Would someone explain a bit about dzogchen meditation basics

Thomas_Pynchon
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Re: Would someone explain a bit about dzogchen meditation ba

Post by Thomas_Pynchon » Wed Oct 01, 2014 9:28 pm

I have been having ever deepening experiences like this recently.

Tonight I again awoke out of the thought stream, into a transparent place, where I saw how my body reacts with discomfort to the presence of other people.

I was walking along the street. In the same way that the body may react when seeing an attractive wo/man, I found myself subtly reacting to the presence of people around me with very subtle unpleasant sensations in the body.

I felt it most prominently as a band of tightness across the chest. I went into these sensations and very gradually effaced them so that I no longer 'reacted' to the presence of other people. But what I saw was how I seem to suffer from social anxiety, I had never really thought of it like this before, and I saw how I was consumed by the narratives, fears and worries of my life, all of which had corresponding sensations/tensions in the body. It is a tunnel vision, which I awoke from. I saw how I had created a 'life' from these little narratives running my life, neurosis is what I think the technical name would be, a rats nest of sensations/thoughts in the body that are driven by our story, of who we believe we are.

I became transparent, an observer. I also saw that when the thought stream subsided, when the 'story' of my life vanished, when that illusion of direction and intention and the sense of having control over my life stopped, then what I saw was the true strangeness of what this is.

It was a seeing without interpretation, without reaction to external circumstances. There was only clarity, light, surface, colors, movement, and love. Everyone looked beautiful in there own way.

I asked myself 'where is the present moment', where is it, now, now, now, now, and then that thought vanished and I sort of was left in the indescribable eternal presence of experience. There was no moment, just this, experience.

This seems to have awoken at this time, when I am going through a very difficult decision of whether to change everything in my life and go to live and work in the middle east. Not something I want to do, but the remuneration is excellent, and it would be great opportunity which comes at a very good time. But I can't do it, and I don't know why really. I'm sick of trying to figure out what up, can't convince my heart that everything would be cool. I get a contraction, resistance, every time I go to write that acceptance email.

So this was the narrative which disappeared, the whole thrust of it vanished, it really did feel like I just awoke out of it, like surfacing after being under water your whole life. You gasp. Waking out of the story of your life into a dream, a beautiful inexplicable dream.

Any folks with similar experience to share? What would you say this was all about? :yinyang:

Lotus_Bitch
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Joined: Tue Feb 14, 2012 12:24 am

Re: Would someone explain a bit about dzogchen meditation ba

Post by Lotus_Bitch » Wed Oct 01, 2014 9:55 pm

Paul wrote:
Jesse wrote: From whatI understand there isn't much difference between dzogchen and zen.
The difference is that Dzogchen has teachings on lhundrup...
Which employ methods working with tantric anatomy: http://www.dharmawheel.net/viewtopic.ph ... 99#p218399.
Many meditators know how to meditate,
But only a few know how to dismantle [mental clinging].
- Je Gyare

florin
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Re: Would someone explain a bit about dzogchen meditation ba

Post by florin » Thu Oct 02, 2014 12:16 am

heart wrote:
Jesse wrote:
ngodrup wrote: Understanding is actually not what Dzogchen is aiming for.

/magnus
That is not quite accurate Magnus

"If we do not understand that the whole
of samsara and nirvana is the Rolpa of our vision, even if we declare that we
have discovered our Rigpa, know that it does not
correspond to the real meaning because Knowledge
means understanding and having the certainty that
samsara and nirvana in the absolute are the na­ture of primordial purity. And since the view is also nothing other than this be sure to ascertain this profound point!


CNNr

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heart
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Re: Would someone explain a bit about dzogchen meditation ba

Post by heart » Thu Oct 02, 2014 4:22 am

alpha wrote:
heart wrote: Understanding is actually not what Dzogchen is aiming for.

/magnus
That is not quite accurate Magnus

"If we do not understand that the whole
of samsara and nirvana is the Rolpa of our vision, even if we declare that we
have discovered our Rigpa, know that it does not
correspond to the real meaning because Knowledge
means understanding and having the certainty that
samsara and nirvana in the absolute are the na­ture of primordial purity. And since the view is also nothing other than this be sure to ascertain this profound point!


CNNr
Ordinary knowledge, understanding or certainty don't help at all. If it did all scholars would be siddhas.

