Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

meepits
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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by meepits » Fri Mar 02, 2018 8:18 am

treehuggingoctopus wrote:
Fri Mar 02, 2018 8:09 am
meepits wrote:
Fri Mar 02, 2018 6:59 am
I received DI during day 1 of retreat last December, and just sort of assumed that meant I could practice according to the Cycle of Day & Night. Now I’m wondering if I needed actually needed Longde transmission or empowerment to start this? :thinking:
You do not need anything more than the DI to practice it (and if you did, you would need the lung, and not any Longde empowerment).
:D Thanks

Motova
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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by Motova » Fri Mar 02, 2018 12:55 pm

meepits wrote:
Fri Mar 02, 2018 8:18 am
treehuggingoctopus wrote:
Fri Mar 02, 2018 8:09 am
meepits wrote:
Fri Mar 02, 2018 6:59 am
I received DI during day 1 of retreat last December, and just sort of assumed that meant I could practice according to the Cycle of Day & Night. Now I’m wondering if I needed actually needed Longde transmission or empowerment to start this? :thinking:
You do not need anything more than the DI to practice it (and if you did, you would need the lung, and not any Longde empowerment).
:D Thanks
I'm pretty sure you do need an empowerment to practice longde.
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The four means of converting beings to the Dharma are generosity (which itself as four aspects: giving material gifts, conferring fearlessness, loving kindness and teaching Dharma), pleasant speech, conduct and setting an example.

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heart
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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by heart » Fri Mar 02, 2018 1:00 pm

Motova wrote:
Fri Mar 02, 2018 12:55 pm
meepits wrote:
Fri Mar 02, 2018 8:18 am
treehuggingoctopus wrote:
Fri Mar 02, 2018 8:09 am


You do not need anything more than the DI to practice it (and if you did, you would need the lung, and not any Longde empowerment).
:D Thanks
I'm pretty sure you do need an empowerment to practice longde.
Yes, that is right. I actually asked Rinpoche about that once. He said you needed the empowerment.

/magnus
"We are all here to help each other go through this thing, whatever it is."
~Kurt Vonnegut

"The principal practice is Guruyoga. But we need to understand that any secondary practice combined with Guruyoga becomes a principal practice." ChNNR (Teachings on Thun and Ganapuja)

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florin
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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by florin » Fri Mar 02, 2018 1:27 pm

treehuggingoctopus wrote:
Fri Mar 02, 2018 8:09 am
meepits wrote:
Fri Mar 02, 2018 6:59 am
I received DI during day 1 of retreat last December, and just sort of assumed that meant I could practice according to the Cycle of Day & Night. Now I’m wondering if I needed actually needed Longde transmission or empowerment to start this? :thinking:
You do not need anything more than the DI to practice it (and if you did, you would need the lung, and not any Longde empowerment).
Now i am curious about this too.
It appears that The cycle of day and night is a synopsis of Longde practices as the preface to the book says "In the Iongde Series of Dzogchen teachings, there are found the instructions of Garab Dorje on how to practice contemplation continuously both day and night. 1 The present text is a synopsis of these practices.
So to have all the prerequisites, apart from lung, instructions and DI, are you certain we don't need the empowerment?
The nature of diverse phenomena is non-dual. This means that both pure vision and impure vision are a manifestation of the energy of the primordial state. Even though in reality there is no duality, everything manifests separately. KG

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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by treehuggingoctopus » Fri Mar 02, 2018 2:17 pm

heart wrote:
Fri Mar 02, 2018 1:00 pm
Motova wrote:
Fri Mar 02, 2018 12:55 pm
meepits wrote:
Fri Mar 02, 2018 8:18 am


:D Thanks
I'm pretty sure you do need an empowerment to practice longde.
Yes, that is right. I actually asked Rinpoche about that once. He said you needed the empowerment.

/magnus
To practice Longde (at least Longsal Longde), you do need an appropriate empowerment. I do not believe you need any special empowerment (aside from the DI, which is obviously the superspecial ultimate Vajrayana empowerment) to practice the Cycle of Day and Night practices. The latter are related, and in a way belong, to the Longde cycle, but are not exactly Longde proper.

(Feels weird talking about it here because CoDaN is an unrestricted book that nonetheless contains Dzogchen practices. It should be restricted. It clearly is not. And quite possibly its not being restricted also suggests that what you need to put these instructions in action is just the DI. No mention in the book -- in any of the three CoDaN books, actually -- of any special requirements aside from the DI.)

This is, in any case, what I have heard. If anybody knows it for a fact that I am wrong, I will be very happy to be corrected.

