when Taisekiji first stated original Buddha and dai Gohonzon

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Minobu
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when Taisekiji first stated original Buddha and dai Gohonzon

Post by Minobu »

So Nichiren Shonin left six senior priests to continue His work...

all knew the same stuff...All were practicing exactly as He wished for at the time He anointed them senior priests.

Nikko got laid unto a huge tract of land from a feudal lord..

sometime later and i'm sure it was a few hundred years after Nikko Shonin's death that this whole concept of a super gohonzon and that Nichiren Shonin was the Eternal Primordial Buddha of Kuon Ganjo.

I recall someone somewhere nailed down which High Priest laid the ground work for these concepts..and it wasn't Nikko shonin..

The DaiGohonzon has been said to have been planed with a wood planing tool and method not known at the time of Nichiren Shonin..this is a fact easily solved by letting scientist test the plank of wood

documents galore in Nichiren Buddhism are deemed not authentic ...but with prope historical work I'm sure we can conclude that the whole affair that Shoshu proclaims is false.

only shoShu has this paradigm....

for me anything that takes away from someone having faith in Lord Sakyamuni as the Buddha of our era and His Mandala is spread across all of the three existances , is a crime.
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Re: when Taisekiji first stated original Buddha and dai Gohonzon

Post by Shotenzenjin »

Minobu wrote: Thu Aug 27, 2020 6:12 pm So Nichiren Shonin left six senior priests to continue His work...

all knew the same stuff...All were practicing exactly as He wished for at the time He anointed them senior priests.

Nikko got laid unto a huge tract of land from a feudal lord..

sometime later and i'm sure it was a few hundred years after Nikko Shonin's death that this whole concept of a super gohonzon and that Nichiren Shonin was the Eternal Primordial Buddha of Kuon Ganjo.

I recall someone somewhere nailed down which High Priest laid the ground work for these concepts..and it wasn't Nikko shonin..

The DaiGohonzon has been said to have been planed with a wood planing tool and method not known at the time of Nichiren Shonin..this is a fact easily solved by letting scientist test the plank of wood

documents galore in Nichiren Buddhism are deemed not authentic ...but with prope historical work I'm sure we can conclude that the whole affair that Shoshu proclaims is false.

only shoShu has this paradigm....

for me anything that takes away from someone having faith in Lord Sakyamuni as the Buddha of our era and His Mandala is spread across all of the three existances , is a crime.
You seem to be holding a grudge against Nichiren shoshu true Buddhism.

I understand you have a personal history which likely clouds your judgment in this.

I respect the knowledge you bring to this topic but it seems to me to be more gripes then anything.

Others far more knwolegible then me can better address your thoughts on this.

There is no false doctrine in Nichiren Shoshu.
Generation's shall pass, our determination shall grow, at the foot of Mount Fuji
Like smoke that reaches far beyond the clouds.--nichimoku shonin. Third high priest of Nichiren Shoshu

Hokekko of true Buddhism https://nstny.org

Introduction to Nichiren Shoshu Buddhism
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source= ... VKyEQ_cxK9
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_johnarundel_
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Re: when Taisekiji first stated original Buddha and dai Gohonzon

Post by _johnarundel_ »

I shall repost this from the other thread

Both the Buddha of Kuon-Ganjo and the Dai-Gohonzon were in existence at the time of Nikko Shonin.

First, Nikko Shonin states in the "Articles to be Observed after the Passing of Nikko" ("Nikko Ato Jojo no Koto"),
Article 2: The Dai-Gohonzon of the second year of Kō`an (1279), which Nikko inherited [from Nichiren Daishonin], is hereby bequeathed to Nichimoku. It should be enshrined at Hommonji Temple.

(Gosho, p. 1884)
The original of this document exists at Taiseki-ji. Two of them exist. One is a draft dating from the second year of Gentoku (1330). The actual transfer document is dated the fist year of Shoukei (1332).

There is a book in Japanese that compares the signatures and seals of this document and others of Nikko Shonin's documents and letters from this time in his life, and it is shown to be consistent. I believe parts of this book that compares the signature is online in Japanese. I'll see if I can get it to anyone who wants it.

