How can one's progress be tested?

Discussion of meditation in the Mahayana and Vajrayana traditions.
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Wayfarer
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Re: How can one's progress be tested?

Post by Wayfarer » Sun Oct 18, 2015 9:51 am

In a day-to-day sense, you take your own personal dramas less seriously. They still happen, but it's like 'oh, you again'. They don't have the same overwhelming storm-und-drang that they used to have. One of my favourite sayings from my early days of meditation practice was this one: 'my life has been a whole series of crises, most of which never occurred.' :smile:
Only practice with no gaining idea ~ Suzuki-roshi

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seeker242
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Re: How can one's progress be tested?

Post by seeker242 » Sun Oct 18, 2015 12:14 pm

You can consult with a learned master and ask them to test you. :smile:
One should not kill any living being, nor cause it to be killed, nor should one incite any other to kill. Do never injure any being, whether strong or weak, in this entire universe!

zenman
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Re: How can one's progress be tested?

Post by zenman » Sun Oct 18, 2015 12:33 pm

seeker242 wrote:You can consult with a learned master and ask them to test you. :smile:
I did try this a few months back when a known kagyu elder lama came to my town. I have seen several of his videos, books and I looked for to the meeting a lot. I met him in private, introduced myself and made this request to him. He replied that he can't see into my mind in the sense that he doesn't have the ability that he could test me and give his analysis of my situation. I thanked him anyway though I was disappointed. I live in a place where lamas don't visit often, and mostly they are young ones who don't have similar juice to them as the elder ones.

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avisitor
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Re: How can one's progress be tested?

Post by avisitor » Mon Oct 19, 2015 2:32 am

What kind of progress are you looking for?

Being posted in the Meditation section, I would assume that you want to know how your meditation is going.
Well, meditation is a practice. You can tell how it is going. You watch yourself and see if you stay on task (whether that is counting breaths or sitting in silence)
And you see whether your mind chases thoughts.
Later on, you should see yourself in the space between thoughts
The thoughts no longer have their pull upon you.
Concentration becomes better. Stuff like that are your signs of progress in meditation.

But, if your question is about your progress on the path to enlightenment then ...
Your answer is exactly like that person said. No one can see into your mind and judge what state you are at.
However, if you are with a teacher and he has watched your progress then he/she can tell you if you have made any progress.

Don't listen to those who say you can test your progress by getting a deadly disease.
That is a test for where your head is at and not so much where you are in your quest for enlightenment
But, as some have said, you are looking for your head which you have always had
You just don't realize that yet. What does that mean? IDK

Edit: It seems some think where one's head is at is a result of one's practice
But, you could already be in a good head space then how would you know if you made any progress?

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LastLegend
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Re: How can one's progress be tested?

Post by LastLegend » Mon Oct 19, 2015 7:26 am

It's like eating orange, you would know the taste.
NAMO AMITABHA
NAM MO A DI DA PHAT (VIETNAMESE)
NAMO AMITUOFO (CHINESE)

Bodhidharma [my translation]
―I come to the East to transmit this clear knowing mind without constructing any dharma―

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LastLegend
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Re: How can one's progress be tested?

Post by LastLegend » Mon Oct 19, 2015 9:24 am

Otherwise, you are a spineless chump unworthy of calling yourself "zenman". I don't say that to insult you.
NAMO AMITABHA
NAM MO A DI DA PHAT (VIETNAMESE)
NAMO AMITUOFO (CHINESE)

Bodhidharma [my translation]
―I come to the East to transmit this clear knowing mind without constructing any dharma―

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avisitor
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Re: How can one's progress be tested?

Post by avisitor » Wed Oct 21, 2015 2:05 pm

LastLegend wrote:It's like eating orange, you would know the taste.
But, if you have never had enlightenment before
Then how would you know it?
LastLegend wrote:Otherwise, you are a spineless chump unworthy of calling yourself "zenman". I don't say that to insult you.
I don't call myself a Zenman. Spineless? ... nah. Unworthy? ... who is judge me?
You don't have to say anything to be insulting
A snarl or sneer is enough to know what you're thinking ... hahahaha

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Astus
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Re: How can one's progress be tested?

Post by Astus » Wed Oct 21, 2015 3:26 pm

zenman wrote:How can one's progress in meditation and in the buddhist path be tested?
If it is a specific method of meditation, there are stages of progress. You may consult your meditation instructor and the relevant meditation manuals.

Progress on the Buddhist path has a number of traditional measurements already mentioned.

Test Your Enlightenment
1 Myriad dharmas are only mind.
Mind is unobtainable.
What is there to seek?

2 If the Buddha-Nature is seen,
there will be no seeing of a nature in any thing.

3 Neither cultivation nor seated meditation —
this is the pure Chan of Tathagata.

4 With sudden enlightenment to Tathagata Chan,
the six paramitas and myriad means
are complete within that essence.


1 Huangbo, T2012Ap381c1 2 Nirvana Sutra, T374p521b3; tr. Yamamoto 3 Mazu, X1321p3b23; tr. J. Jia 4 Yongjia, T2014p395c14; tr. from "The Sword of Wisdom"

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avisitor
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Re: How can one's progress be tested?

Post by avisitor » Thu Oct 22, 2015 2:14 pm

Astus wrote:
zenman wrote:How can one's progress in meditation and in the buddhist path be tested?
If it is a specific method of meditation, there are stages of progress. You may consult your meditation instructor and the relevant meditation manuals.

Progress on the Buddhist path has a number of traditional measurements already mentioned.

Test Your Enlightenment
What does the progress in meditation have to do with the progress in the Buddhist path?
Are the two related in such a way as to be able to use one to gauge the other?

amanitamusc
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Re: How can one's progress be tested?

Post by amanitamusc » Thu Oct 22, 2015 2:34 pm

Good question.

Firstly,what type of meditation is it?

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Astus
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Re: How can one's progress be tested?

Post by Astus » Thu Oct 22, 2015 3:33 pm

avisitor wrote:What does the progress in meditation have to do with the progress in the Buddhist path?
Are the two related in such a way as to be able to use one to gauge the other?
As amanitamusc wrote, it depends on the type of meditation used.
1 Myriad dharmas are only mind.
Mind is unobtainable.
What is there to seek?

2 If the Buddha-Nature is seen,
there will be no seeing of a nature in any thing.

3 Neither cultivation nor seated meditation —
this is the pure Chan of Tathagata.

4 With sudden enlightenment to Tathagata Chan,
the six paramitas and myriad means
are complete within that essence.


1 Huangbo, T2012Ap381c1 2 Nirvana Sutra, T374p521b3; tr. Yamamoto 3 Mazu, X1321p3b23; tr. J. Jia 4 Yongjia, T2014p395c14; tr. from "The Sword of Wisdom"

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