Chögyam Trungpa

Forum for discussion of Tibetan Buddhism. Questions specific to one school are best posted in the appropriate sub-forum.
User avatar
kalden yungdrung
Posts: 4606
Joined: Sun Aug 01, 2010 10:40 pm

Chögyam Trungpa

Post by kalden yungdrung » Wed Jun 19, 2019 9:09 pm

Tashi delek,

Like Chögyam Trungpa´s direct approach.
That shows also the photo, isn´t it?
Many do not like that.


======================

The daily practice is simply the development of the complete acceptance and open to all situations and emotions, as well as all people, the experience of everything in a total way without mental prejudiced and blocks, so that you never leave yourself and do not concentrate on yourself.

The way of Maha-ATI. Chögyam Trungpa

Trungpa Rinpoche - 00.jpg
Trungpa Rinpoche - 00.jpg (121.48 KiB) Viewed 1582 times
The best meditation is no meditation

Simon E.
Posts: 7204
Joined: Tue May 15, 2012 11:09 am

Re: Chögyam Trungpa

Post by Simon E. » Wed Jun 19, 2019 10:00 pm

I know that face..
“The difference between us and Tara is that she knows she doesn’t exist”.

User avatar
Johnny Dangerous
Global Moderator
Posts: 10435
Joined: Fri Nov 02, 2012 10:58 pm
Location: Olympia WA
Contact:

Re: Chögyam Trungpa

Post by Johnny Dangerous » Wed Jun 19, 2019 10:05 pm

People have such varying opinions on Trungpa, he was such a lightning rod. I have to admit though that I have immense faith in his works, Cutting Through Spiritual Materialism completely changed my life and got me involved in the Dharma, I have always felt some sort of connection with him and even had some "hmmm" experiences of phenomena related to him.

Indeed his method is pretty inscrutable, I don't begrudge people their opinions in either camp, but I have to admit he has been a huge influence on me, as have a couple of his students (no, not the ones embroiled in scandal;)).
"...if you think about how many hours, months and years of your life you've spent looking at things, being fascinated by things that have now passed away, then how wonderful to spend even five minutes looking into the nature of your own mind."

-James Low

User avatar
tobes
Posts: 1539
Joined: Fri Dec 24, 2010 5:02 am

Re: Chögyam Trungpa

Post by tobes » Wed Jun 19, 2019 11:48 pm

The number of people he has actually turned to the Dharma is incredible. It's still happening now.

Motova
Posts: 1302
Joined: Sun Sep 16, 2012 11:05 pm

Re: Chögyam Trungpa

Post by Motova » Thu Jun 20, 2019 5:30 pm

His regent was strike two and his son was strike three for me.

User avatar
Johnny Dangerous
Global Moderator
Posts: 10435
Joined: Fri Nov 02, 2012 10:58 pm
Location: Olympia WA
Contact:

Re: Chögyam Trungpa

Post by Johnny Dangerous » Thu Jun 20, 2019 6:14 pm

Motova wrote:
Thu Jun 20, 2019 5:30 pm
His regent was strike two and his son was strike three for me.
His lineage also produced a number of good and great teachers who are less in the limelight.
"...if you think about how many hours, months and years of your life you've spent looking at things, being fascinated by things that have now passed away, then how wonderful to spend even five minutes looking into the nature of your own mind."

-James Low

User avatar
Sonam Wangchug
Posts: 343
Joined: Sat Feb 06, 2010 8:26 pm

Re: Chögyam Trungpa

Post by Sonam Wangchug » Thu Jun 20, 2019 6:25 pm

tobes wrote:
Wed Jun 19, 2019 11:48 pm
The number of people he has actually turned to the Dharma is incredible. It's still happening now.
It really is incredible. I didn't really get how deeply he was affecting people until I stayed in Colorado for a while. He is still a name on peoples lips all over the place, in coffee shops for example.

There are those that are not necessarily involved in the Tibetan tradition formally, nor do they have a living teacher, and yet they benefit from reading his works, and regard him as a teacher in their life.

Some students also report encountering, and being blessed by him in their dreams 'til this day.