Considering the Daishonin as the Buddha. Nikko Shonin himself referes to Nichiren Daishonin as the Buddha. The following terminology appears in Nikko Shonin's writings, when specifically referring to Nichiren Daishonin:
  • Hotoke Shonin- Nikko Shonin is referring to the Daishonin. Hotoke translates as Buddha. Shonin means Nichiren Daishonin. So one can read this in English as "The Buddha Daishonin"
  • Hotoke no Hozen - Hotoke as I mentioned means "Buddha." no Hozen refers to "reverence". So this can be read as "reverence torwards the Buddha." In the context of this letter, Nikko Shonin is referring to Nichiren Daishonin.
  • Hossu Shonin no Gohozen - hozen means reverence. Go is honorific and means sacred. Hossu Shonin means lord/teacher/master/high priest of the whole world.
Also, in two documents, "One Hundred and Six Articles" ("Hyaku Rokka Sho") and "On the True Cause" ("Honinmyo-sho"), Nichiren Daishonin specifically refers to himself as the Buddha. These two documents are called the Ryokan Kechimyaku.

Howver, these documents are disputed by Nichiren Shu and other Nichiren sects. Parts of these two documents have had later additions to them. Thus, 59th High Priest Nichiko Shonin, a renowned Buddhist scholar of his time, went through these two documents and seperated the original writing from the later additions.

Also, as Shoho has expained, the "True Object of Worship" ("Kanjin no Honzon Sho"), teaches this doctrine as well.
"The five characters of Myoho-Renge-Kyo are the core of the Lotus Sutra and the origin of all Buddhas throughout the entire world. Upon seeing the signs that these five characters now must be propagated, I, Nichiren, have set the precedent, today, at the beginning of the Latter Day of the Law."

- Nichiren Daishonin, “Shuju onfurumai-gosho” 種種御振舞御書


https://www.nichirenshoshu.or.jp/eng/daishonin.html
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Queequeg
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Re: when Taisekiji first stated original Buddha and dai Gohonzon

Post by Queequeg »

Shotenzenjin wrote: Thu Aug 27, 2020 7:13 pm Others far more knwolegible then me can better address your thoughts on this.

There is no false doctrine in Nichiren Shoshu.
Do you not see something incompatible with those two thoughts? If you don't know, you can't make the second statement.
Those who, even with distracted minds,
Entered a stupa compound
And chanted but once, “Namo Buddhaya!”
Have certainly attained the path of the buddhas.

-Lotus Sutra, Expedient Means Chapter

There are beings with little dust in their eyes who are falling away because they do not hear the Dhamma. There will be those who will understand the Dhamma.
-Ayacana Sutta
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Minobu
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Re: when Taisekiji first stated original Buddha and dai Gohonzon

Post by Minobu »

Shotenzenjin wrote: Thu Aug 27, 2020 7:13 pm
Minobu wrote: Thu Aug 27, 2020 6:12 pm So Nichiren Shonin left six senior priests to continue His work...

all knew the same stuff...All were practicing exactly as He wished for at the time He anointed them senior priests.

Nikko got laid unto a huge tract of land from a feudal lord..

sometime later and i'm sure it was a few hundred years after Nikko Shonin's death that this whole concept of a super gohonzon and that Nichiren Shonin was the Eternal Primordial Buddha of Kuon Ganjo.

I recall someone somewhere nailed down which High Priest laid the ground work for these concepts..and it wasn't Nikko shonin..

The DaiGohonzon has been said to have been planed with a wood planing tool and method not known at the time of Nichiren Shonin..this is a fact easily solved by letting scientist test the plank of wood

documents galore in Nichiren Buddhism are deemed not authentic ...but with prope historical work I'm sure we can conclude that the whole affair that Shoshu proclaims is false.

only shoShu has this paradigm....

for me anything that takes away from someone having faith in Lord Sakyamuni as the Buddha of our era and His Mandala is spread across all of the three existances , is a crime.
You seem to be holding a grudge against Nichiren shoshu true Buddhism.

I understand you have a personal history which likely clouds your judgment in this.

I respect the knowledge you bring to this topic but it seems to me to be more gripes then anything.

Others far more knwolegible then me can better address your thoughts on this.

There is no false doctrine in Nichiren Shoshu.
me dad's ashes are at Taisekiji and i would like to bring me mum's ashes there one day so they can be together...i don't hate ShoShu , it's more like my family members being abused...

once you take Lord Sakyamuni Buddha out of the picture theway ShoShu does you cannot expect me not to go bonkers...sorry if i hurt your feelings...but if you insist on trying to destroy Lord Sakyamuni Buddha's era...well grow some...
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Re: when Taisekiji first stated original Buddha and dai Gohonzon

Post by Minobu »

_johnarundel_ wrote: Thu Aug 27, 2020 7:19 pm I shall repost this from the other thread

Both the Buddha of Kuon-Ganjo and the Dai-Gohonzon were in existence at the time of Nikko Shonin.

