Refuge and the different school of Tibetan Buddhism.

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Aspiring.Monk
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Refuge and the different school of Tibetan Buddhism.

Post by Aspiring.Monk » Thu Sep 07, 2017 4:15 pm

Hello all,

Recently, I received preliminary practices from a Lama of the Gelug tradition, but have not been able to take refuge as I live very far from any Lama.

Soon, I will have an opportunity to visit a Sakya monastery in Seattle and was wondering if there would be any conflict if I took refuge with a Sakya Lama. Of course, I would first listen to teaching and hopefully speak with the Lama before making any decision to take refuge.

In my mind, I do not see any conflict as for me all paths lead to enlightenment.

Any advice that can be provided will be appreciated.

Thank you.

philji
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Re: Refuge and the different school of Tibetan Buddhism.

Post by philji » Thu Sep 07, 2017 4:32 pm

Always good to remember that you dont take refuge in a lama or a lineage you take refuge in the three jewels. One thing i remember very well from the lama who gave me refuge vows was' dont think taking refuge is joining a club'

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jkarlins
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Re: Refuge and the different school of Tibetan Buddhism.

Post by jkarlins » Thu Sep 07, 2017 5:10 pm

I mean there are lot of questions there, but did you get a lung or wang? That might have some relevance.

Jake

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Aspiring.Monk
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Re: Refuge and the different school of Tibetan Buddhism.

Post by Aspiring.Monk » Thu Sep 07, 2017 5:37 pm

jkarlins wrote:I mean there are lot of questions there, but did you get a lung or wang? That might have some relevance.

Jake
I only received oral transmission for the Golden Light Sutra. This was not done in person as Lama Zopa stated that watching the 5 hour video would give the transmission in full.

Other than that, I have not received any lung or wang.

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smcj
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Re: Refuge and the different school of Tibetan Buddhism.

Post by smcj » Thu Sep 07, 2017 5:56 pm

philji wrote:Always good to remember that you dont take refuge in a lama or a lineage you take refuge in the three jewels. One thing i remember very well from the lama who gave me refuge vows was' dont think taking refuge is joining a club'
:good:
+1
In the Tantra of the Beautiful Auspiciousness (bKra shis mdzes ldan gyi rgyud), this "Great Primordial Purity" (spyi gzhi) is defined as follows:

What is known as "The Great Primordial Purity”
Is the state abiding before authentic Buddhas arose
And before impure sentient beings appeared;
It is called the great Primordial radiance of immutable awareness.

*****
Sometimes you can get shown the light
In the strangest of places
If you look at it right.
-Robert Hunter-

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jkarlins
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Re: Refuge and the different school of Tibetan Buddhism.

Post by jkarlins » Thu Sep 07, 2017 7:44 pm

Aspiring.Monk wrote:
jkarlins wrote:I mean there are lot of questions there, but did you get a lung or wang? That might have some relevance.

Jake
I only received oral transmission for the Golden Light Sutra. This was not done in person as Lama Zopa stated that watching the 5 hour video would give the transmission in full.

Other than that, I have not received any lung or wang.
Hmm. I've taken video transmissions before, although not with Zopa. He's really good, I like him, just never seen him on a video. This is a question for other Gelugpas I think, or people who've received this practice. Good luck!

Jake

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Nyedrag Yeshe
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Re: Refuge and the different school of Tibetan Buddhism.

Post by Nyedrag Yeshe » Mon Sep 11, 2017 1:18 pm

Aspiring.Monk wrote:Hello all,

Recently, I received preliminary practices from a Lama of the Gelug tradition, but have not been able to take refuge as I live very far from any Lama.

Soon, I will have an opportunity to visit a Sakya monastery in Seattle and was wondering if there would be any conflict if I took refuge with a Sakya Lama. Of course, I would first listen to teaching and hopefully speak with the Lama before making any decision to take refuge.

In my mind, I do not see any conflict as for me all paths lead to enlightenment.

Any advice that can be provided will be appreciated.

Thank you.
Refuge is nonsectarian, you are not taking refuge in a sect or individual Lama.
“Whatever has to happen, let it happen!”
“Whatever the situation is, it’s fine!”
“I really don’t need anything!
~Tsangpa Gyare Yeshe Dorje (1161-1211)
ओं पद्मोष्णीष विमले हूँ फट । ओं हनुफशभरहृदय स्वाहा॥
འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔ ཀརྨ་པ་མཁྱེན་ནོ།

philji
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Re: Refuge and the different school of Tibetan Buddhism.

Post by philji » Mon Sep 11, 2017 2:18 pm

Nyedrag Yeshe wrote:
Aspiring.Monk wrote:Hello all,

Recently, I received preliminary practices from a Lama of the Gelug tradition, but have not been able to take refuge as I live very far from any Lama.

