New Longchenpa translations from Eric Fry-Miller

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Malcolm
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Re: New Longchenpa translations from Eric Fry-Miller

Post by Malcolm » Tue Jun 20, 2017 1:49 pm

Lingpupa wrote:
Malcolm wrote:
dzogchungpa wrote:
In this case I believe 'presencing' originally comes from English translations of Heidegger's 'anwesen'.
Even worse. There is no use in mixing up Dzogchen language with the jargon of Western Philosophers.
I agree with my whole heart!
But I reply because, although it is quite a few years since I read any significant amount of Guenther's work, I recall that one of the great difficulties was that he threw terminology from the phenomenological/existentialist tradition exemplified by Heidegger into his translations without explanation, almost as if to imply that the terminology had a clear, obvious, and usable meaning, or as if to imply that it was necessary to have studied that continental philosophical thinking before being able to engage properly with Buddhism. Perhaps, in this case, he did explain it, but I would be surprised.
Guenther's works cannot be taken seriously as studies of Dzogchen texts. Despite his obvious kindness to the tradition and number of people like Steve Goodman and Jim Valby whom he encouraged to study it, his books are not about Dzogchen. They are about mapping Western philosophy onto an non-Western tradition. I predict Guenther studies will become a thing someday.
Buddhahood in This Life
འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


[A]nything at all that is well spoken is the word of the Buddha.

-- Ārya-adhyāśaya-sañcodana-nāma-mahāyāna-sūtra

The different sūtras in accord with the emptiness
taught by the Sugata are definitive in meaning;
One can understand that all of those Dharmas in
which a sentient being, individual, or person are taught are provisional in meaning.

-- Samadhirāja Sūtra

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dzogchungpa
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Re: New Longchenpa translations from Eric Fry-Miller

Post by dzogchungpa » Tue Jun 20, 2017 4:43 pm

Um, for the record, I am not a big fan of Guenther's stuff either. I just thought "absurd neologisms" was a bit too flip.
There is not only nothingness because there is always, and always can manifest. - Thinley Norbu Rinpoche

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Malcolm
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Re: New Longchenpa translations from Eric Fry-Miller

Post by Malcolm » Tue Jun 20, 2017 4:50 pm

dzogchungpa wrote:Um, for the record, I am not a fan of Guenther's stuff either. I just thought "absurd neologisms" was a bit too flip.
I said it, and I am sticking too it: "ground-presencing" is an absurd neologism. Incidentally, anwesen is also a noun in German meaning "property." Sure you didn't mean "anwesend," adj. "present?"
Buddhahood in This Life
འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


[A]nything at all that is well spoken is the word of the Buddha.

-- Ārya-adhyāśaya-sañcodana-nāma-mahāyāna-sūtra

The different sūtras in accord with the emptiness
taught by the Sugata are definitive in meaning;
One can understand that all of those Dharmas in
which a sentient being, individual, or person are taught are provisional in meaning.

-- Samadhirāja Sūtra

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dzogchungpa
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Re: New Longchenpa translations from Eric Fry-Miller

Post by dzogchungpa » Tue Jun 20, 2017 5:08 pm

Malcolm wrote:
dzogchungpa wrote:Um, for the record, I am not a fan of Guenther's stuff either. I just thought "absurd neologisms" was a bit too flip.
I said it, and I am sticking too it: "ground-presencing" is an absurd neologism.
Very good. :smile:
Malcolm wrote:Incidentally, anwesen is also a noun in German meaning "property." Sure you didn't mean "anwesend," adj. "present?"
Nope, see e.g.: http://www.scielo.org.co/pdf/unph/v28n57/v28n57a09.pdf.

Also, I don't know much German and I know even less about Heidegger so I can't really answer questions relating to this term, at least, not yet.
There is not only nothingness because there is always, and always can manifest. - Thinley Norbu Rinpoche

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Malcolm
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Re: New Longchenpa translations from Eric Fry-Miller

Post by Malcolm » Tue Jun 20, 2017 5:17 pm

dzogchungpa wrote:
Also, I don't know much German, and I know even less about Heidegger so I can't really answer questions relating to this term, at least, not yet.
So it is even worse, we have an absurd neologism based upon a questionable translation of a German word because someone is infatuated with Heidegger and Guenther.