You can always write to Elio or Adriano or Jim, Meepits, if you are not sure.
. . . there they saw a rock! But it wasn't a rock . . .

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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by florin » Fri Mar 02, 2018 2:37 pm

treehuggingoctopus wrote:
Fri Mar 02, 2018 2:17 pm
. No mention in the book -- in any of the three CoDaN books, actually --
I wasn't aware there are three books on Cycle of day and night.
You mean 3 editions?
The nature of diverse phenomena is non-dual. This means that both pure vision and impure vision are a manifestation of the energy of the primordial state. Even though in reality there is no duality, everything manifests separately. KG

Lukeinaz
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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by Lukeinaz » Fri Mar 02, 2018 3:15 pm

florin wrote:
Fri Mar 02, 2018 2:37 pm
treehuggingoctopus wrote:
Fri Mar 02, 2018 2:17 pm
. No mention in the book -- in any of the three CoDaN books, actually --
I wasn't aware there are three books on Cycle of day and night.
You mean 3 editions?
http://shangshung.org/store/index.php?m ... cts_id=250

https://www.amazon.com/Cycle-Day-Night- ... =srch[url]

Are these the same?
You are truly astonishing--going to look for yourself when you already are yourself! --Longchen Rabjam

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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by florin » Fri Mar 02, 2018 3:31 pm

Lukeinaz wrote:
Fri Mar 02, 2018 3:15 pm
florin wrote:
Fri Mar 02, 2018 2:37 pm
treehuggingoctopus wrote:
Fri Mar 02, 2018 2:17 pm
. No mention in the book -- in any of the three CoDaN books, actually --
I wasn't aware there are three books on Cycle of day and night.
You mean 3 editions?
http://shangshung.org/store/index.php?m ... cts_id=250

https://www.amazon.com/Cycle-Day-Night- ... =srch[url]

Are these the same?
The edition i have is from 1984.
The commentary you linked to is to an edition from 1993.
But my edition it already has its own commentary included in the book.
Very confusing.
The nature of diverse phenomena is non-dual. This means that both pure vision and impure vision are a manifestation of the energy of the primordial state. Even though in reality there is no duality, everything manifests separately. KG

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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by Lukeinaz » Fri Mar 02, 2018 3:35 pm

You are truly astonishing--going to look for yourself when you already are yourself! --Longchen Rabjam

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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by treehuggingoctopus » Fri Mar 02, 2018 3:54 pm

There are indeed three entirely different books.

(1) There is the 1987 (the first issue was actually published in 1984) Station Hill book containing Vajranatha's translation of the text of CoDaN as well as an edited transcript of a CoDaN retreat which Rinpoche taught in the US in 1983 (an unedited transcript of the same retreat can be found in either the first or the third of the spiralbound notebooks published by the US sangha of the DC, I do not remember which one is which). Vajranatha attended the retreat in person although I am not sure if he translated ChNN then. This is the book you can order from Amazon.com, etc. It is unrestricted. 126 pages.

(2) There is the 2000 Shang Shung Editions book entitled "CoDaN: A Commentary by ChNN." It consists of Vajranatha's translation of the the text of CoDaN (the same translation as the one in the Station Hill book) as well as a transcript of a CoDaN retreat ChNN taught in 1998 in Merigar. This one is restricted and is sold exclusively by SSI. 96 pages.

(3) Finally, there is the 2003 Shang Shung Editions book entitled "CoDaN and Its Relation to the Original Teaching 'The Upadesha of Vajrasattva.'" Here you will find a line by line comparison of the text of CoDaN (translated by Adriano Clemente) and the Vai ro rgyud 'bum text entitled rDo rje sems dpa'i man ngag. This one is also restricted and is sold exclusively by SSI, too. 108 pages.

Both (1) and (2) are absolutely invaluable (and I would say that it is best to have, and carefully and repeatedly read, both). Definitely some of the most useful and informative books by ChNN, if you ask me. I do tend to fetishise them, and am not ashamed of it in the least.
. . . there they saw a rock! But it wasn't a rock . . .

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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by pael » Fri Mar 02, 2018 5:06 pm

When trid-lungs start? Not working.
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meepits
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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by meepits » Fri Mar 02, 2018 5:27 pm

pael wrote:
Fri Mar 02, 2018 5:06 pm
When trid-lungs start? Not working.
Rinpoche is sick, so the lungs today were basically cancelled.

Also re: the 3 CoDaN books, FWIW I recommend eventually getting all of them if you feel a connection to the text. The unique features of each are pretty fascinating.