/magnus
"We are all here to help each other go through this thing, whatever it is."
~Kurt Vonnegut

"The principal practice is Guruyoga. But we need to understand that any secondary practice combined with Guruyoga becomes a principal practice." ChNNR (Teachings on Thun and Ganapuja)

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Sönam
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Re: Would someone explain a bit about dzogchen meditation ba

Post by Sönam » Thu Oct 02, 2014 8:43 am

Lotus_Bitch wrote:
Paul wrote:
Jesse wrote: From whatI understand there isn't much difference between dzogchen and zen.
The difference is that Dzogchen has teachings on lhundrup...
Which employ methods working with tantric anatomy: http://www.dharmawheel.net/viewtopic.ph ... 99#p218399.
Not at all ... Dzogchen is not workin with anything. Perhaps you speak about Mahayoga.

Sönam
By understanding everything you perceive from the perspective of the view, you are freed from the constraints of philosophical beliefs.
By understanding that any and all mental activity is meditation, you are freed from arbitrary divisions between formal sessions and postmeditation activity.
- Longchen Rabjam -

Lotus_Bitch
Posts: 283
Joined: Tue Feb 14, 2012 12:24 am

Re: Would someone explain a bit about dzogchen meditation ba

Post by Lotus_Bitch » Thu Oct 02, 2014 2:43 pm

Sönam wrote:
Lotus_Bitch wrote:
Paul wrote:
The difference is that Dzogchen has teachings on lhundrup...
Which employ methods working with tantric anatomy: http://www.dharmawheel.net/viewtopic.ph ... 99#p218399.
Not at all ... Dzogchen is not workin with anything. Perhaps you speak about Mahayoga.

Sönam
Of course, but being as it may, it has tantric methods.
Many meditators know how to meditate,
But only a few know how to dismantle [mental clinging].
- Je Gyare

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conebeckham
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Re: Would someone explain a bit about dzogchen meditation ba

Post by conebeckham » Thu Oct 02, 2014 3:35 pm

Dzogchen can include any methods, but the only essential thing is to have successfully received the Pointing Out Instruction, and to know how to subsequently access the natural state.

Without a qualified master's introduction, there is no method at all.
དམ་པའི་དོན་ནི་ཤེས་རབ་ཆེ་བ་དང་།
རྟོག་གེའི་ཡུལ་མིན་བླ་མའི་བྱིན་རླབས་དང་།
སྐལ་ལྡན་ལས་འཕྲོ་ཅན་གྱིས་རྟོགས་པ་སྟེ།
དེ་ནི་ཤེས་རབ་ལ་ནི་ལོ་རྟོག་སེལ།།


"Absolute Truth is not an object of analytical discourse or great discriminating wisdom,
It is realized through the blessing grace of the Guru and fortunate Karmic potential.
Like this, mistaken ideas of discriminating wisdom are clarified."
- (Kyabje Bokar Rinpoche, from his summary of "The Ocean of Definitive Meaning")

oldbob
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Re: Would someone explain a bit about dzogchen meditation ba

Post by oldbob » Sun Oct 05, 2014 10:06 pm

conebeckham wrote:Dzogchen can include any methods, but the only essential thing is to have successfully received the Pointing Out Instruction, and to know how to subsequently access the natural state.

Without a qualified master's introduction, there is no method at all.
:good:

This is the single key point.

As many have mentioned in this thread, any explanations, or understandings, of Dzogchen methods and meditation are not / not Dzogchen meditation.

Resting in the natural state, content with whatever arises or doesn't arise, all explanations, methods, and meditations are harmonized and resolved.

Hence the poetic expression of "The Six Vajra Verses."

The nature of the variety of phenomena is non-dual
Yet each phenomena is beyond the limits of the mind
The authentic condition as it is does not become a concept
Yet it manifests totally in form, always good
All being already perfect, overcome the sickness of effort
And remain naturally in self-perfection: this is contemplation.

Chogyel Namkhai Norbu and Adriano Clemente from "The Supreme Source."

http://www.amazon.com/The-Supreme-Sourc ... 1559391200" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Words about Dzogchen don't get better than this.

:heart:

Crazywisdom
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Re: Would someone explain a bit about dzogchen meditation ba

Post by Crazywisdom » Mon Oct 06, 2014 4:34 pm

Sönam wrote:
Lotus_Bitch wrote:
Paul wrote: The difference is that Dzogchen has teachings on lhundrup...
Which employ methods working with tantric anatomy: http://www.dharmawheel.net/viewtopic.ph ... 99#p218399.
Not at all ... Dzogchen is not workin with anything. Perhaps you speak about Mahayoga.

Sönam
Kati is Thogal
I got my Chili Chilaya.

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