Sapan Manjushri - Sajam Bagtuk?

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dzogchungpa
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Sapan Manjushri - Sajam Bagtuk?

Post by dzogchungpa » Mon Aug 07, 2017 7:34 pm

Can anyone provide some information about this? E.g. how is "Sajam Bagtuk" spelled, a link to a Tibetan text and/or a translation, history and significance of this practice etc. Thanks in advance.
There is not only nothingness because there is always, and always can manifest. - Thinley Norbu Rinpoche

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ratna
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Re: Sapan Manjushri - Sajam Bagtuk?

Post by ratna » Mon Aug 07, 2017 7:41 pm

sa 'jam sbag sgrub.

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dzogchungpa
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Re: Sapan Manjushri - Sajam Bagtuk?

Post by dzogchungpa » Mon Aug 07, 2017 7:48 pm

ratna wrote:sa 'jam sbag sgrub.
OK, thanks. I don't see how "sbag sgrub" gets pronounced as "bagtuk" though. What does 'sbag' mean here?
There is not only nothingness because there is always, and always can manifest. - Thinley Norbu Rinpoche

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Malcolm
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Re: Sapan Manjushri - Sajam Bagtuk?

Post by Malcolm » Mon Aug 07, 2017 7:56 pm

dzogchungpa wrote:Can anyone provide some information about this? E.g. how is "Sajam Bagtuk" spelled, a link to a Tibetan text and/or a translation, history and significance of this practice etc. Thanks in advance.

It is a practice based on the pure vision of the famous Sakya scholar, Yagton (gyag ston). It is referred to as the 'jam dpal dang sa paṇ sbags te sgrub, i.e. Mañjuśri and Sakya Pan̄ḍita Merged and Accomplished.

http://www.tbrc.org/eBooks/W23681-2417-303-340-any.pdf

It is an extremely important practice in the Sakya School, one which I did for many years. If you do this practice seriously, you will realize the actual meaning of Mahāmudra.

It also has a supplement, a pure vision of Dilgo Khyentse's where the sbags sgrub serves as the outer sadhana, as well as an inner and secret sadhana as well. This is included in Dilgo Khyentse's collected works.

http://www.tbrc.org/eBooks/W21809-1847-585-596-any.pdf
Last edited by Malcolm on Mon Aug 07, 2017 7:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Buddhahood in This Life
འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


[A]nything at all that is well spoken is the word of the Buddha.

-- Ārya-adhyāśaya-sañcodana-nāma-mahāyāna-sūtra

The different sūtras in accord with the emptiness
taught by the Sugata are definitive in meaning;
One can understand that all of those Dharmas in
which a sentient being, individual, or person are taught are provisional in meaning.

-- Samadhirāja Sūtra

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Malcolm
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Re: Sapan Manjushri - Sajam Bagtuk?

Post by Malcolm » Mon Aug 07, 2017 7:57 pm

dzogchungpa wrote:
ratna wrote:sa 'jam sbag sgrub.
OK, thanks. I don't see how "sbag sgrub" gets pronounced as "bagtuk" though. What does 'sbag' mean here?
Merged.
Buddhahood in This Life
འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


[A]nything at all that is well spoken is the word of the Buddha.

-- Ārya-adhyāśaya-sañcodana-nāma-mahāyāna-sūtra

The different sūtras in accord with the emptiness
taught by the Sugata are definitive in meaning;
One can understand that all of those Dharmas in
which a sentient being, individual, or person are taught are provisional in meaning.

-- Samadhirāja Sūtra

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dzogchungpa
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Re: Sapan Manjushri - Sajam Bagtuk?

Post by dzogchungpa » Mon Aug 07, 2017 7:59 pm

OK, thanks for the info. I've been wanting to have a Manjushri practice for a while now, so this sounds quite promising.
There is not only nothingness because there is always, and always can manifest. - Thinley Norbu Rinpoche

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Malcolm
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Re: Sapan Manjushri - Sajam Bagtuk?

