Limits to Redemption in Each Tradition?

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Motova
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Limits to Redemption in Each Tradition?

Post by Motova »

How long does one have to repair their samaya in each tradition until they're guarenteed to burn in Vajra Hell for millions and billions and trillions of years?

Bon?

Nyingma?

Kaygu?

Sakya?

Gelug?
To become a rain man one must master the ten virtues and sciences.
Motova
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Re: Limits to Redemption in Each Tradition?

Post by Motova »

Also what texts specify the time restrictions?
To become a rain man one must master the ten virtues and sciences.
Tenma
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Re: Limits to Redemption in Each Tradition?

Post by Tenma »

Motova wrote: Fri Jun 01, 2018 1:13 pm How long does one have to repair their samaya in each tradition until they're guarenteed to burn in Vajra Hell for millions and billions and trillions of years?

Bon?

Nyingma?

Kaygu?

Sakya?

Gelug?
Why care in difference? They all seem to be the same on the hell thing.
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Sādhaka
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Re: Limits to Redemption in Each Tradition?

Post by Sādhaka »

The three year thing is provisional.

Rinpoche wrote that there’s a text where Vajrasattva says you have as many years to purify, as the age you were when you committed the downfall. It is just that after three years it becomes more difficult.

Maybe this only applies to Dzogchen, and/or the Nyingma tradition?

Btw, he didn’t name the text; so if you really want to find out what text says that, you might have to ask him.
Last edited by Sādhaka on Fri Jun 01, 2018 9:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Aryjna
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Re: Limits to Redemption in Each Tradition?

Post by Aryjna »

As it is very easy to repair it, it does not seem very important how long the time limit is. Unless someone decides they do not want anything to do with Buddhism for the rest of their lives, in which case they are also transgressing the bodhisattva vow, which is probably going to send you to hell anyway.
Motova
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Re: Limits to Redemption in Each Tradition?

Post by Motova »

Tenma wrote: Fri Jun 01, 2018 7:08 pm
Motova wrote: Fri Jun 01, 2018 1:13 pm How long does one have to repair their samaya in each tradition until they're guarenteed to burn in Vajra Hell for millions and billions and trillions of years?

Bon?

Nyingma?

Kaygu?

Sakya?

Gelug?
Why care in difference? They all seem to be the same on the hell thing.
No, Nyingma seems to not have a limit:
pemachophel wrote: Sun Dec 17, 2017 5:53 pm Pael,

And/or practice the shakpa/confession titled Narak Dong-trug Kan-shag (Dredging the Depths of Hell Fulfillment & Confession). It is said that this shakpa can purify all breeches of samaya regardless of how long ago they were committed. So not to worry. However, should try to get the lung if possible.
Are there anymore practices that claim to have the strength of purification as the Narak Dong-trug Kan-shag?
pemachophel wrote: Mon Dec 18, 2017 4:56 pm just ask a Longchen Nyingthig Lama if He/She has this text. They probably will. Most Longchen Nyingthig practitioners know this by heart.
Is the Longchen Nyingthig the only lineage with this ability?
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Fortyeightvows
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Re: Limits to Redemption in Each Tradition?

Post by Fortyeightvows »

the lam rim says that karma grows. This is one of the reasons why the word 'seed' is used so often.
I have heard something like if a sin is not purified before the next day will greatly increase. I don't remember the source or if it was even a "really buddhist" source. but I think that according the lam rim and seeds growing it makes sense. Could be why so many daily practices, six-session and daily sadhanas always have some purification part.
My father always gives the advice to always make up before you go to bed.
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Aryjna
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Re: Limits to Redemption in Each Tradition?

Post by Aryjna »

Motova wrote: Fri Jun 01, 2018 9:03 pm
Tenma wrote: Fri Jun 01, 2018 7:08 pm
Motova wrote: Fri Jun 01, 2018 1:13 pm How long does one have to repair their samaya in each tradition until they're guarenteed to burn in Vajra Hell for millions and billions and trillions of years?

Bon?

Nyingma?

Kaygu?

Sakya?

Gelug?
Why care in difference? They all seem to be the same on the hell thing.
No, Nyingma seems to not have a limit:
pemachophel wrote: Sun Dec 17, 2017 5:53 pm Pael,

And/or practice the shakpa/confession titled Narak Dong-trug Kan-shag (Dredging the Depths of Hell Fulfillment & Confession). It is said that this shakpa can purify all breeches of samaya regardless of how long ago they were committed. So not to worry. However, should try to get the lung if possible.
Are there anymore practices that claim to have the strength of purification as the Narak Dong-trug Kan-shag?
pemachophel wrote: Mon Dec 18, 2017 4:56 pm just ask a Longchen Nyingthig Lama if He/She has this text. They probably will. Most Longchen Nyingthig practitioners know this by heart.
Is the Longchen Nyingthig the only lineage with this ability?
https://shop.shangshungfoundation.com/e ... &results=7 ChNNR gives the lung, though it seems not very often.
Motova
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Re: Limits to Redemption in Each Tradition?

Post by Motova »

:hi:
To become a rain man one must master the ten virtues and sciences.
Pero
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Re: Limits to Redemption in Each Tradition?