First, Nikko Shonin states in the "Articles to be Observed after the Passing of Nikko" ("Nikko Ato Jojo no Koto"),
Article 2: The Dai-Gohonzon of the second year of Kō`an (1279), which Nikko inherited [from Nichiren Daishonin], is hereby bequeathed to Nichimoku. It should be enshrined at Hommonji Temple.

(Gosho, p. 1884)
The original of this document exists at Taiseki-ji. Two of them exist. One is a draft dating from the second year of Gentoku (1330). The actual transfer document is dated the fist year of Shoukei (1332).

There is a book in Japanese that compares the signatures and seals of this document and others of Nikko Shonin's documents and letters from this time in his life, and it is shown to be consistent. I believe parts of this book that compares the signature is online in Japanese. I'll see if I can get it to anyone who wants it.

Considering the Daishonin as the Buddha. Nikko Shonin himself referes to Nichiren Daishonin as the Buddha. The following terminology appears in Nikko Shonin's writings, when specifically referring to Nichiren Daishonin:
  • Hotoke Shonin- Nikko Shonin is referring to the Daishonin. Hotoke translates as Buddha. Shonin means Nichiren Daishonin. So one can read this in English as "The Buddha Daishonin"
  • Hotoke no Hozen - Hotoke as I mentioned means "Buddha." no Hozen refers to "reverence". So this can be read as "reverence torwards the Buddha." In the context of this letter, Nikko Shonin is referring to Nichiren Daishonin.
  • Hossu Shonin no Gohozen - hozen means reverence. Go is honorific and means sacred. Hossu Shonin means lord/teacher/master/high priest of the whole world.
Also, in two documents, "One Hundred and Six Articles" ("Hyaku Rokka Sho") and "On the True Cause" ("Honinmyo-sho"), Nichiren Daishonin specifically refers to himself as the Buddha. These two documents are called the Ryokan Kechimyaku.

Howver, these documents are disputed by Nichiren Shu and other Nichiren sects. Parts of these two documents have had later additions to them. Thus, 59th High Priest Nichiko Shonin, a renowned Buddhist scholar of his time, went through these two documents and seperated the original writing from the later additions.

Also, as Shoho has expained, the "True Object of Worship" ("Kanjin no Honzon Sho"), teaches this doctrine as well.

like i said...the Daigohonzon is not made from tools of Nichiren Shonin's time period...

then the most obvious is this...

six senior priests all agreed on the same stuff ...it wasn't like Nichiren chose five and told them one thing and a sixth and told him another thing...

5 against one...i believe Nikko Shonin never knew any of this stuff that ShoShu now takes for granted....

so many documents are falsified...and i believe it was like two hundred years after the passing of Nikko Shonin when some high priest introduced all these fake assertions..and shoshu was created...


anyways...no where does Nichiren plainly tell us about the DaiGohonzon in some gosho or document that is proved beyound a shadow of doubt real...Nor the Buddha of kuon ganjo...

if you could actually show this and have it held up in universities and by scholarly historians....all this talk would be moot...but you cannot ..cause it's not true...you can only rely on dodgey documentation.
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Shotenzenjin
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Re: when Taisekiji first stated original Buddha and dai Gohonzon

Post by Shotenzenjin »

Minobu wrote: Thu Aug 27, 2020 7:27 pm
Shotenzenjin wrote: Thu Aug 27, 2020 7:13 pm
Minobu wrote: Thu Aug 27, 2020 6:12 pm So Nichiren Shonin left six senior priests to continue His work...

all knew the same stuff...All were practicing exactly as He wished for at the time He anointed them senior priests.

Nikko got laid unto a huge tract of land from a feudal lord..

sometime later and i'm sure it was a few hundred years after Nikko Shonin's death that this whole concept of a super gohonzon and that Nichiren Shonin was the Eternal Primordial Buddha of Kuon Ganjo.

I recall someone somewhere nailed down which High Priest laid the ground work for these concepts..and it wasn't Nikko shonin..

