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After achieving rainbow body?

Posted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 3:03 pm
by Lee ireland
Hi,

I was wondering if theirs anything on what happens after achieving rainbow body? Where do they go, can they rebirth ect, a good source of information on this subject, does such books exist covering this?

Thank you

Re: After achieving rainbow body?

Posted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 9:45 pm
by javier.espinoza.t
I hav read that my teacher ChNN said that having a body of light one can actively help sentient beings -in samsara-.

Whem i met him i asked him if one can "come back" after becoming a Buddha -total realization-, and he said yes.

i can conceive the idea of a voluntary rebirth after such attainment.

Re: After achieving rainbow body?

Posted: Tue Oct 16, 2018 11:13 pm
by Virgo
javier.espinoza.t wrote:
Tue Oct 16, 2018 9:45 pm
I hav read that my teacher ChNN said that having a body of light one can actively help sentient beings -in samsara-.

Whem i met him i asked him if one can "come back" after becoming a Buddha -total realization-, and he said yes.

i can conceive the idea of a voluntary rebirth after such attainment.
I am not so sure that a person may "come back" as in leave a state of Buddhahood and be reborn as a human with ignorance again (though I suppose we could talk about 12'th vs 13'th bhumi realization situations) but I think someone can emanate bodies and forms to help individuals. The other individuals need the karma to be able to experience such emanations, however.

Kevin..

Re: After achieving rainbow body?

Posted: Wed Oct 17, 2018 12:10 am
by javier.espinoza.t
Virgo wrote:
Tue Oct 16, 2018 11:13 pm
javier.espinoza.t wrote:
Tue Oct 16, 2018 9:45 pm
I hav read that my teacher ChNN said that having a body of light one can actively help sentient beings -in samsara-.

Whem i met him i asked him if one can "come back" after becoming a Buddha -total realization-, and he said yes.

i can conceive the idea of a voluntary rebirth after such attainment.
I am not so sure that a person may "come back" as in leave a state of Buddhahood and be reborn as a human with ignorance again (though I suppose we could talk about 12'th vs 13'th bhumi realization situations) but I think someone can emanate bodies and forms to help individuals. The other individuals need the karma to be able to experience such emanations, however.

Kevin..
I meant "voluntarily come back".

Pd: sorry i made many ortographic mistakes.

Re: After achieving rainbow body?

Posted: Thu Oct 18, 2018 2:07 am
by Dorje Shedrub
Isn't there a rainbow body where one can manifest in a variety of forms, times, and places to benefit sentient beings? Does this nesecitate the disolution of the physical body?

DS

Re: After achieving rainbow body?

Posted: Thu Oct 18, 2018 12:00 pm
by Crazywisdom
javier.espinoza.t wrote:
Tue Oct 16, 2018 9:45 pm
I hav read that my teacher ChNN said that having a body of light one can actively help sentient beings -in samsara-.

Whem i met him i asked him if one can "come back" after becoming a Buddha -total realization-, and he said yes.

i can conceive the idea of a voluntary rebirth after such attainment.
This is true. The cause of a Buddha’s birth in a womb is aspiration prayers.

Re: After achieving rainbow body?

Posted: Thu Oct 18, 2018 10:23 pm
by rai
i have a feeling you are all wrong

Re: After achieving rainbow body?

Posted: Thu Oct 18, 2018 11:02 pm
by tatpurusa
rai wrote:
Thu Oct 18, 2018 10:23 pm
i have a feeling you are all wrong
Some people are extremely sensitive :mrgreen: :bow: :tongue: :zzz: :yinyang:

Re: After achieving rainbow body?

Posted: Fri Oct 19, 2018 1:51 am
by smcj
I hav read that my teacher ChNN said that having a body of light one can actively help sentient beings -in samsara-.

Whem i met him i asked him if one can "come back" after becoming a Buddha -total realization-, and he said yes.
I hope you are not assuming that it is necessary to have physical form in order for a Buddha to benefit beings in samsara.

Re: After achieving rainbow body?

Posted: Fri Oct 19, 2018 1:58 am
by javier.espinoza.t
smcj wrote:
Fri Oct 19, 2018 1:51 am
I hav read that my teacher ChNN said that having a body of light one can actively help sentient beings -in samsara-.

Whem i met him i asked him if one can "come back" after becoming a Buddha -total realization-, and he said yes.
I hope you are not assuming that it is necessary to have physical form in order for a Buddha to benefit beings in samsara.
I do assume that. In general we can't just receive teachings directly. Even if we have a high capacity like of a Bodhisattva or a Siddha, we need a rupa like a samboghakaya manifestation. No need to mention a nirmanakaya, wich is the point.

Re: After achieving rainbow body?

Posted: Fri Oct 19, 2018 2:03 am
by Sennin
Totally integrated.

Re: After achieving rainbow body?

Posted: Fri Oct 19, 2018 2:36 am
by smcj
javier.espinoza.t wrote:
Fri Oct 19, 2018 1:58 am
smcj wrote:
Fri Oct 19, 2018 1:51 am
I hav read that my teacher ChNN said that having a body of light one can actively help sentient beings -in samsara-.

Whem i met him i asked him if one can "come back" after becoming a Buddha -total realization-, and he said yes.
I hope you are not assuming that it is necessary to have physical form in order for a Buddha to benefit beings in samsara.
I do assume that. In general we can't just receive teachings directly. Even if we have a high capacity like of a Bodhisattva or a Siddha, we need a rupa like a samboghakaya manifestation. No need to mention a nirmanakaya, which is the point.
Of course it is best to have a person there to teach you, but Buddha Activity is not limited to the actions of a physical man. If it were it would be just as limited as samsaric actions. For instance, you can do guru-yogas for teachers that are no longer with us. Blessings are available from teachers that have passed away.

