Sh#t is f@cked up and bull sh*t

The best place for discussion of current events. News about Buddhists and Buddhism is particularly welcome.
Post Reply
User avatar
Queequeg
Global Moderator
Posts: 5933
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2012 3:24 pm

Sh#t is f@cked up and bull sh*t

Post by Queequeg » Mon Aug 06, 2018 3:18 pm

Image

When Lewis Lapham got old and started slowing down, Frank Rich stepped in at Harper's. I think Mr. Rich might be hitting a stride. A kind of voice we need to deliver a message with the weight of lead. No jokes or hashtags.

For your reading pleasure.

http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/20 ... dream.html

Speaking of great, left/progressive columnists, IMHO, no black writer has been able to fill Bob Herbert's shoes. Ta Nehisi Coates is still too young - hasn't hit the level of age and experience where objectivity and detachment takes over.

Opinionists like wine - they need to age and mellow a little into their role.
Those who, even with distracted minds,
Entered a stupa compound
And chanted but once, “Namo Buddhaya!”
Have certainly attained the path of the buddhas.

-Lotus Sutra, Expedient Means Chapter

I think each human being has things to find out in his own life that are inescapable. They’ll find them out the easy way or the hard way, or whatever.
-Jerry Garcia

User avatar
Queequeg
Global Moderator
Posts: 5933
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2012 3:24 pm

Re: Sh#t is f@cked up and bull sh*t

Post by Queequeg » Mon Aug 06, 2018 4:57 pm

An interesting aside about Bob Herbert; this is his bio from Britannica:
Herbert grew up in Montclair, New Jersey. He began his career in journalism in 1970 as a reporter for The Star-Ledger in Newark, New Jersey; three years later he became the publication’s night city editor. From 1976 to 1985 Herbert worked as a reporter and an editor for the New York Daily News, where he joined the editorial board and became one of its columnists. He received a B.A. in journalism from Empire State College in 1988.
Notice he received his bachelor's degree 18 years after he got into the news business. His career is one of those examples that you just don't see anymore - a person without "credentials" breaking into a field and excelling - IIRC he started in the mail room and moved up to editor in three years at the Star Ledger.
Those who, even with distracted minds,
Entered a stupa compound
And chanted but once, “Namo Buddhaya!”
Have certainly attained the path of the buddhas.

-Lotus Sutra, Expedient Means Chapter

I think each human being has things to find out in his own life that are inescapable. They’ll find them out the easy way or the hard way, or whatever.
-Jerry Garcia

User avatar
Grigoris
Global Moderator
Posts: 17657
Joined: Fri May 14, 2010 9:27 pm
Location: Greece

Re: Sh#t is f@cked up and bull sh*t

Post by Grigoris » Mon Aug 06, 2018 5:37 pm

That is a really good article.
"My religion is not deceiving myself."
Jetsun Milarepa 1052-1135 CE

"Butchers, prostitutes, those guilty of the five most heinous crimes, outcasts, the underprivileged: all are utterly the substance of existence and nothing other than total bliss."
The Supreme Source - The Kunjed Gyalpo
The Fundamental Tantra of Dzogchen Semde

User avatar
Quay
Posts: 305
Joined: Mon May 16, 2016 6:07 pm

Re: Sh#t is f@cked up and bull sh*t

Post by Quay » Thu Aug 09, 2018 2:29 am

Queequeg wrote:
Mon Aug 06, 2018 3:18 pm
Image
That is a great picture...for all the ages.
When Lewis Lapham got old and started slowing down, Frank Rich stepped in at Harper's. I think Mr. Rich might be hitting a stride. A kind of voice we need to deliver a message with the weight of lead. No jokes or hashtags.

For your reading pleasure.

http://nymag.com/daily/intelligencer/20 ... dream.html
Wow, that really is a great article. Thank you for posting it as otherwise I'd have missed it.
Opinionists like wine - they need to age and mellow a little into their role.
That's probably generally true unless you're George Carlin or Gore Vidal.
"Knowledge is as infinite as the stars in the sky;
There is no end to all the subjects one could study.
It is better to grasp straight away their very essence--
The unchanging fortress of the Dharmakaya."