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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by Lukeinaz » Fri Mar 02, 2018 5:34 pm

treehuggingoctopus wrote:
Fri Mar 02, 2018 3:54 pm
There are indeed three entirely different books.

(1) There is the 1987 (the first issue was actually published in 1984) Station Hill book containing Vajranatha's translation of the text of CoDaN as well as an edited transcript of a CoDaN retreat which Rinpoche taught in the US in 1983 (an unedited transcript of the same retreat can be found in either the first or the third of the spiralbound notebooks published by the US sangha of the DC, I do not remember which one is which). Vajranatha attended the retreat in person although I am not sure if he translated ChNN then. This is the book you can order from Amazon.com, etc. It is unrestricted. 126 pages.

(2) There is the 2000 Shang Shung Editions book entitled "CoDaN: A Commentary by ChNN." It consists of Vajranatha's translation of the the text of CoDaN (the same translation as the one in the Station Hill book) as well as a transcript of a CoDaN retreat ChNN taught in 1998 in Merigar. This one is restricted and is sold exclusively by SSI. 96 pages.

(3) Finally, there is the 2003 Shang Shung Editions book entitled "CoDaN and Its Relation to the Original Teaching 'The Upadesha of Vajrasattva.'" Here you will find a line by line comparison of the text of CoDaN (translated by Adriano Clemente) and the Vai ro rgyud 'bum text entitled rDo rje sems dpa'i man ngag. This one is also restricted and is sold exclusively by SSI, too. 108 pages.

Both (1) and (2) are absolutely invaluable (and I would say that it is best to have, and carefully and repeatedly read, both). Definitely some of the most useful and informative books by ChNN, if you ask me. I do tend to fetishise them, and am not ashamed of it in the least.
Thanks, just ordered the second.
You are truly astonishing--going to look for yourself when you already are yourself! --Longchen Rabjam

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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by florin » Fri Mar 02, 2018 7:43 pm

treehuggingoctopus wrote:
Fri Mar 02, 2018 3:54 pm
There are indeed three entirely different books.

(1) There is the 1987 (the first issue was actually published in 1984) Station Hill book containing Vajranatha's translation of the text of CoDaN as well as an edited transcript of a CoDaN retreat which Rinpoche taught in the US in 1983 (an unedited transcript of the same retreat can be found in either the first or the third of the spiralbound notebooks published by the US sangha of the DC, I do not remember which one is which). Vajranatha attended the retreat in person although I am not sure if he translated ChNN then. This is the book you can order from Amazon.com, etc. It is unrestricted. 126 pages.

(2) There is the 2000 Shang Shung Editions book entitled "CoDaN: A Commentary by ChNN." It consists of Vajranatha's translation of the the text of CoDaN (the same translation as the one in the Station Hill book) as well as a transcript of a CoDaN retreat ChNN taught in 1998 in Merigar. This one is restricted and is sold exclusively by SSI. 96 pages.

(3) Finally, there is the 2003 Shang Shung Editions book entitled "CoDaN and Its Relation to the Original Teaching 'The Upadesha of Vajrasattva.'" Here you will find a line by line comparison of the text of CoDaN (translated by Adriano Clemente) and the Vai ro rgyud 'bum text entitled rDo rje sems dpa'i man ngag. This one is also restricted and is sold exclusively by SSI, too. 108 pages.

Both (1) and (2) are absolutely invaluable (and I would say that it is best to have, and carefully and repeatedly read, both). Definitely some of the most useful and informative books by ChNN, if you ask me. I do tend to fetishise them, and am not ashamed of it in the least.
Excellent. Thank you for clarifying.
The nature of diverse phenomena is non-dual. This means that both pure vision and impure vision are a manifestation of the energy of the primordial state. Even though in reality there is no duality, everything manifests separately. KG

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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by Jeff H » Fri Mar 02, 2018 8:07 pm

I’m trying to gain a good familiarity with some of ChNN’s basics, including Song of the Vajra, Short Tun, and the Anniversary Empowerments. I have found it extremely helpful to use the mp3 recordings of Rinpoche doing the first two and the Garab Dorje Empowerment, but I haven’t found a recording of him doing the Padmasambhava Empowerments. Could someone tell whether one exists?

I did find this by the 17th Karmapa online. It’s certainly the same invocation, but the transcription is different from what Rinpoche uses, and I’d prefer to learn Rinpoche’s pronunciation and melody.
We who are like children shrink from pain but love its causes. - Shantideva

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florin
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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by florin » Fri Mar 02, 2018 8:14 pm

Jeff H wrote:
Fri Mar 02, 2018 8:07 pm
I’m trying to gain a good familiarity with some of ChNN’s basics, including Song of the Vajra, Short Tun, and the Anniversary Empowerments. I have found it extremely helpful to use the mp3 recordings of Rinpoche doing the first two and the Garab Dorje Empowerment, but I haven’t found a recording of him doing the Padmasambhava Empowerments. Could someone tell whether one exists?