But more than that, Buddha Activity can happen automatically whenever the karma of beings allows for it. See the last chapter of "The Uttaratantra Shastra" by Maitreya/Asanga titled "Buddha Activity". It addresses the issue directly.

Re: After achieving rainbow body?

Posted: Fri Oct 19, 2018 7:07 am
by Aryjna
javier.espinoza.t wrote:
Fri Oct 19, 2018 1:58 am
smcj wrote:
Fri Oct 19, 2018 1:51 am
I hav read that my teacher ChNN said that having a body of light one can actively help sentient beings -in samsara-.

Whem i met him i asked him if one can "come back" after becoming a Buddha -total realization-, and he said yes.
I hope you are not assuming that it is necessary to have physical form in order for a Buddha to benefit beings in samsara.
I do assume that. In general we can't just receive teachings directly. Even if we have a high capacity like of a Bodhisattva or a Siddha, we need a rupa like a samboghakaya manifestation. No need to mention a nirmanakaya, wich is the point.
A buddha has the rupakaya in any case. The rainbow body seems to be an 'extra' of some kind.

Re: After achieving rainbow body?

Posted: Fri Oct 19, 2018 9:44 am
by Lee ireland
Wow, some very interesting responses here! Thank you everyone. Funnily enough I had this topic pop up in the first part of the precious treasury of genuine meaning. From what I'm understanding is, if one reaches full enlightenment then that entity ( person) can manifest other beings or entities to teach in the various realities where dzogchen is taught. I might be wrong but from what I'm understanding is samantabhadra a manifestation of vajradhara that shares the teachings or projects the teachings through the manifestation into the human realm, please correct me if I'm wrong, if I am wrong I'll go back to that topic and study more until I get it. I do know that being reborn into delusion is not possible, as its stated in many books by Tony duff and other books, saying that can one become confused after full buddhahood is achieved, and all say its impossible to be deluded and confused again once reaching this. I do have all 5 copies of the precious treasury of genuine meaning so maybe all thoughts will be clearer after years of diligent study, it is said that nothing is left out and contains every fine detail on the dzogchen teachings.

Re: After achieving rainbow body?

Posted: Fri Oct 19, 2018 1:22 pm
by Crazywisdom
Aryjna wrote:
Fri Oct 19, 2018 7:07 am
javier.espinoza.t wrote:
Fri Oct 19, 2018 1:58 am
smcj wrote:
Fri Oct 19, 2018 1:51 am

I hope you are not assuming that it is necessary to have physical form in order for a Buddha to benefit beings in samsara.
I do assume that. In general we can't just receive teachings directly. Even if we have a high capacity like of a Bodhisattva or a Siddha, we need a rupa like a samboghakaya manifestation. No need to mention a nirmanakaya, wich is the point.
A buddha has the rupakaya in any case. The rainbow body seems to be an 'extra' of some kind.
No. Not an extra. It’s nirmanakaya.

Re: After achieving rainbow body?

Posted: Fri Oct 19, 2018 1:46 pm
by Aryjna
Crazywisdom wrote:
Fri Oct 19, 2018 1:22 pm
Aryjna wrote:
Fri Oct 19, 2018 7:07 am
javier.espinoza.t wrote:
Fri Oct 19, 2018 1:58 am


I do assume that. In general we can't just receive teachings directly. Even if we have a high capacity like of a Bodhisattva or a Siddha, we need a rupa like a samboghakaya manifestation. No need to mention a nirmanakaya, wich is the point.
A buddha has the rupakaya in any case. The rainbow body seems to be an 'extra' of some kind.
No. Not an extra. It’s nirmanakaya.
I mean there is no need to achieve a rainbow body in this sense in order to have infinite emanations etc.

Re: After achieving rainbow body?

Posted: Fri Oct 19, 2018 3:05 pm
by Sennin
Guru Rinpoche will remain until samsara is empty. Not just this eon...
Rainbow body is very special. The physical body enters into it's true nature but keeps it's physical form; whoever knew Guru P before he manifested, would recognize him immediately if they met him afterwards.
When totally integrated, there is no longer any need for death to manifest or the physical body to dissolve into the elements.
Phowa Chenpo....just wow :o
just wowsers :jawdrop:
ok, i'll shut up now :P

Re: After achieving rainbow body?

Posted: Fri Oct 19, 2018 3:08 pm
by Crazywisdom
Aryjna wrote:
Fri Oct 19, 2018 1:46 pm
Crazywisdom wrote:
Fri Oct 19, 2018 1:22 pm
Aryjna wrote:
Fri Oct 19, 2018 7:07 am


A buddha has the rupakaya in any case. The rainbow body seems to be an 'extra' of some kind.
No. Not an extra. It’s nirmanakaya.
I mean there is no need to achieve a rainbow body in this sense in order to have infinite emanations etc.
That’s true, unless you believe Dzogchen Tantras that this is the only one of two samyaksambuddha.

Re: After achieving rainbow body?

Posted: Fri Oct 19, 2018 3:09 pm
by Crazywisdom
Buddha alluded to Ananda that had he requested Buddha could have not died.

Re: After achieving rainbow body?

Posted: Fri Oct 19, 2018 3:21 pm
by smcj
So do you guys accept the idea that realized beings are able to benefit sentient beings post-mortem?