As Rinpoche's will says: "Born a monk
Died a King
such Thunderstorm does not stop
We will be haunting you, along with the dralas!
Jolly Good luck!"
"To have confidence in the teacher is the ultimate refuge." -Rigzin Jigme Lingpa

User avatar
Johnny Dangerous
Global Moderator
Posts: 10435
Joined: Fri Nov 02, 2012 10:58 pm
Location: Olympia WA
Contact:

Re: Chögyam Trungpa

Post by Johnny Dangerous » Thu Jun 20, 2019 6:36 pm

Sonam Wangchug wrote:
Thu Jun 20, 2019 6:25 pm
tobes wrote:
Wed Jun 19, 2019 11:48 pm
The number of people he has actually turned to the Dharma is incredible. It's still happening now.
It really is incredible. I didn't really get how deeply he was affecting people until I stayed in Colorado for a while. He is still a name on peoples lips all over the place, in coffee shops for example.

There are those that are not necessarily involved in the Tibetan tradition formally, nor do they have a living teacher, and yet they benefit from reading his works, and regard him as a teacher in their life.

Some students also report encountering, and being blessed by him in their dreams 'til this day.

As Rinpoche's will says: "Born a monk
Died a King
such Thunderstorm does not stop
We will be haunting you, along with the dralas!
Jolly Good luck!"
Yep, i'm convinced his mojo is still out there. I don't want to share anything too personal, but I have had an extremely positive experience and "pointing out" as it were that was connected to him. Such strong and meaningful (and frankly -healing-) experiences convinced me that regardless of some of the confused phenomena surrounding his lineage, there is something very real and precious in what he put into the world as well.

He was before my time in this dimension, but he has seriously changed my life, and most definitely for the better. I get how some people would find that hard to believe or think the negativity associated with Shambhala should change that for me, but it doesn't, it's pretty unshakable.
"...if you think about how many hours, months and years of your life you've spent looking at things, being fascinated by things that have now passed away, then how wonderful to spend even five minutes looking into the nature of your own mind."

-James Low

User avatar
Sonam Wangchug
Posts: 343
Joined: Sat Feb 06, 2010 8:26 pm

Re: Chögyam Trungpa

Post by Sonam Wangchug » Thu Jun 20, 2019 7:01 pm

Johnny Dangerous wrote:
Thu Jun 20, 2019 6:36 pm
Sonam Wangchug wrote:
Thu Jun 20, 2019 6:25 pm
tobes wrote:
Wed Jun 19, 2019 11:48 pm
The number of people he has actually turned to the Dharma is incredible. It's still happening now.
It really is incredible. I didn't really get how deeply he was affecting people until I stayed in Colorado for a while. He is still a name on peoples lips all over the place, in coffee shops for example.

There are those that are not necessarily involved in the Tibetan tradition formally, nor do they have a living teacher, and yet they benefit from reading his works, and regard him as a teacher in their life.

Some students also report encountering, and being blessed by him in their dreams 'til this day.

As Rinpoche's will says: "Born a monk
Died a King
such Thunderstorm does not stop
We will be haunting you, along with the dralas!
Jolly Good luck!"
Yep, i'm convinced his mojo is still out there. I don't want to share anything too personal, but I have had an extremely positive experience and "pointing out" as it were that was connected to him. Such strong and meaningful (and frankly -healing-) experiences convinced me that regardless of some of the confused phenomena surrounding his lineage, there is something very real and precious in what he put into the world as well.

He was before my time in this dimension, but he has seriously changed my life, and most definitely for the better. I get how some people would find that hard to believe or think the negativity associated with Shambhala should change that for me, but it doesn't, it's pretty unshakable.
:good:

Yeah, just looking at the lengthy list of incredible teachers supporting his activities on the chronicle project says a lot. People say many things about Trungpa Rinpoche, some good, and some bad. However I believe without a doubt that teachers such as HH the 16th Karmapa and HH Dilgo Khyentse Rinpoche posessed the kind of Wisdom that could easily discern a truly realized teacher from a fraudulent one.

