Dudjom Tröma Nagmo ngondro

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ddorje
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Re: Dudjom Tröma Nagmo ngondro

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yagmort wrote: Tue Jul 28, 2020 3:56 am Dharmasagara, very valuable info, thank you!
if i recall Yudron has mentioned that in Thöluk they do SaTer ngöndro first, then Thröma ngöndro.
Dharmasagara wrote: Mon Jul 27, 2020 12:35 pm a longer Ngöndro authored by Degyal Rinpoche at
i didn't now there is a ngöndro by Degyal Rinpoche. do you have any bits of info on that one?
Tholuk lineage and Namkha Khyung Dzong have a tradition of doing the SaTer ngondro first, followed by each and every other step through the Troma path, starting with Troma Ngondro.

I’m sure there are lamas who come from NKD who have skilfully tailored things differently for their foreign disciples outside of Humla, but traditionally that’s the order.
'Maybe you collect a lot of important writings, major texts, personal instructions private notes, whatever. If you haven't practiced, books won't help you when you die. Look at the mind - that's my sincere advice' - Longchen Rabjam
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ddorje
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Re: Dudjom Tröma Nagmo ngondro

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yagmort wrote: Thu Jan 09, 2020 3:59 pm i am not making any claims, i just thought that being Dudjom Tersar lineage holder doesn't mean one has Thröma as his main practice, does it? long hair vow is specifically Thröma vow. so my way of thinking is even if Pema Rigtsal Rinpoche is Dudjom Tersar lineage holder and coming from Dudjom Töluk family, but have studied mostly with Longchen Nyingthig gurus and has bhiksu vows, that gave me impression he is not "dedicated" Thröma practitioner (chodpa). same with other Dudjom Tersar lineage holders. please correct me.

Tulku Pema Rigtsal Rinpoche has many excellent lamas from many Dzogchen traditions, and is also the throne holder of NKD monastery. The monasteries primary practice is TroChen, the longest Troma Sadhana which is specific to the Tholuk lineage.

Some of Rinpoche’s brothers (the sons of the 2nd Rinpoche) keep their hair long, others do not; but safe to say Troma is at the heart of this tradition. I don’t particularly understand the focus on the hair vow, the tradition of keeping this is contextual from lineage to lineage it seems (and as mentioned before not all of the lineage holders keep their hair growing out).

In the context of the NKD community, the wearing of the striped robe, or white dranju or earrings and all that, is really something only done by the most accomplished amongst them. Most lamas, including some of these lineage sons just wear red dranju and zin. I’ve met a few who keep those signs of wearing but it’s only a handful. One I’ve met, who is the uncle of my tutor Lama has done over 15 years retreat on this practice: sort of just keeps his hair long, red robes, nothing too outgoing. His wife too has the same amount of practice but they just look like your average folk. They live remotely and just do this practice ongoing.

Everyone in that lineage and around the monastery, lay folk and even the lowkey and humble wives of male practioners looking after kids have done more accumulation than a handful of us combined.
'Maybe you collect a lot of important writings, major texts, personal instructions private notes, whatever. If you haven't practiced, books won't help you when you die. Look at the mind - that's my sincere advice' - Longchen Rabjam
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ddorje
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Re: Dudjom Tröma Nagmo ngondro

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Adamantine wrote: Thu Jan 09, 2020 1:53 pm
mandog wrote: Thu Jan 09, 2020 5:07 am
yagmort wrote: Thu Jan 09, 2020 2:57 am Adamantine, thanks for clarification.
that's not my idea, i've been told that those whose heart practice is Thröma Nakmo has 3 vows: body - not cutting your hair, action - always remain natural and never correct the way you display yourself, mind - remain in true nature of mind. these are not exact quotation but my understanding of them.

mandog, perhaps you were thinking about second Degyal Rinpoche, who disrobed in 1954.
nope,
https://www.rigpawiki.org/index.php?tit ... inting.jpg

Yeah perhaps my mistake in this case, I thought I’d seen a statue of him with short hair however I see he is portrayed with long hair in a few renditions so perhaps this is the case where the higher vows subsume the lower (monastic) and perhaps he kept it long following the yogi vows. I’ll have to ask my Lama friends who are more scholars of that lineage. Regardless, it was taught by one of the late primary Troma lineage holders that once you receive the hair blessing in the Wang you can keep this samaya by either keeping the hair very short, or totally uncut. So it would seem that Tulku Pema Rigtsal is following the former version. Either way there’s conduct involving what you do with your cut hair, or if you never cut then the hair that naturally falls.. that people without this vow don’t really need to be so concerned with..


Yeah, I think chief here really hit the nail on the head with this one.

It’s not something to be too concerned about. A Lama from this lineage, praising someone who is a lifelong practioner from the NKD lineage, who lives rurally and was a disciple of the 2nd Degyal has said, he practices the 3 roots as such: Guru Troma, Yidam Troma, Khandro Troma.
'Maybe you collect a lot of important writings, major texts, personal instructions private notes, whatever. If you haven't practiced, books won't help you when you die. Look at the mind - that's my sincere advice' - Longchen Rabjam
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