Basically, Heidegger was the worst thing that ever happened to Dzogchen.
Buddhahood in This Life
འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


[A]nything at all that is well spoken is the word of the Buddha.

-- Ārya-adhyāśaya-sañcodana-nāma-mahāyāna-sūtra

The different sūtras in accord with the emptiness
taught by the Sugata are definitive in meaning;
One can understand that all of those Dharmas in
which a sentient being, individual, or person are taught are provisional in meaning.

-- Samadhirāja Sūtra

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dzogchungpa
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Re: New Longchenpa translations from Eric Fry-Miller

Post by dzogchungpa » Tue Jun 20, 2017 6:03 pm

Malcolm wrote:
dzogchungpa wrote:
Also, I don't know much German, and I know even less about Heidegger so I can't really answer questions relating to this term, at least, not yet.
So it is even worse, we have an absurd neologism based upon a questionable translation of a German word because someone is infatuated with Heidegger and Guenther.


Basically, Heidegger was the worst thing that ever happened to Dzogchen.
With all due respect, whatevs. :smile:
There is not only nothingness because there is always, and always can manifest. - Thinley Norbu Rinpoche

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Lingpupa
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Re: New Longchenpa translations from Eric Fry-Miller

Post by Lingpupa » Wed Jun 21, 2017 9:21 am

dzogchungpa wrote:
Malcolm wrote:
dzogchungpa wrote:Um, for the record, I am not a fan of Guenther's stuff either. I just thought "absurd neologisms" was a bit too flip.
I said it, and I am sticking too it: "ground-presencing" is an absurd neologism.
Very good. :smile:
Malcolm wrote:Incidentally, anwesen is also a noun in German meaning "property." Sure you didn't mean "anwesend," adj. "present?"
Nope, see e.g.: http://www.scielo.org.co/pdf/unph/v28n57/v28n57a09.pdf.

Also, I don't know much German and I know even less about Heidegger so I can't really answer questions relating to this term, at least, not yet.
As it happens I'm quite fluent in German (made my living with it for the last 20 years), though I should say not a scholar of the language or of Heidegger, so I'm slightly sticking my neck out here. Anyway, "anwesen" as a verb is not known to regular German dictionaries. The pdf quoted above does seem to say that Heidegger used it as a verb, but I'd venture that a) it was a neologism when H used it, b) a weird one at that, and c) not one that caught on with any significant number of writers.

So maybe translating it with a scarcely comprehensible neologism is good translation! :thinking:
All the best
Alex Wilding
Stupa in the Snow blog at http://chagchen.org/

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Re: New Longchenpa translations from Eric Fry-Miller

Post by Karma_Yeshe » Wed Jun 21, 2017 10:26 am

Lingpupa wrote:
Malcolm wrote:Incidentally, anwesen is also a noun in German meaning "property." Sure you didn't mean "anwesend," adj. "present?"
Nope, see e.g.: http://www.scielo.org.co/pdf/unph/v28n57/v28n57a09.pdf.

Also, I don't know much German and I know even less about Heidegger so I can't really answer questions relating to this term, at least, not yet.
Lingpupa wrote: As it happens I'm quite fluent in German (made my living with it for the last 20 years), though I should say not a scholar of the language or of Heidegger, so I'm slightly sticking my neck out here. Anyway, "anwesen" as a verb is not known to regular German dictionaries. The pdf quoted above does seem to say that Heidegger used it as a verb, but I'd venture that a) it was a neologism when H used it, b) a weird one at that, and c) not one that caught on with any significant number of writers.

So maybe translating it with a scarcely comprehensible neologism is good translation! :thinking:
Heidegger uses both "anwesen" (as a verb) and "Anwesen" (as a noun). The latter he clearly uses not in the meaning of "property". He uses both as his own created words to describe his philosophical ideas. Like Linpupa correctly said, there is no verb like "anwesen" in the german dictionary (called the "Duden"). Heidegger composed it from "wesen" which means something like the presence (of a force) being somewhere or somehow and "an" which puts it into a certain situation. Especially the fact that both are not even proper german words makes it really strange to use them in an english "translation" of a Dzogchen text imo.