Post by Malcolm » Mon Aug 07, 2017 8:02 pm

dzogchungpa wrote:OK, thanks for the info. I've been wanting to have a Manjushri practice for a while now, so this sounds quite promising.
I rarely give advice, but what you really want is 'jam dpal smra ba'i seng ge.
Buddhahood in This Life
འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


[A]nything at all that is well spoken is the word of the Buddha.

-- Ārya-adhyāśaya-sañcodana-nāma-mahāyāna-sūtra

The different sūtras in accord with the emptiness
taught by the Sugata are definitive in meaning;
One can understand that all of those Dharmas in
which a sentient being, individual, or person are taught are provisional in meaning.

-- Samadhirāja Sūtra

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dzogchungpa
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Re: Sapan Manjushri - Sajam Bagtuk?

Post by dzogchungpa » Mon Aug 07, 2017 8:05 pm

Malcolm wrote:
dzogchungpa wrote:OK, thanks for the info. I've been wanting to have a Manjushri practice for a while now, so this sounds quite promising.
I rarely give advice, but what you really want is 'jam dpal smra ba'i seng ge.
I think there are several practices by this name. Do you mean the one from Dudjom Lingpa?
There is not only nothingness because there is always, and always can manifest. - Thinley Norbu Rinpoche

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Malcolm
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Re: Sapan Manjushri - Sajam Bagtuk?

Post by Malcolm » Mon Aug 07, 2017 8:10 pm

dzogchungpa wrote:
Malcolm wrote:
dzogchungpa wrote:OK, thanks for the info. I've been wanting to have a Manjushri practice for a while now, so this sounds quite promising.
I rarely give advice, but what you really want is 'jam dpal smra ba'i seng ge.
I think there are several practices by this name. Do you mean the one from Dudjom Lingpa?
Whichever one you can obtain the transmission for. They are all the same in intent and meaning. In general you want the Mañjuśrī/Sarasvati yab yum form.
Of course the Sapan Guru Yoga is fanastic too, but it is very specific, and if you are not a Sapan fanatic...
Buddhahood in This Life
འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


[A]nything at all that is well spoken is the word of the Buddha.

-- Ārya-adhyāśaya-sañcodana-nāma-mahāyāna-sūtra

The different sūtras in accord with the emptiness
taught by the Sugata are definitive in meaning;
One can understand that all of those Dharmas in
which a sentient being, individual, or person are taught are provisional in meaning.

-- Samadhirāja Sūtra

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dzogchungpa
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Re: Sapan Manjushri - Sajam Bagtuk?

Post by dzogchungpa » Mon Aug 07, 2017 8:32 pm

Malcolm wrote:Whichever one you can obtain the transmission for. They are all the same in intent and meaning. In general you want the Mañjuśrī/Sarasvati yab yum form.
Of course the Sapan Guru Yoga is fanastic too, but it is very specific, and if you are not a Sapan fanatic...
OK, I understand. I will keep an eye out for that practice.
There is not only nothingness because there is always, and always can manifest. - Thinley Norbu Rinpoche

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Malcolm
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Re: Sapan Manjushri - Sajam Bagtuk?

Post by Malcolm » Mon Aug 07, 2017 8:39 pm

dzogchungpa wrote:
Malcolm wrote:Whichever one you can obtain the transmission for. They are all the same in intent and meaning. In general you want the Mañjuśrī/Sarasvati yab yum form.
Of course the Sapan Guru Yoga is fanastic too, but it is very specific, and if you are not a Sapan fanatic...
OK, I understand. I will keep an eye out for that practice.

As it is not given frequently, since it is not as popular as entrails-chewing demon destroyers, you will probably need to make a special request for it.
Buddhahood in This Life
འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔


[A]nything at all that is well spoken is the word of the Buddha.

