Koryu Shugendo

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Nyedrag Yeshe
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Koryu Shugendo

Post by Nyedrag Yeshe » Thu Feb 01, 2018 9:02 pm

Has someone here in DW done any practice or training with Koryu Shugendo? What do you have to say about to this tradition? Is the lineage authentic and ancient as they claim to be?
“Whatever has to happen, let it happen!”
“Whatever the situation is, it’s fine!”
“I really don’t need anything!
~Tsangpa Gyare Yeshe Dorje (1161-1211)
ओं पद्मोष्णीष विमले हूँ फट । ओं हनुफशभरहृदय स्वाहा॥
འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔ ཀརྨ་པ་མཁྱེན་ནོ།

crazy-man
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Re: Koryu Shugendo

Post by crazy-man » Fri Feb 02, 2018 12:38 am

The lineage seems to be authentic, but there are some problems with Mr. "Ninja" Stephen Hayes

My Disassociation From the Koryū Shugen Honshū
http://shugendo.org/node/18

Last edited by crazy-man on Fri Feb 02, 2018 12:43 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Nyedrag Yeshe
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Re: Koryu Shugendo

Post by Nyedrag Yeshe » Fri Feb 02, 2018 12:43 am

crazy-man wrote:
Fri Feb 02, 2018 12:38 am
The lineage seems to be authentic, but there are some problems with Mr. "Ninja" Stephen Hayes

My Disassociation From the Koryū Shugen Honshū
http://shugendo.org/node/18

Thanks! It seems that their head teacher also is not an easygoing person though!

Also, I'm not very knowledgeable in Shugendo, but it seems that since Meiji era all Shugendo sects are affiliated either with Tendai or Shingon. Is this sect totally independent, if so, how? Also in their master's biography, it says that he "revived" the practices from old texts, how can there be any kind of transmission here?
Last edited by Nyedrag Yeshe on Fri Feb 02, 2018 12:47 am, edited 1 time in total.
“Whatever has to happen, let it happen!”
“Whatever the situation is, it’s fine!”
“I really don’t need anything!
~Tsangpa Gyare Yeshe Dorje (1161-1211)
ओं पद्मोष्णीष विमले हूँ फट । ओं हनुफशभरहृदय स्वाहा॥
འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔ ཀརྨ་པ་མཁྱེན་ནོ།

crazy-man
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Re: Koryu Shugendo

Post by crazy-man » Fri Feb 02, 2018 12:45 am

There is also a Facebook-Post see "https:// www.facebook.com/koshikidake/posts/1557038831010084"
With the Meiji-period abolition of Shugendō, practitioners went in three directions: they either grew their hair and became Shinto priests (shinshoku), joined the Tendai or Shingon sects of Buddhism, or returned to secular life, and Shugendō ceased to exist as an organized religion. Shugendō practice continued to be observed, however, within the Tendai and Shingon schools of Buddhism, and within sectarian Shinto (kyōha Shintō) groups such as Fusōkyō, Jikkōkyō, and Mitakekyō.
The fourth period of Shugendō history runs from the promulgation of the aforementioned postwar Religious Corporations Ordinance to the present. A wide variety of new Shugendō organizations exist with an equally wide variety of affiliations, from the old Honzanha and Tōzanha groups and independent practitioners who formerly were associated with individual mountains, to new religions of a Shugendō nature.
http://eos.kokugakuin.ac.jp/modules/xwo ... ntryID=830

Biography of koshikidake Shokai
https://books.google.de/books?id=OmYnDA ... ke&f=false

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Meido
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Re: Koryu Shugendo

Post by Meido » Fri Feb 02, 2018 1:24 am

Gaynor Sekimori did some research on the post-war rebirth/revival of various Shugendo traditions that I have found interesting. Among others it has examined the one in question, which apparently was a family tradition able to preserve an archive of ritual manuals and other documents:

For example:

http://www.jstor.org/stable/44167432?se ... b_contents

~ Meido
It is relatively easy to accomplish the important matter of insight into one’s true nature, but uncommonly difficult to function freely and clearly [according to this understanding], in motion and in rest, in good and in adverse circumstances. Please make strenuous and vigorous efforts towards this end, otherwise all the teachings of Buddhas and patriarchs become mere empty words. - Torei

The Rinzai Zen Way: A Guide to Practice

Korinji Rinzai Zen Monastery [臨済宗 • 祖的山光林禅寺] - http://www.korinji.org

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Nyedrag Yeshe
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Re: Koryu Shugendo

Post by Nyedrag Yeshe » Fri Feb 02, 2018 1:31 am

Meido wrote:
Fri Feb 02, 2018 1:24 am
Gaynor Sekimori did some research on the post-war rebirth/revival of various Shugendo traditions that I have found interesting. Among others it has examined the one in question, which apparently was a family tradition able to preserve an archive of ritual manuals and other documents:

For example:

http://www.jstor.org/stable/44167432?se ... b_contents

~ Meido
Thanks Rev. Meido! :anjali:
“Whatever has to happen, let it happen!”
“Whatever the situation is, it’s fine!”
“I really don’t need anything!
~Tsangpa Gyare Yeshe Dorje (1161-1211)
ओं पद्मोष्णीष विमले हूँ फट । ओं हनुफशभरहृदय स्वाहा॥
འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔ ཀརྨ་པ་མཁྱེན་ནོ།

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Nyedrag Yeshe
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Re: Koryu Shugendo

Post by Nyedrag Yeshe » Fri Feb 02, 2018 1:37 am

But from what I can sense from the article, the lineage is a "reconstructed" one, and not one that derives from a living transmission between a contemporary teacher and student!
“Whatever has to happen, let it happen!”
“Whatever the situation is, it’s fine!”
“I really don’t need anything!
~Tsangpa Gyare Yeshe Dorje (1161-1211)
ओं पद्मोष्णीष विमले हूँ फट । ओं हनुफशभरहृदय स्वाहा॥
འ༔ ཨ༔ ཧ༔ ཤ༔ ས༔ མ༔ ཀརྨ་པ་མཁྱེན་ནོ།

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Meido
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Re: Koryu Shugendo

Post by Meido » Fri Feb 02, 2018 1:51 am

One assumes that the Tendai and Shugendo training detailed starting on pg. 58 of that article was considered sufficient to revive the specific rituals recorded in the family materials.

In regard to Shinto elements, I have no idea if "transmission" is viewed in the manner to which we are accustomed in Buddhist circles.

I'm mostly out of my depth here, so I'll let others chime in.

~ Meido
It is relatively easy to accomplish the important matter of insight into one’s true nature, but uncommonly difficult to function freely and clearly [according to this understanding], in motion and in rest, in good and in adverse circumstances. Please make strenuous and vigorous efforts towards this end, otherwise all the teachings of Buddhas and patriarchs become mere empty words. - Torei

The Rinzai Zen Way: A Guide to Practice

Korinji Rinzai Zen Monastery [臨済宗 • 祖的山光林禅寺] - http://www.korinji.org

DGA
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Re: Koryu Shugendo

Post by DGA » Fri Feb 02, 2018 2:08 am

crazy-man wrote:
Fri Feb 02, 2018 12:38 am
The lineage seems to be authentic, but there are some problems with Mr. "Ninja" Stephen Hayes

My Disassociation From the Koryū Shugen Honshū
http://shugendo.org/node/18
I can't speak to the question of the Koryū Shugen Honshū group specifically. I can say that Mr Hayes has a long history of the kind of behavior that is described in the article linked above: taking liberties with various customs and permissions to set himself up as a teacher in a Japanese esoteric lineage. He's one of several that we have discussed before under the (probably inauspicious) heading, "Tendai and Pretend-ai." Start here for a dip in a very peculiar pool:

viewtopic.php?t=3949

I don't think Hayes is a bad person; I don't know him. I am saying that he has a track record of being invited to do Thing One, and then going off to do Thing Two instead. :shrug:

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Meido
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Re: Koryu Shugendo

Post by Meido » Fri Feb 02, 2018 2:12 am

DGA wrote:
Fri Feb 02, 2018 2:08 am
"Tendai and Pretend-ai."
FWIW, I always thought that coining the term "Pretend-ai" was a stroke of genius.
It is relatively easy to accomplish the important matter of insight into one’s true nature, but uncommonly difficult to function freely and clearly [according to this understanding], in motion and in rest, in good and in adverse circumstances. Please make strenuous and vigorous efforts towards this end, otherwise all the teachings of Buddhas and patriarchs become mere empty words. - Torei

The Rinzai Zen Way: A Guide to Practice

Korinji Rinzai Zen Monastery [臨済宗 • 祖的山光林禅寺] - http://www.korinji.org

DGA
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Re: Koryu Shugendo

Post by DGA » Fri Feb 02, 2018 2:17 am

Meido wrote:
Fri Feb 02, 2018 2:12 am
DGA wrote:
Fri Feb 02, 2018 2:08 am
"Tendai and Pretend-ai."
FWIW, I always thought that coining the term "Pretend-ai" was a stroke of genius.
I can't claim credit. It came up in conversation between myself and Doko Christopher O'Brien, who leads the Tendai sangha in Denver. I think he coined it.

Kaminohitoshisan
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Re: Koryu Shugendo

Post by Kaminohitoshisan » Thu Aug 23, 2018 11:51 pm

Hi, please, I'm serch the book "Koryu Shugen Honshu Sutra Recitation Service". Do you can help me?it's on sale or even copies on sale?
Thank you.
( sorry for my bad English)
Kaminohitoshi san

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