Dakinis' khatvangas

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Palzang Jangchub
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Dakinis' khatvangas

Post by Palzang Jangchub » Wed May 09, 2018 7:06 am

Is there a way to determine whether the khatvanga of a dakini being taken as one's yidam is topped with a vajra or a trident? Most sadhanas seem to just call it a khatvanga without going into detail.

I know that thangkas can be notoriously unreliable when it comes to subtle details like this, but I've seen both depicted. Should it be topped with a vajra as a general rule unless otherwise specified, since it's often said to be representative of the male consort? Or should it be visualized as identical to the one Guru Rinpoche holds, topped with the trident? Doesn't that version represent the female consort?

Incidentally, if someone would like to explain the tantric symbolism of the khatvanga in detail I'd be most appreciative. I'm pretty familiar with the other adornments and implements, but this is a source of some confusion for me.

Perhaps it's just the case that the particular yidam I'm looking at has various khatvangas depending on which lineage it's from (i.e. I'd have to ask my lamas; go figure)...
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"The Sutras, Tantras, and Philosophical Scriptures are great in number. However life is short, and intelligence is limited, so it's hard to cover them completely. You may know a lot, but if you don't put it into practice, it's like dying of thirst on the shore of a great lake. Likewise, a common corpse is found in the bed of a great scholar." ~ Karma Chagme

དྲིན་ཆེན་རྩ་བའི་བླ་མ་སྐྱབས་རྗེ་མགར་ཆེན་ཁྲི་སྤྲུལ་རིན་པོ་ཆེ་ཁྱེད་མཁྱེན་ནོ།།
རྗེ་བཙུན་བླ་མ་མཁས་གྲུབ་ཀརྨ་ཆགས་མེད་མཁྱེན་ནོ། ཀརྨ་པ་མཁྱེན་ནོཿ

Fortyeightvows
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Re: Dakinis' khatvangas

Post by Fortyeightvows » Wed May 09, 2018 7:31 am

Palzang Jangchub wrote:
Wed May 09, 2018 7:06 am
since it's often said to be representative of
Thats all a bit much for the public forum, don't you think bro?

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Palzang Jangchub
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Re: Dakinis' khatvangas

Post by Palzang Jangchub » Wed May 09, 2018 7:41 am

Thought the very basic explanation of the symbolism that can be found readily in online descriptions and books like those of Robert Beer were okay to mention here. If not, the moderators can move this to Buddhist Tantra Talk... I'd be just as happy with a response via PM.
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"The Sutras, Tantras, and Philosophical Scriptures are great in number. However life is short, and intelligence is limited, so it's hard to cover them completely. You may know a lot, but if you don't put it into practice, it's like dying of thirst on the shore of a great lake. Likewise, a common corpse is found in the bed of a great scholar." ~ Karma Chagme

དྲིན་ཆེན་རྩ་བའི་བླ་མ་སྐྱབས་རྗེ་མགར་ཆེན་ཁྲི་སྤྲུལ་རིན་པོ་ཆེ་ཁྱེད་མཁྱེན་ནོ།།
རྗེ་བཙུན་བླ་མ་མཁས་གྲུབ་ཀརྨ་ཆགས་མེད་མཁྱེན་ནོ། ཀརྨ་པ་མཁྱེན་ནོཿ

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Mantrik
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Re: Dakinis' khatvangas

Post by Mantrik » Wed May 09, 2018 8:00 am

I don't have the address, but you could always email Robert Beer for more detail.
I suspect it may be, as you say, a matter of lineage and the interpretation of it individual to a particular empowerment.
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