Some people might also think that for an authentic "pointing out" to take place one has to be with a living teacher, in their presence. However, that's also not true. My refuge teacher said in Tibet there did exist a tradition of teachers sending out pointing out instructions via a letter to a student, and that this was an accepted and valid path. So, I believe as a combination of Rinpoche's teachings, his blessings and wisdom mind being beyond time and space, and the students devotion and openness, a student can surely be introduced to their wisdom mind.

Traleg Rinpoche said that there were parallels between Guru Rinpoche bringing the Dharma to Tibet, and Trungpa Rinpoche bringing the Dharma to the West. I believe this is true, it took a special person to do what he did. I believe it was not only the case because of his Wisdom and Skillful means, but what Tibetans call "Lung ten" or it was something prophetic that was a specific activity Rinpoche had a karmic connection with to accomplish.

Among one of his many talents, Rinpoche was skilled in Mirror Divination. I have heard a story that when Rinpoche was originally staying in India before coming to the West and teaching there, Thrangu Rinpoche asked him what he was going to do in the future. Rinpoche took out a Melong that he was wearing on his neck and stared into it, and said "I'm going to the West."

Incredible teacher.
"To have confidence in the teacher is the ultimate refuge." -Rigzin Jigme Lingpa

User avatar
tobes
Posts: 1539
Joined: Fri Dec 24, 2010 5:02 am

Re: Chögyam Trungpa

Post by tobes » Fri Jun 21, 2019 1:19 am

Sonam Wangchug wrote:
Thu Jun 20, 2019 6:25 pm
tobes wrote:
Wed Jun 19, 2019 11:48 pm
The number of people he has actually turned to the Dharma is incredible. It's still happening now.
It really is incredible. I didn't really get how deeply he was affecting people until I stayed in Colorado for a while. He is still a name on peoples lips all over the place, in coffee shops for example.

There are those that are not necessarily involved in the Tibetan tradition formally, nor do they have a living teacher, and yet they benefit from reading his works, and regard him as a teacher in their life.

Some students also report encountering, and being blessed by him in their dreams 'til this day.

As Rinpoche's will says: "Born a monk
Died a King
such Thunderstorm does not stop
We will be haunting you, along with the dralas!
Jolly Good luck!"
This is not the sort of thing I usually post, but since the thread is here and you mentioned it:

I had just such a dream earlier this week. Well, it was not a dream, it was the guru's blessing. Very visceral and direct. I am happy to mention this because there is always a question mark around these threads, and for whatever lowly answer my own experience represents, here it is.

Has never happened before (well, not with CTR). I'm too young to be a direct student, and have not even been doing much Karma Kagyu practice.

User avatar
Sonam Wangchug
Posts: 343
Joined: Sat Feb 06, 2010 8:26 pm

Re: Chögyam Trungpa

Post by Sonam Wangchug » Fri Jun 21, 2019 2:32 am

tobes wrote:
Fri Jun 21, 2019 1:19 am
Sonam Wangchug wrote:
Thu Jun 20, 2019 6:25 pm
tobes wrote:
Wed Jun 19, 2019 11:48 pm
The number of people he has actually turned to the Dharma is incredible. It's still happening now.
It really is incredible. I didn't really get how deeply he was affecting people until I stayed in Colorado for a while. He is still a name on peoples lips all over the place, in coffee shops for example.

There are those that are not necessarily involved in the Tibetan tradition formally, nor do they have a living teacher, and yet they benefit from reading his works, and regard him as a teacher in their life.

Some students also report encountering, and being blessed by him in their dreams 'til this day.

As Rinpoche's will says: "Born a monk
Died a King
such Thunderstorm does not stop
We will be haunting you, along with the dralas!
Jolly Good luck!"
This is not the sort of thing I usually post, but since the thread is here and you mentioned it:

I had just such a dream earlier this week. Well, it was not a dream, it was the guru's blessing. Very visceral and direct. I am happy to mention this because there is always a question mark around these threads, and for whatever lowly answer my own experience represents, here it is.

Has never happened before (well, not with CTR). I'm too young to be a direct student, and have not even been doing much Karma Kagyu practice.
Thank you for sharing your experience.