The DaiGohonzon has been said to have been planed with a wood planing tool and method not known at the time of Nichiren Shonin..this is a fact easily solved by letting scientist test the plank of wood

documents galore in Nichiren Buddhism are deemed not authentic ...but with prope historical work I'm sure we can conclude that the whole affair that Shoshu proclaims is false.

only shoShu has this paradigm....

for me anything that takes away from someone having faith in Lord Sakyamuni as the Buddha of our era and His Mandala is spread across all of the three existances , is a crime.
You seem to be holding a grudge against Nichiren shoshu true Buddhism.

I understand you have a personal history which likely clouds your judgment in this.

I respect the knowledge you bring to this topic but it seems to me to be more gripes then anything.

Others far more knwolegible then me can better address your thoughts on this.

There is no false doctrine in Nichiren Shoshu.
me dad's ashes are at Taisekiji and i would like to bring me mum's ashes there one day so they can be together...i don't hate ShoShu , it's more like my family members being abused...

once you take Lord Sakyamuni Buddha out of the picture theway ShoShu does you cannot expect me not to go bonkers...sorry if i hurt your feelings...but if you insist on trying to destroy Lord Sakyamuni Buddha's era...well grow some...

You haven't hurt my feeling minobu sorry if I came on a bit strong.

I know through your posts your father's ashes are at Taisekiji. It's good you want your mother's ashes there too.
Generation's shall pass, our determination shall grow, at the foot of Mount Fuji
Like smoke that reaches far beyond the clouds.--nichimoku shonin. Third high priest of Nichiren Shoshu

Hokekko of true Buddhism https://nstny.org

Introduction to Nichiren Shoshu Buddhism
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source= ... VKyEQ_cxK9
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Re: when Taisekiji first stated original Buddha and dai Gohonzon

Post by Queequeg »

_johnarundel_ wrote: Thu Aug 27, 2020 7:19 pm I shall repost this from the other thread

Both the Buddha of Kuon-Ganjo and the Dai-Gohonzon were in existence at the time of Nikko Shonin.

First, Nikko Shonin states in the "Articles to be Observed after the Passing of Nikko" ("Nikko Ato Jojo no Koto"),
Article 2: The Dai-Gohonzon of the second year of Kō`an (1279), which Nikko inherited [from Nichiren Daishonin], is hereby bequeathed to Nichimoku. It should be enshrined at Hommonji Temple.

(Gosho, p. 1884)
The original of this document exists at Taiseki-ji. Two of them exist. One is a draft dating from the second year of Gentoku (1330). The actual transfer document is dated the fist year of Shoukei (1332).

There is a book in Japanese that compares the signatures and seals of this document and others of Nikko Shonin's documents and letters from this time in his life, and it is shown to be consistent. I believe parts of this book that compares the signature is online in Japanese. I'll see if I can get it to anyone who wants it.

Considering the Daishonin as the Buddha. Nikko Shonin himself referes to Nichiren Daishonin as the Buddha. The following terminology appears in Nikko Shonin's writings, when specifically referring to Nichiren Daishonin:
  • Hotoke Shonin- Nikko Shonin is referring to the Daishonin. Hotoke translates as Buddha. Shonin means Nichiren Daishonin. So one can read this in English as "The Buddha Daishonin"
  • Hotoke no Hozen - Hotoke as I mentioned means "Buddha." no Hozen refers to "reverence". So this can be read as "reverence torwards the Buddha." In the context of this letter, Nikko Shonin is referring to Nichiren Daishonin.
  • Hossu Shonin no Gohozen - hozen means reverence. Go is honorific and means sacred. Hossu Shonin means lord/teacher/master/high priest of the whole world.
Also, in two documents, "One Hundred and Six Articles" ("Hyaku Rokka Sho") and "On the True Cause" ("Honinmyo-sho"), Nichiren Daishonin specifically refers to himself as the Buddha. These two documents are called the Ryokan Kechimyaku.

Howver, these documents are disputed by Nichiren Shu and other Nichiren sects. Parts of these two documents have had later additions to them. Thus, 59th High Priest Nichiko Shonin, a renowned Buddhist scholar of his time, went through these two documents and seperated the original writing from the later additions.

Also, as Shoho has expained, the "True Object of Worship" ("Kanjin no Honzon Sho"), teaches this doctrine as well.
Hommonji = Kitayamahommonji? Nikko only spent a brief time at Taisekiji. "His" main temple was Omosu (Kitayama). He would not have left the Daigohonzon at Taisekiji. The one existent mandala that actually says anything like "Daigohonzon" is the Manen-Kyugo Dai Honzon, originally entrusted to Nikko, then Nikko to Nichimoku, and then somehow it ended up at Hota Myohonji.