Soon, I will have an opportunity to visit a Sakya monastery in Seattle and was wondering if there would be any conflict if I took refuge with a Sakya Lama. Of course, I would first listen to teaching and hopefully speak with the Lama before making any decision to take refuge.

In my mind, I do not see any conflict as for me all paths lead to enlightenment.

Any advice that can be provided will be appreciated.

Thank you.
Refuge is nonsectarian, you are not taking refuge in a sect or individual Lama.
Except Vajrayana refuge is different to hinayana refuge...

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Nyedrag Yeshe
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Re: Refuge and the different school of Tibetan Buddhism.

Post by Nyedrag Yeshe » Mon Sep 11, 2017 4:46 pm

philji wrote:
Nyedrag Yeshe wrote:
Aspiring.Monk wrote:Hello all,

Recently, I received preliminary practices from a Lama of the Gelug tradition, but have not been able to take refuge as I live very far from any Lama.

Soon, I will have an opportunity to visit a Sakya monastery in Seattle and was wondering if there would be any conflict if I took refuge with a Sakya Lama. Of course, I would first listen to teaching and hopefully speak with the Lama before making any decision to take refuge.

In my mind, I do not see any conflict as for me all paths lead to enlightenment.

Any advice that can be provided will be appreciated.

Thank you.
Refuge is nonsectarian, you are not taking refuge in a sect or individual Lama.
Except Vajrayana refuge is different to hinayana refuge...
There is Hinayana and Mahayana refuge, the difference lays in the scope of motivation. Even in Vajrayana, you take refuge in the Lama and lineage as the embodiment of refuge, but not in a sect like Sakya or Gelug. The PO is speaking about a general Sutra level ceremony, not an empowerment!
“Whatever has to happen, let it happen!”
“Whatever the situation is, it’s fine!”
“I really don’t need anything!
~Tsangpa Gyare Yeshe Dorje (1161-1211)
ओं पद्मोष्णीष विमले हूँ फट । ओं हनुफशभरहृदय स्वाहा॥
འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔ ཀརྨ་པ་མཁྱེན་ནོ།

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Johnny Dangerous
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Re: Refuge and the different school of Tibetan Buddhism.

Post by Johnny Dangerous » Mon Sep 11, 2017 5:24 pm

philji wrote:
Nyedrag Yeshe wrote:
Aspiring.Monk wrote:Hello all,

Recently, I received preliminary practices from a Lama of the Gelug tradition, but have not been able to take refuge as I live very far from any Lama.

Soon, I will have an opportunity to visit a Sakya monastery in Seattle and was wondering if there would be any conflict if I took refuge with a Sakya Lama. Of course, I would first listen to teaching and hopefully speak with the Lama before making any decision to take refuge.

In my mind, I do not see any conflict as for me all paths lead to enlightenment.

Any advice that can be provided will be appreciated.

Thank you.
Refuge is nonsectarian, you are not taking refuge in a sect or individual Lama.
Except Vajrayana refuge is different to hinayana refuge...
The refuge ceremony conducted at Sakya Monastery is not a Vajrayana empowerment, would have thought that was obvious.

Anyway, it's a wonderful place and IMO an auspicious place to take refuge, can't see any reason not to do, and many reasons the OP should.
"it must be coming from the mouthy mastermind of raunchy rapper, Johnny Dangerous”

-Jeff H.

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Aspiring.Monk
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Re: Refuge and the different school of Tibetan Buddhism.

Post by Aspiring.Monk » Wed Sep 13, 2017 12:02 am

Johnny Dangerous wrote:
philji wrote:
Nyedrag Yeshe wrote: Refuge is nonsectarian, you are not taking refuge in a sect or individual Lama.
Except Vajrayana refuge is different to hinayana refuge...
The refuge ceremony conducted at Sakya Monastery is not a Vajrayana empowerment, would have thought that was obvious.

Anyway, it's a wonderful place and IMO an auspicious place to take refuge, can't see any reason not to do, and many reasons the OP should.
I have decided to take refuge at Sakya Monastery in Seattle. I have meditated on the issue and I realized that for me personally, it is a situation of One Lesson, Many Teachers. Yes, each Tibetan school has different practices and rituals, but the underlying Dharma is the same. Even the Dalai Lama himself has received teachings from master of all 4 schools.

I want to thank all of you for your insight.

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Virgo
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Re: Refuge and the different school of Tibetan Buddhism.

Post by Virgo » Wed Sep 13, 2017 12:21 am

Aspiring.Monk wrote:Hello all,

Recently, I received preliminary practices from a Lama of the Gelug tradition, but have not been able to take refuge as I live very far from any Lama.