I also do not like to talk about such things, but since everyone here is sharing and it's to Rinpoche's credit. I had a very similar experience a few months ago.

It happened when there were many people critiquing Rinpoche in a thread here, and I was one of those in the minority camp of supporting him. Due to the nature of the dream, and the utter rawness of it, I knew immediately that it was a communication.

I don't particularly have any involvement with Shambala, and I have never dreamed of Rinpoche before either.

Good to know he's well and kicking.
"To have confidence in the teacher is the ultimate refuge." -Rigzin Jigme Lingpa

udawa
Posts: 138
Joined: Thu Dec 16, 2010 1:10 pm

Re: Chögyam Trungpa

Post by udawa » Fri Jun 21, 2019 8:20 am

tobes wrote:
Wed Jun 19, 2019 11:48 pm
The number of people he has actually turned to the Dharma is incredible. It's still happening now.
Hunting his prey
With fearless compassion
Undying wakefulness
Chogyam the tiger
Still roams in his forest


.
Edwards: You are a philosopher. Dr Johnson: I have tried too in my time to be a philosopher; but, I don't know how, cheerfulness was always breaking in.

Simon E.
Posts: 7204
Joined: Tue May 15, 2012 11:09 am

Re: Chögyam Trungpa

Post by Simon E. » Fri Jun 21, 2019 10:05 am

At his funeral a close friend (of his and of mine) gave a eulogy which included the line “ l never knew anyone who did so much good or so much harm”.

Both aspects are true. I will always be grateful. And always regret what might have been. And never regret seeking teaching elsewhere even though at the time that was enormously painful.

As for him becoming a dream symbol for people who never met him..I can just see his raised eyebrow at that one. :smile:
“The difference between us and Tara is that she knows she doesn’t exist”.

User avatar
Könchok Thrinley
Former staff member
Posts: 1917
Joined: Fri Jul 24, 2015 11:18 am

Re: Chögyam Trungpa

Post by Könchok Thrinley » Fri Jun 21, 2019 11:15 am

:good:
“Observing samaya involves to remain inseparable from the union of wisdom and compassion at all times, to sustain mindfulness, and to put into practice the guru’s instructions”. Garchen Rinpoche

Formerly known as Miroku.

udawa
Posts: 138
Joined: Thu Dec 16, 2010 1:10 pm

Re: Chögyam Trungpa

Post by udawa » Fri Jun 21, 2019 11:48 am

£$&^@ wrote:
Fri Jun 21, 2019 10:05 am
At his funeral a close friend (of his and of mine) gave a eulogy which included the line “ l never knew anyone who did so much good or so much harm”.

Both aspects are true. I will always be grateful. And always regret what might have been. And never regret seeking teaching elsewhere even though at the time that was enormously painful.

As for him becoming a dream symbol for people who never met him..I can just see his raised eyebrow at that one. :smile:
CTR, April 4, 1987

for Chogyam Trungpa, Rinpoche

April rain,
Cold April rain.
Tibetan fog horns thunder
in Halifax harbor.

The Buddha said,
The Buddha says,
“Everything that’s put together
Falls apart.”

You caused more trouble
And did more good
Than anyone I’ll ever know
.

And now you’ve gone across
And left us holding
The diamond space of your heart
In our folded hands.

— Rick Fields
from “F**k You, Cancer”

https://www.chronicleproject.com/introd ... m-trungpa/

My emphasis.

Not sure if it is Rick Fields you are referencing here Simon? Quite a poem.
Edwards: You are a philosopher. Dr Johnson: I have tried too in my time to be a philosopher; but, I don't know how, cheerfulness was always breaking in.

muni
Posts: 4851
Joined: Fri Apr 17, 2009 6:59 am

Re: Chögyam Trungpa

Post by muni » Fri Jun 21, 2019 11:55 am

Wonderful how people could benefit from Maha Siddha Trungpa. _/\_ Emaho!

If I had met him, I would have run in high speed towards the first nearby church or go to seek shelter among the Egyptian Gods in the British museum.
The nature of just what is, in all things, is undifferentiated.
When purified, it is the nature of the tathagata.
Therefore all living beings possess that nucleus.

