Re: Norbu House & Domo Geshe Rinpoche
Posted: Fri Mar 30, 2012 10:57 am
I have no idea about domo geshe Ginpoche. Who is she?
A Buddhist discussion forum on Mahayana and Vajrayana Buddhism
Not who she says she is. All Tulkus require official recognition there are already two officially recognized Domo Rinpoche reincarnations one via Trijang Chocktrul who is also recognized by the previous Domo Geshe Rinpoches Dungkar Gonpa society and another one recognized by HH Dalai lama ( May well be another emanation enlightened beings like to benefit all sides) The Problem is her lack of credentials and unorthodox methods a quick bit of back ground checking on anyone claiming to be a Tulku is enough to find out whether they are genuine or not using such a status as a basis of teaching without correct recognition is a serious misconduct and its advisable not to involve ones self with such a person who builds their career such a foundation. Whether or not she has genuine compassion or not isn't the point.johnn34 wrote:I have no idea about domo geshe Ginpoche. Who is she?
Says the last post.Whether or not she has genuine compassion or not isn't the point.
Deceiving people is not living a dharmic life, no matter how pretty the words that spill out of ones mouth are.spot dawa wrote:lives a Dharmic life
I don't see how this is a contradiction or even a tension in the teachings. It's entirely possible for someone to fit into both categories at once: 1. directly experienced the truth of the teachings through practice 2. have done so in the context of a traditional training regimen, had set foot in a Tibetan exile community, &c.spot dawa wrote: While acknowledging the persuasive power of the Shakyamuni's words as reported in the Pali Sutras on this subject, to be convinced by reasoned acceptance of a view is just one of the five things which Buddha taught may turn out in two different ways in this world: Something may be regarded as true while actually being false, and something else may be regarded as untrue while being factually true. For this reason, no reasonable person takes the perspective, "Only this is true, nothing else can be the truth." In other words, your systems of lineage and teaching may or may not be wholly true, just as it may turn out that there is one iota of joy more in the world than suffering. Without direct experience, I would have to put my faith in Buddha, which is a fine thing to do, but not part of my path.
And we are told to put our faith in our gurus, in their lineage, in their dharma. But I can tell you by direct experience, wearing robes and having sat at the foot of a Tibetan exile does not alone qualify one to teach the Dharma, which is to be known and experienced directly.
So what, I have a doctrinal quibble about the basic tenets! I cannot take vows from any legitimate guru, to be sure. But I am still able to devote my life to generosity, tonglen-- although it is a pre-Buddhist tradition described in the Bhagavad-Gita, karma yoga is a close description to how I have spent the past five years. I am a renunciate, but without a lineage. I have read a lot of Chogyam Trungpa -- how is that for a failed llama? I mean, seriously.
And yet, Trungpa's simple words penetrate and soften my heart all the time. Reflecting on his commentary on the Lojong slogans has literally changed my life, my way of earning a living, my relationships. So...qualified to be a guru? Besides being dead, I mean. Honestly, I have no idea. :
I am not fascinated at all, I merely want her to put her money where her mouth is in terms of the claims she makes. In terms of a person with a helpful grasp of the dharma- that is exactly my point, why isn't that enough? Why try to inflate your credentials with claims that have been repeatedly rebuked?I guess I want to know, why are you so much more fascinated with her "really being" or "really not being" Domo Geshe Rinpoche, than a person with a helpful grasp of the dharma?
Jikan, I experience directly the truth of my situation. Practicing the Dharma has changed my life completely, and continues to draw me in.Jikan wrote:What's preventing you from experiencing, directly, the truth of your situation in terms of practice? (bracketing all these questions about which doctrine is right or what that doctrine means)
Malabeads, that is a wonderful thought. I have never proceeded past this "investigative" stage with a teacher, because I have never been satisfied with what turns up. This person is just one more rather colorful example.For the good student, one who has immersed him or herself in the teachings for a long time, Dharma can appear anywhere and everywhere. The source becomes quite secondary to the experience of Dharma itself. Sometimes a single word from an obscure poem can have me flat and weeping because it provides some insight in the best sense of the word. Why does this happen? Well, for lack of a better way to put it, I would say because I was ripe.
Of course in today's world we can take a person who refuses to kill another human as being essentially enlightened in some circumstances and certainly a person who holds just the five precepts pretty purely.spot dawa wrote:I have been bemused and amused by some venerables I have met, disparaging the quality of their own practice and assuring everyone that their true enlightenment is aeons away...
Spot, the reason for concern is that Vajrayana is a very powerful and swift path, and its karmic weightiness reflects that power. One can be profoundly led astray by a false teacher on the path of Vajrayana and one's path ruined for this and many lifetimes. Even in an ordinary sense, if someone came to a have a lot of trust in this woman and open up to her and consider her their guru, and she was then to shatter that trust, it may well shatter their ability to trust in the authenticity of the Vajrayana path and certainly in any sort of spiritual guide after that.spot dawa wrote:Still I see no reason to wonder or to test such a ridiculous proposition. She may be living in some kind of fantasy! But this is true of every single one of us. I do not care if she can fool a test, or not, or whether or not that is what she might be doing! There are other ways to learn to speak perfect Tibetan than by incarnating your guru or whatever. Although this whole thing sounds kind of Tantric to me, I am no initiate so my observations along that line are moot.
I guess I want to know, why are you so much more fascinated with her "really being" or "really not being" Domo Geshe Rinpoche, than a person with a helpful grasp of the dharma? Because my first experience with reading her book makes me grateful for her, enough to forgive a bit of craziness even. The true test of whether she is a dharmic teacher or not is not what language she speaks, or what imaginary "self" she claims to be (yours is also imaginary!), but whether or not she teaches the Dharma, and lives a Dharmic life. Besides pretending to be a Tulku, but in the end that may be seen in a playful light by all of them: I think all Tulkus are pretend Tulkus! That doesn't mean I will not listen to them, and examine their teachings in light of my own experience and understanding.
Uh, no. I've known many good, intelligent people that have great 'Dharma raps' and live ethical lives. They are not Dharma teachers. There's a bit more to it than that.The true test of whether she is a dharmic teacher or not is...whether or not she teaches the Dharma, and lives a Dharmic life.
There is betrayal of trust, and there is failure of trust. Betrayal is clear; one person uses the trust that has been established for their own selfish ends. Failure of trust is just as devastating, but more innocent. It is possible to try to help someone and to just make matters worse. As the actor Michael Cain once said about the American involvement in Viet Nam, "The worst damage is done by well intentioned people that don't understand what they are doing."...if someone came to a have a lot of trust in this woman and open up to her and consider her their guru, and she was then to shatter that trust, it may well shatter their ability to trust in the authenticity of the Vajrayana path and certainly in any sort of spiritual guide after that.
Isn't that the truth. I've learned that too much generosity in one direction may cause great resentment, especially where there is a great need. People need to feel as though they are giving something back in return; or like me they are not especially graceful on the receiving end. Even simple things require some skill on the path.smcj wrote:It is possible to try to help someone and to just make matters worse.
Absolutely. When it comes down to it, if someone wants to run around by themselves claiming to be a self-appointed tulku, then who cares.JKhedrup wrote: If she is living in a profound fantasy about this, it is probably more of a deluded fantasy than most of us (though I do agree people have their fantasies). If this is the case, that it is some kind of psychosis, it could be very damaging if fragile people become here students.
We have to hold those who claim to be "dharma teachers"to a higher standard