– Longchenpa.

User avatar
justsit
Posts: 925
Joined: Wed Oct 21, 2009 9:24 pm
Location: Delaware

Re: Sh#t is f@cked up and bull sh*t

Post by justsit » Thu Aug 09, 2018 6:30 pm

Great article. Possibly the most succinct, unbiased summary of the origins of our current shitstorm I've read. Will be passing this one along.

Hindsight is of course 20/20. I'd love to read an article as cogently written on what options we have for the future. Recommendations?

"Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security."
- The Declaration of Independence (US, 1776)

User avatar
Queequeg
Global Moderator
Posts: 5933
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2012 3:24 pm

Re: Sh#t is f@cked up and bull sh*t

Post by Queequeg » Thu Aug 09, 2018 7:37 pm

justsit wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 6:30 pm
I'd love to read an article as cogently written on what options we have for the future. Recommendations?
How about James Fallows?

https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/ar ... er/426882/
Those who, even with distracted minds,
Entered a stupa compound
And chanted but once, “Namo Buddhaya!”
Have certainly attained the path of the buddhas.

-Lotus Sutra, Expedient Means Chapter

I think each human being has things to find out in his own life that are inescapable. They’ll find them out the easy way or the hard way, or whatever.
-Jerry Garcia

User avatar
justsit
Posts: 925
Joined: Wed Oct 21, 2009 9:24 pm
Location: Delaware

Re: Sh#t is f@cked up and bull sh*t

Post by justsit » Sun Aug 12, 2018 12:53 am

Interesting article, thanks for posting. I couldn't find a date on it, it seems to have been written pre-2016 election?

Several disparate comments:
1) The instances of small town/small business rejuvenations are encouraging. These projects can provide the impetus for growth, but I'm not sure that they can provide decent jobs in the sorts of numbers that are needed in more urban areas.

2)Also glad to hear the arts are receiving some kind of support on local levels. They certainly are not on the national scale.

3)"It’s now commonplace to observe that the United States is living through a Second Gilded Age." Not really sure where that comes from, I have never heard that term applied to this era. It may be a gilded age for the wealthy, but not so much for the rest of us. The author, though, flies around the US in a private small plane with some frequency, so perhaps in his social circles this is discussed more often than in mine.

I'm looking for an article geared a bit more to the current political issues addressed in the article I posted, rather than a look at small glimmers of hope. In particular, I'm looking to see the problem of wealth distribution and how it can be improved addressed in concrete terms that are neither inflammatory nor utopian. I'm not entirely sure such a thing exists.

User avatar
Malcolm
Posts: 28243
Joined: Thu Nov 11, 2010 2:19 am

Re: Sh#t is f@cked up and bull sh*t

Post by Malcolm » Sun Aug 12, 2018 3:09 am

justsit wrote:
Sun Aug 12, 2018 12:53 am

3)"It’s now commonplace to observe that the United States is living through a Second Gilded Age." Not really sure where that comes from, I have never heard that term applied to this era. It may be a gilded age for the wealthy, but not so much for the rest of us.
That is the point, the gilded age was one of the eras in US history when wealth disparity was at its height.
Buddhahood in This Life
འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


[A]nything at all that is well spoken is the word of the Buddha.

-- Ārya-adhyāśaya-sañcodana-nāma-mahāyāna-sūtra

The different sūtras in accord with the emptiness
taught by the Sugata are definitive in meaning;
One can understand that all of those Dharmas in
which a sentient being, individual, or person are taught are provisional in meaning.

-- Samadhirāja Sūtra

passel
Posts: 424
Joined: Sat Sep 29, 2012 5:30 am

Re: Sh#t is f@cked up and bull sh*t

Post by passel » Sun Aug 12, 2018 5:09 am

Good article.