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PemaSherab
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Re: New Longchenpa translations from Eric Fry-Miller

Post by PemaSherab » Wed Jun 21, 2017 11:30 am

Malcolm wrote:[

Basically, Heidegger was the worst thing that ever happened to Dzogchen.
I can't explain why, but, this made me laugh.

antbird
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Re: New Longchenpa translations from Eric Fry-Miller

Post by antbird » Sun Aug 20, 2017 8:32 pm

Hello Friends, have some one ordered here recently successfully?
No respond, no book so far...

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Malcolm
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Re: New Longchenpa translations from Eric Fry-Miller

Post by Malcolm » Sun Aug 20, 2017 11:30 pm

antbird wrote:Hello Friends, have some one ordered here recently successfully?
No respond, no book so far...

As far as I know he has been at Tara Mandala translating for their Drupchen.
Buddhahood in This Life
འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


[A]nything at all that is well spoken is the word of the Buddha.

-- Ārya-adhyāśaya-sañcodana-nāma-mahāyāna-sūtra

The different sūtras in accord with the emptiness
taught by the Sugata are definitive in meaning;
One can understand that all of those Dharmas in
which a sentient being, individual, or person are taught are provisional in meaning.

-- Samadhirāja Sūtra

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heart
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Re: New Longchenpa translations from Eric Fry-Miller

Post by heart » Mon Aug 21, 2017 4:50 am

antbird wrote:Hello Friends, have some one ordered here recently successfully?
No respond, no book so far...
I also ordered and got nothing. Pretty bad.

/magnus
"We are all here to help each other go through this thing, whatever it is."
~Kurt Vonnegut

"The principal practice is Guruyoga. But we need to understand that any secondary practice combined with Guruyoga becomes a principal practice." ChNNR (Teachings on Thun and Ganapuja)

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Malcolm
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Re: New Longchenpa translations from Eric Fry-Miller

Post by Malcolm » Mon Aug 21, 2017 4:54 am

heart wrote:
antbird wrote:Hello Friends, have some one ordered here recently successfully?
No respond, no book so far...
I also ordered and got nothing. Pretty bad.

/magnus
Some people when through this before with eric.
Buddhahood in This Life
འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


[A]nything at all that is well spoken is the word of the Buddha.

-- Ārya-adhyāśaya-sañcodana-nāma-mahāyāna-sūtra

The different sūtras in accord with the emptiness
taught by the Sugata are definitive in meaning;
One can understand that all of those Dharmas in
which a sentient being, individual, or person are taught are provisional in meaning.

-- Samadhirāja Sūtra

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heart
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Re: New Longchenpa translations from Eric Fry-Miller

Post by heart » Mon Aug 21, 2017 4:56 am

Malcolm wrote:
heart wrote:
antbird wrote:Hello Friends, have some one ordered here recently successfully?
No respond, no book so far...
I also ordered and got nothing. Pretty bad.

/magnus
Some people when through this before with eric.
Yes, I remember. Makes me wonder if this post from July is actually Eric himself:
nonabiding wrote:I previously purchased some translations of Eric Fry-Miller on Khandro Yangtik. The first order was slow, but the following ones were processed promptly with the book(s) arriving in one week.

Regarding the content, these translations are the only recent English material about Khangdro Yangtik and Khandro Nyingthig, which contains some finest empirical thogal instructions not available from elsewhere. For example, what to do when one sees vertical or horizontal appearances, what training to take when the bindus drift, how the ground abides (in terms of luminosity) etc; these instructions are invaluable when one wants to stabilize his or her thogal experience and gain realization. [Khenpo Ngawang Palzang recounted a story about Khandro Nyingthig in his autobiography: upon an event of Khandro Nyinthig empowerment and instruction, some seasoned practitioners refused to attend, thinking that the dzogchen instructions they had received such as Vima Nyinthig and Lama Yangtik were sufficient. It is no doubt that the Khandro Nyinthig is a precious transmission, but it is not clear how many people are karmically connected to it, even in Tibet.]