The fortress of the spacious and timeless expanse has no division into
higher or lower or in between.

Simon E.
Posts: 7204
Joined: Tue May 15, 2012 11:09 am

Re: Chögyam Trungpa

Post by Simon E. » Fri Jun 21, 2019 3:15 pm

udawa wrote:
Fri Jun 21, 2019 11:48 am
£$&^@ wrote:
Fri Jun 21, 2019 10:05 am
At his funeral a close friend (of his and of mine) gave a eulogy which included the line “ l never knew anyone who did so much good or so much harm”.

Both aspects are true. I will always be grateful. And always regret what might have been. And never regret seeking teaching elsewhere even though at the time that was enormously painful.

As for him becoming a dream symbol for people who never met him..I can just see his raised eyebrow at that one. :smile:
CTR, April 4, 1987

for Chogyam Trungpa, Rinpoche

April rain,
Cold April rain.
Tibetan fog horns thunder
in Halifax harbor.

The Buddha said,
The Buddha says,
“Everything that’s put together
Falls apart.”

You caused more trouble
And did more good
Than anyone I’ll ever know
.

And now you’ve gone across
And left us holding
The diamond space of your heart
In our folded hands.

— Rick Fields
from “F**k You, Cancer”

https://www.chronicleproject.com/introd ... m-trungpa/

My emphasis.

Not sure if it is Rick Fields you are referencing here Simon? Quite a poem.
Rick was referencing the eulogy I mentioned and tidying it up a little. As I recall Rick was s
at the funeral.A few short years go by and a bunch of the same people are at Ricks funeral. Cie le vie. Telle est la mort.
“The difference between us and Tara is that she knows she doesn’t exist”.

User avatar
Johnny Dangerous
Global Moderator
Posts: 10435
Joined: Fri Nov 02, 2012 10:58 pm
Location: Olympia WA
Contact:

Re: Chögyam Trungpa

Post by Johnny Dangerous » Fri Jun 21, 2019 5:15 pm

£$&^@ wrote:
Fri Jun 21, 2019 10:05 am


As for him becoming a dream symbol for people who never met him..I can just see his raised eyebrow at that one. :smile:
These aren't experiences meant for validation or testing by others (well, maybe teachers) - this is part of the reason they are reluctantly shared I think. Nonetheless, whatever people want to think about their origin, the fact that there are so many people with this sort of reaction to CTR so many years after his death is a testament to his importance.
"...if you think about how many hours, months and years of your life you've spent looking at things, being fascinated by things that have now passed away, then how wonderful to spend even five minutes looking into the nature of your own mind."

-James Low

Simon E.
Posts: 7204
Joined: Tue May 15, 2012 11:09 am

Re: Chögyam Trungpa

Post by Simon E. » Fri Jun 21, 2019 6:34 pm

I’m sure he would have been pleased Johnny. At one time he started to talk a lot about Jungian archetypes after Ginsberg introduced him to the concept. The idea that he would have become an archetypal figure himself would I think have tickled him pink..
“The difference between us and Tara is that she knows she doesn’t exist”.

User avatar
Johnny Dangerous
Global Moderator
Posts: 10435
Joined: Fri Nov 02, 2012 10:58 pm
Location: Olympia WA
Contact:

Re: Chögyam Trungpa

Post by Johnny Dangerous » Fri Jun 21, 2019 6:41 pm

£$&^@ wrote:
Fri Jun 21, 2019 6:34 pm
I’m sure he would have been pleased Johnny. At one time he started to talk a lot about Jungian archetypes after Ginsberg introduced him to the concept. The idea that he would have become an archetypal figure himself would I think have tickled him pink..
I'm sure, from his writings it always seemed like he a fantastic sense of the cosmic irony behind synchronicity...someone remembered as an iconoclast as archetype, kind of fitting lol.
"...if you think about how many hours, months and years of your life you've spent looking at things, being fascinated by things that have now passed away, then how wonderful to spend even five minutes looking into the nature of your own mind."

-James Low

Post Reply

Return to “Tibetan Buddhism”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 73 guests