“Gilded” age was the name because there was this abundance of superficial prosperity, bc the Industrial Revolution has begun to really kick in, releasing great veins of new wealth, but that wealth was being rapidly gobbled up by the “Robber barons”. (On the one hand, they built the US Public Library system; on the other, they needed to have their goons crack a lot of skulls to do it, and so on.). So big income disparities that haven’t really gone away- New Deal was an attempt to keep them in check, but that’s pretty compromised at this point.

“Gilded” because everything had this veneer of gold, but underneath it was all just crappy junk. We’re all just squatting on someone else’s business model, aren’t we
"I have made a heap of all that I have met"- Svetonious

User avatar
Queequeg
Global Moderator
Posts: 5933
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2012 3:24 pm

Re: Sh#t is f@cked up and bull sh*t

Post by Queequeg » Sun Aug 12, 2018 8:16 pm

justsit wrote:
Sun Aug 12, 2018 12:53 am
Interesting article, thanks for posting. I couldn't find a date on it, it seems to have been written pre-2016 election?

Several disparate comments:
1) The instances of small town/small business rejuvenations are encouraging. These projects can provide the impetus for growth, but I'm not sure that they can provide decent jobs in the sorts of numbers that are needed in more urban areas.

2)Also glad to hear the arts are receiving some kind of support on local levels. They certainly are not on the national scale.

3)"It’s now commonplace to observe that the United States is living through a Second Gilded Age." Not really sure where that comes from, I have never heard that term applied to this era. It may be a gilded age for the wealthy, but not so much for the rest of us. The author, though, flies around the US in a private small plane with some frequency, so perhaps in his social circles this is discussed more often than in mine.

I'm looking for an article geared a bit more to the current political issues addressed in the article I posted, rather than a look at small glimmers of hope. In particular, I'm looking to see the problem of wealth distribution and how it can be improved addressed in concrete terms that are neither inflammatory nor utopian. I'm not entirely sure such a thing exists.
The revolution will not be televised.

In answer to 1 - no, the efforts profiled by Fallows will not bring jobs to inner cities in the volume needed to break poverty there. They are redefining the "good life," though. The "Sex and the City"/"Friends" nightmare of young urban living needs to be put to death. I will come back to the "good life".

Here's the unvarnished truth about that, as far as I see: there are too many people for the present economic model to employ, and as automation, AI, and robotics develop, there will be even fewer jobs for low skilled workers. This is part of the problem with wealth distribution - the capitalist system just doesn't need all this unskilled labor. Nobody has an answer to this. Maybe the decline in birthrates will eventually get us to an equilibrium, but without some serious concerted effort to discourage birth rates around the world, we're not getting there fast enough. This is also an environmental issue.

Some other options are a redefinition of the "good life" as above. Capitalism introduces a certain definition of the good life as well as a base line of stress and desperation that is amplified at the lower end of the economic spectrum. Its hard for the "good life" to be redefined when stress and desperation dominates the day to day life. We need slack. We need to do something about poverty and since the capitalist wealth distribution model is becoming less and less effective, we need to think of other alternatives. Universal income? Maybe. It would need to be accompanied by a robust cultivation of a new culture.

A combination of things need to be done - alter the economic model to more fairly distribute wealth; reduce population; promote a sustainable, humane definition of "good life".

I don't anyone is talking about this stuff. The things I outlined are all 3rd rails.
Those who, even with distracted minds,
Entered a stupa compound
And chanted but once, “Namo Buddhaya!”
Have certainly attained the path of the buddhas.