Regarding Daigohonzon and lineage claims...

https://nichirenmandala.weebly.com/uplo ... andala.pdf

Its a rabbit hole. Go practice instead.
Those who, even with distracted minds,
Entered a stupa compound
And chanted but once, “Namo Buddhaya!”
Have certainly attained the path of the buddhas.

-Lotus Sutra, Expedient Means Chapter

There are beings with little dust in their eyes who are falling away because they do not hear the Dhamma. There will be those who will understand the Dhamma.
-Ayacana Sutta
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Re: when Taisekiji first stated original Buddha and dai Gohonzon

Post by _johnarundel_ »

Queequeg wrote: Thu Aug 27, 2020 7:41 pm Hommonji = Kitayamahommonji? Nikko only spent a brief time at Taisekiji. "His" main temple was Omosu (Kitayama). He would not have left the Daigohonzon at Taisekiji. The one existent mandala that actually says anything like "Daigohonzon" is the Manen-Kyugo Dai Honzon, originally entrusted to Nikko, then Nikko to Nichimoku, and then somehow it ended up at Hota Myohonji.

Regarding Daigohonzon and lineage claims...

https://nichirenmandala.weebly.com/uplo ... andala.pdf

Its a rabbit hole. Go practice instead.
"Honmonji" simply means "Temple of the Original Gate." Also Kitayama Honmonji is a later name. It was called Omosu Seminary during Nikko Shonin and Nichimoku Shonin's time. So, this does not have to mean Kitayama Honmonji. "Honmonji Temple" is to be established at Kosen-rufu at the foot of Mount Fuji.

Nichimoku Shonin recieved the Heritage of the Law from Nikko Shonin. It is thus natural that he would recieve the Gohonzon of the second year of Ko'an. If you read the entire document "Nikko Ato Jojo no Koto" (original exists), he says,
When Hommonji Temple is established, Ni`ida-Kyō Ajari Nichimoku shall be designated as the master of the Seat of the Law. Nichimoku, as the legitimate successor, should govern half of the temples located in the country of Japan and in the rest of the world, while the remaining half should be managed by others within the priesthood.

(Gosho, p. 1884)
This particular "Honmonji" is referred to in future tense. This signifies the Actual High Sanctuary of Essential Teaching (ji-no kaidan) that will be established at Mt. Fuji at Kosen-Rufu.

In this document Taisekiji is entrusted to Nichimoku Shonin, thus there is no reason why the Dai-Gohonzon would be anywhere else.

The "Dai-Honzon" was not inscribed in the second year of Ko'an.
"The five characters of Myoho-Renge-Kyo are the core of the Lotus Sutra and the origin of all Buddhas throughout the entire world. Upon seeing the signs that these five characters now must be propagated, I, Nichiren, have set the precedent, today, at the beginning of the Latter Day of the Law."

- Nichiren Daishonin, “Shuju onfurumai-gosho” 種種御振舞御書


https://www.nichirenshoshu.or.jp/eng/daishonin.html
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Re: when Taisekiji first stated original Buddha and dai Gohonzon

Post by Queequeg »

To be clear - no one except Shoshu believes in the claims about the Daigohonzon. Even Fuji school (Nikko lineage) not associated with Shoshu - accept these claims.
Those who, even with distracted minds,
Entered a stupa compound
And chanted but once, “Namo Buddhaya!”
Have certainly attained the path of the buddhas.

-Lotus Sutra, Expedient Means Chapter

There are beings with little dust in their eyes who are falling away because they do not hear the Dhamma. There will be those who will understand the Dhamma.
-Ayacana Sutta
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Re: when Taisekiji first stated original Buddha and dai Gohonzon

Post by tkp67 »

It would be easier to have this discussion if everyone understood the point of these designations. How can you tell if the directions are wrong if you haven't followed them to succinct success or failure?

It has everything to do with a moment of life, and not past or future moments but the one that we all exist in currently.
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Re: when Taisekiji first stated original Buddha and dai Gohonzon

Post by Queequeg »

tkp67 wrote: Thu Aug 27, 2020 10:10 pm How can you tell if the directions are wrong if you haven't followed them to succinct success or failure?