I can send out the titles I previously ordered at half of the listed prices, just as an opportunity for some people to know about these translations. There are five titles and each has only one copy available. If interested, send me a private message for the available titles.
/magnus
"We are all here to help each other go through this thing, whatever it is."
~Kurt Vonnegut

"The principal practice is Guruyoga. But we need to understand that any secondary practice combined with Guruyoga becomes a principal practice." ChNNR (Teachings on Thun and Ganapuja)

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Re: New Longchenpa translations from Eric Fry-Miller

Post by Dan74 » Mon Aug 21, 2017 5:40 am

Can't speak of the value but a friend of a friend recently published the following, FWIW:

https://www.amazon.com/Man-Samye-Longch ... 8177421328

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Sennin
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Re: New Longchenpa translations from Eric Fry-Miller

Post by Sennin » Mon Aug 21, 2017 10:28 am

heart wrote:
Malcolm wrote:
heart wrote:
I also ordered and got nothing. Pretty bad.

/magnus
Some people when through this before with eric.
Yes, I remember. Makes me wonder if this post from July is actually Eric himself:
nonabiding wrote:I previously purchased some translations of Eric Fry-Miller on Khandro Yangtik. The first order was slow, but the following ones were processed promptly with the book(s) arriving in one week.

Regarding the content, these translations are the only recent English material about Khangdro Yangtik and Khandro Nyingthig, which contains some finest empirical thogal instructions not available from elsewhere. For example, what to do when one sees vertical or horizontal appearances, what training to take when the bindus drift, how the ground abides (in terms of luminosity) etc; these instructions are invaluable when one wants to stabilize his or her thogal experience and gain realization. [Khenpo Ngawang Palzang recounted a story about Khandro Nyingthig in his autobiography: upon an event of Khandro Nyinthig empowerment and instruction, some seasoned practitioners refused to attend, thinking that the dzogchen instructions they had received such as Vima Nyinthig and Lama Yangtik were sufficient. It is no doubt that the Khandro Nyinthig is a precious transmission, but it is not clear how many people are karmically connected to it, even in Tibet.]

I can send out the titles I previously ordered at half of the listed prices, just as an opportunity for some people to know about these translations. There are five titles and each has only one copy available. If interested, send me a private message for the available titles.
/magnus

Perhaps so but I contacted nonabiding to purchase a text I have been interested in, nonabiding sent the text but I have been unable to further contact them to pay for it. :shrug:
Namo Guru Bhyaḥ

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SkyDragon3
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Re: New Longchenpa translations from Eric Fry-Miller

Post by SkyDragon3 » Fri Feb 02, 2018 1:08 am

I also attempted to purchase from the website, but it seems the whole site is now just an illusion. It was reported that my payment was processed, and I received an email to confirm that, but no actual payment was transacted. Several emails I sent appeared to be received, but no response was sent to me.

Is there anything new known about the availability of these translations, or the whereabouts of the translator?

It seems strange that the site is still up, but not accessible.

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Sennin
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Re: New Longchenpa translations from Eric Fry-Miller

Post by Sennin » Fri Feb 02, 2018 12:55 pm

SkyDragon3 wrote:
Fri Feb 02, 2018 1:08 am
I also attempted to purchase from the website, but it seems the whole site is now just an illusion. It was reported that my payment was processed, and I received an email to confirm that, but no actual payment was transacted. Several emails I sent appeared to be received, but no response was sent to me.

Is there anything new known about the availability of these translations, or the whereabouts of the translator?

It seems strange that the site is still up, but not accessible.
Pm me which translations you were trying to purchase, I may have a copy.
Namo Guru Bhyaḥ

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Re: New Longchenpa translations from Eric Fry-Miller

Post by XXIlluminatingVoid72 » Fri Feb 02, 2018 8:46 pm

I ordered some texts back in November. Haven't heard a word from them after several emails, now paypal is trying to get the money back.

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SkyDragon3
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Re: New Longchenpa translations from Eric Fry-Miller

Post by SkyDragon3 » Sat Feb 03, 2018 5:06 am

Dan74 wrote:
Mon Aug 21, 2017 5:40 am
Can't speak of the value but a friend of a friend recently published the following, FWIW:

https://www.amazon.com/Man-Samye-Longch ... 8177421328
Just out of interest, I recently attended a series of talks by the author of this work. He based his talks on the book. Later I asked if he recommended buying the book as I have many books about or by Longchenpa. His advice, no, too expensive and highly difficult material.
I found his talks were rather difficult to follow, focusing on why Negation was used as a method by Longchenpa and others from earlier buddhist traditions.

A few of the quotes from Longchenpa he used, really appealed to me, but I have not yet decided to invest in this very large book. If it hits a library, I will certainly check it out.

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