I did find this by the 17th Karmapa online. It’s certainly the same invocation, but the transcription is different from what Rinpoche uses, and I’d prefer to learn Rinpoche’s pronunciation and melody.
Well you could try your luck with the archive. If they find one you will have to pay though, 15-17 euros i think.
The nature of diverse phenomena is non-dual. This means that both pure vision and impure vision are a manifestation of the energy of the primordial state. Even though in reality there is no duality, everything manifests separately. KG

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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by treehuggingoctopus » Fri Mar 02, 2018 8:40 pm

florin wrote:
Fri Mar 02, 2018 7:43 pm
treehuggingoctopus wrote:
Fri Mar 02, 2018 3:54 pm
There are indeed three entirely different books.

(1) There is the 1987 (the first issue was actually published in 1984) Station Hill book containing Vajranatha's translation of the text of CoDaN as well as an edited transcript of a CoDaN retreat which Rinpoche taught in the US in 1983 (an unedited transcript of the same retreat can be found in either the first or the third of the spiralbound notebooks published by the US sangha of the DC, I do not remember which one is which). Vajranatha attended the retreat in person although I am not sure if he translated ChNN then. This is the book you can order from Amazon.com, etc. It is unrestricted. 126 pages.

(2) There is the 2000 Shang Shung Editions book entitled "CoDaN: A Commentary by ChNN." It consists of Vajranatha's translation of the the text of CoDaN (the same translation as the one in the Station Hill book) as well as a transcript of a CoDaN retreat ChNN taught in 1998 in Merigar. This one is restricted and is sold exclusively by SSI. 96 pages.

(3) Finally, there is the 2003 Shang Shung Editions book entitled "CoDaN and Its Relation to the Original Teaching 'The Upadesha of Vajrasattva.'" Here you will find a line by line comparison of the text of CoDaN (translated by Adriano Clemente) and the Vai ro rgyud 'bum text entitled rDo rje sems dpa'i man ngag. This one is also restricted and is sold exclusively by SSI, too. 108 pages.

Both (1) and (2) are absolutely invaluable (and I would say that it is best to have, and carefully and repeatedly read, both). Definitely some of the most useful and informative books by ChNN, if you ask me. I do tend to fetishise them, and am not ashamed of it in the least.
Excellent. Thank you for clarifying.
Glad to be of help!
. . . there they saw a rock! But it wasn't a rock . . .

Lukeinaz
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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by Lukeinaz » Fri Mar 02, 2018 8:46 pm

Jeff H wrote:
Fri Mar 02, 2018 8:07 pm
I’m trying to gain a good familiarity with some of ChNN’s basics, including Song of the Vajra, Short Tun, and the Anniversary Empowerments. I have found it extremely helpful to use the mp3 recordings of Rinpoche doing the first two and the Garab Dorje Empowerment, but I haven’t found a recording of him doing the Padmasambhava Empowerments. Could someone tell whether one exists?

I did find this by the 17th Karmapa online. It’s certainly the same invocation, but the transcription is different from what Rinpoche uses, and I’d prefer to learn Rinpoche’s pronunciation and melody.
You can find this in ritual melodies or simply the pronunciation in mantaras and invocations.
You are truly astonishing--going to look for yourself when you already are yourself! --Longchen Rabjam

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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by Vasana » Fri Mar 02, 2018 8:52 pm

Jeff H wrote:
Fri Mar 02, 2018 8:07 pm
I’m trying to gain a good familiarity with some of ChNN’s basics, including Song of the Vajra, Short Tun, and the Anniversary Empowerments. I have found it extremely helpful to use the mp3 recordings of Rinpoche doing the first two and the Garab Dorje Empowerment, but I haven’t found a recording of him doing the Padmasambhava Empowerments. Could someone tell whether one exists?

I did find this by the 17th Karmapa online. It’s certainly the same invocation, but the transcription is different from what Rinpoche uses, and I’d prefer to learn Rinpoche’s pronunciation and melody.
P'm'd.
'When alone, watch your mind. When with others, watch your speech'- Old Kadampa saying.

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Re: Dzogchen Community of Chogyal Namkhai Norbu

Post by javier.espinoza.t » Sat Mar 03, 2018 12:27 am

any news from rinpoche? :(
Identities are false and not true

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