Lung always given at time of empowerment?

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Pema Rigdzin
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Lung always given at time of empowerment?

Post by Pema Rigdzin »

So of course nowadays I know that yidam practice functions in dependence on not only wang, but also lung and tri. But once upon a time I didn't know that, so if the lung hadn't been given I wouldn't have even known what I was missing, and now I want to practice some of the sadhanas from those early empowerments, but I don't know for sure if the lung was actually given at the time. Any of you experienced mainstream Nyingma lamas giving the empowerment alone but not the lung at that time (outside of one of those whole cycle empowerment marathons where they might give all the lungs one after another on the last day)?
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Josef
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Re: Lung always given at time of empowerment?

Post by Josef »

Pema Rigdzin wrote: Thu Oct 25, 2018 3:25 am So of course nowadays I know that yidam practice functions in dependence on not only wang, but also lung and tri. But once upon a time I didn't know that, so if the lung hadn't been given I wouldn't have even known what I was missing, and now I want to practice some of the sadhanas from those early empowerments, but I don't know for sure if the lung was actually given at the time. Any of you experienced mainstream Nyingma lamas giving the empowerment alone but not the lung at that time (outside of one of those whole cycle empowerment marathons where they might give all the lungs one after another on the last day)?
It’s common for empowerments to be given without a lung.
"All phenomena of samsara depend on the mind, so when the essence of mind is purified, samsara is purified. Since the phenomena of nirvana depend on the pristine consciousness of vidyā, because one remains in the immediacy of vidyā, buddhahood arises on its own. All critical points are summarized with those two." - Longchenpa
Kris
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Re: Lung always given at time of empowerment?

Post by Kris »

Josef wrote: Thu Oct 25, 2018 5:04 am
It’s common for empowerments to be given without a lung.
What about the mantra? Isn't that usually given during the empowerment?
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Könchok Thrinley
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Re: Lung always given at time of empowerment?

Post by Könchok Thrinley »

Sennin wrote: Thu Oct 25, 2018 11:44 am
Josef wrote: Thu Oct 25, 2018 5:04 am
It’s common for empowerments to be given without a lung.
What about the mantra? Isn't that usually given during the empowerment?
Yes that is.
I think Malcolm once said in one of the threads that empowerments are usually/often connected to some concrete sadhana so the lung does not need to be necessarily given for it. But I might be sorely mistaken.
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that becomes suffering indeed.

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Grigoris
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Re: Lung always given at time of empowerment?

Post by Grigoris »

Miroku wrote: Thu Oct 25, 2018 12:27 pmYes that is.
I think Malcolm once said in one of the threads that empowerments are usually/often connected to some concrete sadhana so the lung does not need to be necessarily given for it. But I might be sorely mistaken.
I seem to remember the same thing too.
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Malcolm
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Re: Lung always given at time of empowerment?

Post by Malcolm »

In general, the lung for the sadhana is included in a given empowerment/blessing/permission rite, since the visualization read by the lama for the students is taken directly from the sadhana, as are the refuge, etc. prayers one recites in the empowerment, etc.

However, for any given deity cycle there can be several different sadhanas of different lengths with different details, so one needs generally to get the lung for these separately. But in some case, giving the lung for the longest sadhana is considered to be sufficient for the shorter sadhanas as well. It depends somewhat on the master and the tradition.

In general, however, for permission rites, there is only one sadhana, and in this case, usually the permission rite is sufficient, all one needs following that is the explanation.
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Josef
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Re: Lung always given at time of empowerment?

Post by Josef »

Sennin wrote: Thu Oct 25, 2018 11:44 am
Josef wrote: Thu Oct 25, 2018 5:04 am
It’s common for empowerments to be given without a lung.
What about the mantra? Isn't that usually given during the empowerment?
Yes, the mantra is transmitted in the empowerment.
"All phenomena of samsara depend on the mind, so when the essence of mind is purified, samsara is purified. Since the phenomena of nirvana depend on the pristine consciousness of vidyā, because one remains in the immediacy of vidyā, buddhahood arises on its own. All critical points are summarized with those two." - Longchenpa
Pema Rigdzin
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Re: Lung always given at time of empowerment?

Post by Pema Rigdzin »

Thanks so much, guys! That makes me happy to find out I already have what I was hoping to get.
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Douglas Westbury
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Re: Lung always given at time of empowerment?

Post by Douglas Westbury »

Pema Rigdzin wrote: Fri Oct 26, 2018 1:04 am Thanks so much, guys! That makes me happy to find out I already have what I was hoping to get.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Empowerment_(Vajrayana)
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