There are a lot of directions that just don't make any sense and are not worth the time exploring. That might just be me, though.
Those who, even with distracted minds,
Entered a stupa compound
And chanted but once, “Namo Buddhaya!”
Have certainly attained the path of the buddhas.

-Lotus Sutra, Expedient Means Chapter

There are beings with little dust in their eyes who are falling away because they do not hear the Dhamma. There will be those who will understand the Dhamma.
-Ayacana Sutta
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Re: when Taisekiji first stated original Buddha and dai Gohonzon

Post by tkp67 »

Queequeg wrote: Fri Aug 28, 2020 10:44 am There are a lot of directions that just don't make any sense and are not worth the time exploring. That might just be me, though.
In the context of the lotus sutra it makes perfect sense. In the context of Nichiren's teachings it makes perfect sense. In the context of Shakyamuni's complete, supreme and perfect enlightenment it makes sense.

All of this is to simply say they did not begrudge any mind regardless of affliction. Only we do that.

All of this is also simply to say why have a bias against the unknown regarding a teaching that requires a certain reverence for fellow practitioners regardless of differences.

It seems to me the Lotus teachings are to abolish these subtle biases in the process of revealing the true or it simply will never happen.

The assembly at the lotus and the opening of the eyes is critical here as is the moment. The later the absolute basis of "true buddhism". An unspoken basis cannot be used to achieve understanding across differences in perspectives.
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Re: when Taisekiji first stated original Buddha and dai Gohonzon

Post by Queequeg »

tkp67 wrote: Fri Aug 28, 2020 2:21 pm
Queequeg wrote: Fri Aug 28, 2020 10:44 am There are a lot of directions that just don't make any sense and are not worth the time exploring. That might just be me, though.
In the context of the lotus sutra it makes perfect sense. In the context of Nichiren's teachings it makes perfect sense. In the context of Shakyamuni's complete, supreme and perfect enlightenment it makes sense.
What makes sense?
All of this is to simply say they did not begrudge any mind regardless of affliction. Only we do that.
Who's not begrudging what?
All of this is also simply to say why have a bias against the unknown regarding a teaching that requires a certain reverence for fellow practitioners regardless of differences.
What the heck are you talking about? I've tried to parse that, and I'm at a loss.

"why have a bias against the unknown regarding a teaching that requires a certain reverence for fellow practitioners regardless of differences."

Something can't be "unknown" and yet "require" something. And who are you saying has a bias?
It seems to me the Lotus teachings are to abolish these subtle biases in the process of revealing the true or it simply will never happen.
What does that mean? What "subtle biases"? What process? What do you mean by "revealing the true"?
The assembly at the lotus and the opening of the eyes is critical here as is the moment. The later the absolute basis of "true buddhism". An unspoken basis cannot be used to achieve understanding across differences in perspectives.
I'm sorry, no way to say this except, that is gibberish.
Those who, even with distracted minds,
Entered a stupa compound
And chanted but once, “Namo Buddhaya!”
Have certainly attained the path of the buddhas.

-Lotus Sutra, Expedient Means Chapter

There are beings with little dust in their eyes who are falling away because they do not hear the Dhamma. There will be those who will understand the Dhamma.
-Ayacana Sutta
narhwal90
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Re: when Taisekiji first stated original Buddha and dai Gohonzon

Post by narhwal90 »

The Nichiren Mandala Workshop has a paper regarding the N.Shoshu Dai-Gohonzon, including a close examination of its design in relation to other original gohonzons including forensic examination of its style, as well as a presentation of relevant gosho and other documentation;

https://nichirenmandala.weebly.com

(pdf link here)
https://nichirenmandala.weebly.com/uplo ... andala.pdf

It is an interesting read.
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Re: when Taisekiji first stated original Buddha and dai Gohonzon

Post by Minobu »

narhwal90 wrote: Fri Aug 28, 2020 3:38 pm The Nichiren Mandala Workshop has a paper regarding the N.Shoshu Dai-Gohonzon, including a close examination of its design in relation to other original gohonzons including forensic examination of its style, as well as a presentation of relevant gosho and other documentation;

https://nichirenmandala.weebly.com

(pdf link here)
https://nichirenmandala.weebly.com/uplo ... andala.pdf

It is an interesting read.
reading this , not completely, i came to the conclusion that knocking the Daigohonzon is like a trick of Mara..
I will be more careful in future .
It's the emphasis that this Gohonzon has some sort of special power implied. Now thats the real problem for me...

reading this ...then coming back and seeing your post Narwhal,worked it's magic and i came to this conclusion about the whole affair and me.
Queequeg wrote: Fri Aug 28, 2020 3:35 pm

"why have a bias against the unknown regarding a teaching that requires a certain reverence for fellow practitioners regardless of differences."

