yet to dream of scorpions coming out of my head. Guess I need to do more Ngondro. :smile:

It's hard to say anything as a newcomer here without feeling like a complete idiot. I have had a lot of challenges with doing ngondro. Best thing I ever did was work through it and not entirely give up. I think that anyone can realize Buddhanature without the "preliminaries", but it may help to prepare oneself for a more stable realization. If one has an issue with forgetting the basics of Dharma, it helps. Or am I wrong? :shrug:
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