Post by Pero »

Aryjna wrote: Sat Jun 02, 2018 9:35 am
pemachophel wrote: Sun Dec 17, 2017 5:53 pm Pael,

And/or practice the shakpa/confession titled Narak Dong-trug Kan-shag (Dredging the Depths of Hell Fulfillment & Confession). It is said that this shakpa can purify all breeches of samaya regardless of how long ago they were committed. So not to worry. However, should try to get the lung if possible.
https://shop.shangshungfoundation.com/e ... &results=7 ChNNR gives the lung, though it seems not very often.
I don't think this is the same practice that Pema Chopel mentioned. Narak konshak is a long text of confession, not sure from whom. BTW, does anyone have this text that they could send me? I don't have the lung but I liked it a lot (if I'm not mixing it up with something else). I'll try to get the lung if I can although I'm not sure how easy it'll be, as I recall it's quite long.

Narag Tongtrug from the link is from Lochen Dharmashri. It doesn't contain a confession, at least not in the form that is in that text, could be that there is also a longer version. Jamgon Kongtrul says in Buddhist Ethics that if you do Narag Tongtrug you purify everything but it's not clear to which one he is reffering to.
Although many individuals in this age appear to be merely indulging their worldly desires, one does not have the capacity to judge them, so it is best to train in pure vision.
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kalden yungdrung
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Re: Limits to Redemption in Each Tradition?

Post by kalden yungdrung »

Tashi delek,

I am not sure if this helps:

viewtopic.php?f=41&t=28619
The best meditation is no meditation
Motova
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Re: Limits to Redemption in Each Tradition?

Post by Motova »

Motova wrote: Fri Jun 01, 2018 1:13 pm How long does one have to repair their samaya in each tradition until they're guarenteed to burn in Vajra Hell for millions and billions and trillions of years?

Bon?

Nyingma?

Kaygu?

Sakya?

Gelug?
:focus:
To become a rain man one must master the ten virtues and sciences.
Motova
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Re: Limits to Redemption in Each Tradition?

Post by Motova »

Motova wrote: Fri Jun 01, 2018 1:26 pm Also what texts specify the time restrictions?
:focus:
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Motova
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Re: Limits to Redemption in Each Tradition?

Post by Motova »

:hi:
To become a rain man one must master the ten virtues and sciences.
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Josef
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Re: Limits to Redemption in Each Tradition?

Post by Josef »

Motova wrote: Fri Jun 01, 2018 1:26 pm Also what texts specify the time restrictions?
Considering that we are on the path of eliminating limitations wouldnt it seem more fruitful to look in that direction?
Unless this is a purely academic pursuit the practices that lead to liberation are a more useful focus.
"All phenomena of samsara depend on the mind, so when the essence of mind is purified, samsara is purified. Since the phenomena of nirvana depend on the pristine consciousness of vidyā, because one remains in the immediacy of vidyā, buddhahood arises on its own. All critical points are summarized with those two." - Longchenpa
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Sādhaka
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Re: Limits to Redemption in Each Tradition?

Post by Sādhaka »

For anyone interested, see what is highlighted in yellow here on page 199:

https://books.google.com/books?id=JWuxA ... AHoECAAQAQ

Then after reading page 200 in light of this, we can see that according to this book the practice descended from Padampa Sangye & Machik Labdron is sufficient, even if more than three years have passed.
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Sādhaka
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Re: Limits to Redemption in Each Tradition?

Post by Sādhaka »

Also, Longchenpa wrote in The Great Chariot that the eighth of the lunar calendar (tomorrow; then also the 10th, two days after) is very powerful for purification (perhaps this about the eighth is a Sarma influence?). And Chokhor-Duchen in July:

https://fpmt.org/media/resources/dharma-dates/

https://fpmt.org/teachers/zopa/advice/sakadawa/
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Sādhaka
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Re: Limits to Redemption in Each Tradition?

Post by Sādhaka »

Sādhaka wrote: Wed Jun 20, 2018 7:29 am For anyone interested, see what is highlighted in yellow here on page 199:

https://books.google.com/books?id=JWuxA ... AHoECAAQAQ

Then after reading page 200 in light of this, we can see that according to this book the practice descended from Padampa Sangye & Machik Labdron is sufficient, even if more than three years have passed.

Now page 200 is mostly blank and is saying you have reached your preview limit, when it wasn’t when I first posted the link.

Hopefully it isn’t saying that now for you too, because you have to read page 200 for the context of what I wrote above in relation to what is written in the book on page 199.

Though it looks like this book is worth reading from cover to cover....
Motova
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Re: Limits to Redemption in Each Tradition?

Post by Motova »

:hi:
To become a rain man one must master the ten virtues and sciences.
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Josef
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Re: Limits to Redemption in Each Tradition?

Post by Josef »

Motova wrote: Wed Jun 20, 2018 11:51 pm:hi:
Is there something specific you're looking for in these threads?
"All phenomena of samsara depend on the mind, so when the essence of mind is purified, samsara is purified. Since the phenomena of nirvana depend on the pristine consciousness of vidyā, because one remains in the immediacy of vidyā, buddhahood arises on its own. All critical points are summarized with those two." - Longchenpa
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