-Lotus Sutra, Expedient Means Chapter

I think each human being has things to find out in his own life that are inescapable. They’ll find them out the easy way or the hard way, or whatever.
-Jerry Garcia

User avatar
Supramundane
Posts: 188
Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2016 11:38 am
Location: Jakarta, Indonesia

Re: Sh#t is f@cked up and bull sh*t

Post by Supramundane » Tue Aug 14, 2018 1:46 am

that article is way too pessimistic. the light on gatsby's dock is still there.

people can argue when the decline of the US empire began: was it the Kennedy assassination? was it the war in vietnam? 9/11?

but none of that is important. great civilizations regenerate themselves. look at the Roman empire. it continued after the fall for centuries as the eastern empire. some contend it continues even today as the Catholic church.

and there is something someone alluded to that trumps everything (sorry for the choice of words!): the power of the individual.

with your cellphone you have access to all human knowledge; you don't rely on the whims of some Cambridge don to accept you if you want to get an education; you can study and work online; you can be fully independent from geography in terms of your residence and workplace; and that's just off the top of my head. this is the real revolution that is happening in the background of all this trumped up noise.

your consciousness is being suffused all over the world... you can communicate with any human being anywhere on the planet 24/7 in any language! (thanks to translation programs)

who cares about Trump or Obama or whatever you want to complain about?

when i was growing up as a teenage i was interested in Buddhism. but there wasn't a singple Buddhist anywhere in my community. there were few books. i saw one brief 10 minute snippet in a documentary on 'Religions of the World". now i have DW... i have all info at my fingertips on any tradition i want. i have translations of all the major Buddhist texts... this is an incredible development in my lifetime...!

the individual is becoming so powerful that these problems are fading away. in my view, anyway. interested to hear your views.

User avatar
Queequeg
Global Moderator
Posts: 5933
Joined: Tue Jul 03, 2012 3:24 pm

Re: Sh#t is f@cked up and bull sh*t

Post by Queequeg » Tue Aug 14, 2018 4:55 am

Supramundane wrote:
Tue Aug 14, 2018 1:46 am
that article is way too pessimistic. the light on gatsby's dock is still there.
What's the green light mean?

Did not like that book. Never understood people who did. I felt like they misunderstood it. Like those people who watched Wall Street and thought Gordon Gecko was a hero.
people can argue when the decline of the US empire began: was it the Kennedy assassination? was it the war in vietnam? 9/11?
When the rest of the industrialized world rebuilt after WWII and the US couldn't win just because they showed up.
great civilizations regenerate themselves.


Or they just die. I don't see any pharoahs walking around Egypt anymore. But they did for thousands of years. All gone. Done. Finished. Legends buried under sand.
with your cellphone you have access to all human knowledge; you don't rely on the whims of some Cambridge don to accept you if you want to get an education; you can study and work online; you can be fully independent from geography in terms of your residence and workplace; and that's just off the top of my head. this is the real revolution that is happening in the background of all this trumped up noise.
And yet what takes up much of the global bandwidth? Porn.
when i was growing up as a teenage i was interested in Buddhism. but there wasn't a singple Buddhist anywhere in my community. there were few books. i saw one brief 10 minute snippet in a documentary on 'Religions of the World". now i have DW... i have all info at my fingertips on any tradition i want. i have translations of all the major Buddhist texts... this is an incredible development in my lifetime...!
And yet... DW gets a few thousand visits a day, and this is supposedly the most popular Mahayana/Vajrayana Buddhist discussion forums on the internet. Maybe we should have a forum for cat videos with Buddhist themes.

What's the message of a book that's never read?

A little cynicism for your gosh darn boot strap optimism. lol
Those who, even with distracted minds,
Entered a stupa compound
And chanted but once, “Namo Buddhaya!”
Have certainly attained the path of the buddhas.

-Lotus Sutra, Expedient Means Chapter

I think each human being has things to find out in his own life that are inescapable. They’ll find them out the easy way or the hard way, or whatever.
-Jerry Garcia

User avatar
Supramundane
Posts: 188
Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2016 11:38 am
Location: Jakarta, Indonesia

Re: Sh#t is f@cked up and bull sh*t

Post by Supramundane » Tue Aug 14, 2018 8:38 am

QQ, ya bro omg haha yes a bit dark.
but interesting to hear your take.
tx

Post Reply

Return to “News & Current Events”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: rory and 16 guests