Soon, I will have an opportunity to visit a Sakya monastery in Seattle and was wondering if there would be any conflict if I took refuge with a Sakya Lama. Of course, I would first listen to teaching and hopefully speak with the Lama before making any decision to take refuge.

In my mind, I do not see any conflict as for me all paths lead to enlightenment.
None at all.

Kevin

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Nyedrag Yeshe
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Re: Refuge and the different school of Tibetan Buddhism.

Post by Nyedrag Yeshe » Wed Sep 13, 2017 2:10 am

Aspiring.Monk wrote:
Johnny Dangerous wrote:
philji wrote:
Except Vajrayana refuge is different to hinayana refuge...
The refuge ceremony conducted at Sakya Monastery is not a Vajrayana empowerment, would have thought that was obvious.

Anyway, it's a wonderful place and IMO an auspicious place to take refuge, can't see any reason not to do, and many reasons the OP should.
I have decided to take refuge at Sakya Monastery in Seattle. I have meditated on the issue and I realized that for me personally, it is a situation of One Lesson, Many Teachers. Yes, each Tibetan school has different practices and rituals, but the underlying Dharma is the same. Even the Dalai Lama himself has received teachings from master of all 4 schools.

I want to thank all of you for your insight.
So happy to hear about this, this is the first important step you take towards Buddhahood, your true home! Good luck! May everything be auspicious!
“Whatever has to happen, let it happen!”
“Whatever the situation is, it’s fine!”
“I really don’t need anything!
~Tsangpa Gyare Yeshe Dorje (1161-1211)
ओं पद्मोष्णीष विमले हूँ फट । ओं हनुफशभरहृदय स्वाहा॥
འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔ ཀརྨ་པ་མཁྱེན་ནོ།

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Aspiring.Monk
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Re: Refuge and the different school of Tibetan Buddhism.

Post by Aspiring.Monk » Wed Sep 13, 2017 2:47 am

Nyedrag Yeshe wrote:
Aspiring.Monk wrote:
Johnny Dangerous wrote:
The refuge ceremony conducted at Sakya Monastery is not a Vajrayana empowerment, would have thought that was obvious.

Anyway, it's a wonderful place and IMO an auspicious place to take refuge, can't see any reason not to do, and many reasons the OP should.
I have decided to take refuge at Sakya Monastery in Seattle. I have meditated on the issue and I realized that for me personally, it is a situation of One Lesson, Many Teachers. Yes, each Tibetan school has different practices and rituals, but the underlying Dharma is the same. Even the Dalai Lama himself has received teachings from master of all 4 schools.

I want to thank all of you for your insight.
So happy to hear about this, this is the first important step you take towards Buddhahood, your true home! Good luck! May everything be auspicious!
Thank you for the well wishes. My goal is to ordain by the time I'm 40 and that's only 5 years away. After much consideration and reflection, I have determined that spending my life as a monastic is the most beneficial thing that I could do with it.

Again thank you, everyone, for you insight into this topic. I truly appreciate it.

:buddha1:

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Nyedrag Yeshe
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Re: Refuge and the different school of Tibetan Buddhism.

Post by Nyedrag Yeshe » Wed Sep 13, 2017 2:49 am

Aspiring.Monk wrote:Hello all,

Recently, I received preliminary practices from a Lama of the Gelug tradition, but have not been able to take refuge as I live very far from any Lama.

Soon, I will have an opportunity to visit a Sakya monastery in Seattle and was wondering if there would be any conflict if I took refuge with a Sakya Lama. Of course, I would first listen to teaching and hopefully speak with the Lama before making any decision to take refuge.

In my mind, I do not see any conflict as for me all paths lead to enlightenment.

Any advice that can be provided will be appreciated.

Thank you.
I understand that your thinking might be influenced maybe from a Christian overview. Like being baptised in Catholic church makes you a Catholic. Taking refuge makes you part of the Buddhist community! It's much more like becoming a jew, you join the Jewish community and people, not a Jewish sect!

Taking refuge with a Sakya lama does not make you a Sakyapa, or even the Lama your teacher or guru, he is your first Refuge Master or Lord of Refuge! You can take refuge repeatedly with many different Lamas if you just want to reaffirm or renew your vows! Even if you don't have the slight desire to receive any teachings from him! You will always take it before most tantric empowerments! Like monastic lineage, which in TB is Mulasarvastivada in all schools! Refuge lineages come usually from a common source!
“Whatever has to happen, let it happen!”
“Whatever the situation is, it’s fine!”
“I really don’t need anything!
~Tsangpa Gyare Yeshe Dorje (1161-1211)
ओं पद्मोष्णीष विमले हूँ फट । ओं हनुफशभरहृदय स्वाहा॥
འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔ ཀརྨ་པ་མཁྱེན་ནོ།

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