-- Ārya-adhyāśaya-sañcodana-nāma-mahāyāna-sūtra

The different sūtras in accord with the emptiness
taught by the Sugata are definitive in meaning;
One can understand that all of those Dharmas in
which a sentient being, individual, or person are taught are provisional in meaning.

-- Samadhirāja Sūtra

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dzogchungpa
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Re: Sapan Manjushri - Sajam Bagtuk?

Post by dzogchungpa » Mon Aug 07, 2017 9:15 pm

Malcolm wrote:
dzogchungpa wrote:
Malcolm wrote:Whichever one you can obtain the transmission for. They are all the same in intent and meaning. In general you want the Mañjuśrī/Sarasvati yab yum form.
Of course the Sapan Guru Yoga is fanastic too, but it is very specific, and if you are not a Sapan fanatic...
OK, I understand. I will keep an eye out for that practice.

As it is not given frequently, since it is not as popular as entrails-chewing demon destroyers, you will probably need to make a special request for it.
Yes, it seems that entrails chewing and demon destruction are real crowd pleasers. :smile:
There is not only nothingness because there is always, and always can manifest. - Thinley Norbu Rinpoche

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conebeckham
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Re: Sapan Manjushri - Sajam Bagtuk?

Post by conebeckham » Mon Aug 07, 2017 10:19 pm

dzogchungpa wrote:
Malcolm wrote:
dzogchungpa wrote:
OK, I understand. I will keep an eye out for that practice.

As it is not given frequently, since it is not as popular as entrails-chewing demon destroyers, you will probably need to make a special request for it.
Yes, it seems that entrails chewing and demon destruction are real crowd pleasers. :smile:
Many Kagyu lamas give the one from NamCho Mingyur Dorje, in my experience.
དམ་པའི་དོན་ནི་ཤེས་རབ་ཆེ་བ་དང་།
རྟོག་གེའི་ཡུལ་མིན་བླ་མའི་བྱིན་རླབས་དང་།
སྐལ་ལྡན་ལས་འཕྲོ་ཅན་གྱིས་རྟོགས་པ་སྟེ།
དེ་ནི་ཤེས་རབ་ལ་ནི་ལོ་རྟོག་སེལ།།


"Absolute Truth is not an object of analytical discourse or great discriminating wisdom,
It is realized through the blessing grace of the Guru and fortunate Karmic potential.
Like this, mistaken ideas of discriminating wisdom are clarified."
- (Kyabje Bokar Rinpoche, from his summary of "The Ocean of Definitive Meaning")

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dzogchungpa
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Re: Sapan Manjushri - Sajam Bagtuk?

Post by dzogchungpa » Mon Aug 07, 2017 11:21 pm

Here are links to a translation of such a sadhana and a commentary:
https://buddha-nature.com/2011/06/10/cl ... -thrinlay/
https://buddha-nature.com/2011/06/08/th ... -rinpoche/

It seems that a certain "Cone Beckham" especially appreciated the latter. :smile:
There is not only nothingness because there is always, and always can manifest. - Thinley Norbu Rinpoche

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conebeckham
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Re: Sapan Manjushri - Sajam Bagtuk?

Post by conebeckham » Mon Aug 07, 2017 11:45 pm

Well, of course he did!
དམ་པའི་དོན་ནི་ཤེས་རབ་ཆེ་བ་དང་།
རྟོག་གེའི་ཡུལ་མིན་བླ་མའི་བྱིན་རླབས་དང་།
སྐལ་ལྡན་ལས་འཕྲོ་ཅན་གྱིས་རྟོགས་པ་སྟེ།
དེ་ནི་ཤེས་རབ་ལ་ནི་ལོ་རྟོག་སེལ།།


"Absolute Truth is not an object of analytical discourse or great discriminating wisdom,
It is realized through the blessing grace of the Guru and fortunate Karmic potential.
Like this, mistaken ideas of discriminating wisdom are clarified."
- (Kyabje Bokar Rinpoche, from his summary of "The Ocean of Definitive Meaning")

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