As well as being more careful with others ....i do look at all of us that practice as BoE ...


thanks guys :thumbsup:
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Re: when Taisekiji first stated original Buddha and dai Gohonzon

Post by Queequeg »

Minobu wrote: Fri Aug 28, 2020 3:55 pm
Queequeg wrote: Fri Aug 28, 2020 3:35 pm

"why have a bias against the unknown regarding a teaching that requires a certain reverence for fellow practitioners regardless of differences."

As well as being more careful with others ....i do look at all of us that practice as BoE ...
I didn't write that.
Those who, even with distracted minds,
Entered a stupa compound
And chanted but once, “Namo Buddhaya!”
Have certainly attained the path of the buddhas.

-Lotus Sutra, Expedient Means Chapter

There are beings with little dust in their eyes who are falling away because they do not hear the Dhamma. There will be those who will understand the Dhamma.
-Ayacana Sutta
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Minobu
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Re: when Taisekiji first stated original Buddha and dai Gohonzon

Post by Minobu »

Queequeg wrote: Fri Aug 28, 2020 3:58 pm
Minobu wrote: Fri Aug 28, 2020 3:55 pm
Queequeg wrote: Fri Aug 28, 2020 3:35 pm

"why have a bias against the unknown regarding a teaching that requires a certain reverence for fellow practitioners regardless of differences."

As well as being more careful with others ....i do look at all of us that practice as BoE ...
I didn't write that.
sorry i cherry picked it ......but the cherry picked words screamed out towards me..

for it's like we all are by some incredible good fortune practicing the Daimoku...and i need to realize this and stop jumping on people...

yesterday someone pm'd and asked if i could cut some slack towards a noob...

i'm full of anger Q...i know it...luckily i don't have a jealous bone in my body and hatred and greed are not on my radar...but anger...oh boy...


odd but i had this out with the guy that i just cherry picked his words....because i thought they were yours ...i listened...pretty fuked up eh ...


today is turning out to be rewarding here at DW for me...learning ,learning , about me..


This morning i cried listening to a Tendai priest post his gongyo in the Tendai section...the whole thing is so beautiful...just thinking of it all my hair is risen and that rush of ...whatever it is...Bob Marley sang about it once..can't find it though...all i get are dreadlock stuff...lol..
narhwal90
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Re: when Taisekiji first stated original Buddha and dai Gohonzon

Post by narhwal90 »

Minobu wrote: Fri Aug 28, 2020 3:55 pm
narhwal90 wrote: Fri Aug 28, 2020 3:38 pm The Nichiren Mandala Workshop has a paper regarding the N.Shoshu Dai-Gohonzon, including a close examination of its design in relation to other original gohonzons including forensic examination of its style, as well as a presentation of relevant gosho and other documentation;

https://nichirenmandala.weebly.com

(pdf link here)
https://nichirenmandala.weebly.com/uplo ... andala.pdf

It is an interesting read.
reading this , not completely, i came to the conclusion that knocking the Daigohonzon is like a trick of Mara..
I will be more careful in future .
It's the emphasis that this Gohonzon has some sort of special power implied. Now thats the real problem for me...

reading this ...then coming back and seeing your post Narwhal,worked it's magic and i came to this conclusion about the whole affair and me.
Thing is, even if the Mandala folks are correct and the dai-gohonzon was created hundreds of years after Nichiren, and re-manufactured a couple times due to loss by fire (which has destroyed many dozens of originals- perhaps hundreds), its production is still entirely consistent with standard practice. Many gohonzons are said to have special power and significance. Do they actually? I don't know- and I wonder if its appropriate to make claims one way or another with respect to others' practice.
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Minobu
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Joined: Mon Aug 15, 2016 6:57 pm

Re: when Taisekiji first stated original Buddha and dai Gohonzon

Post by Minobu »

narhwal90 wrote: Fri Aug 28, 2020 5:12 pm
Minobu wrote: Fri Aug 28, 2020 3:55 pm
narhwal90 wrote: Fri Aug 28, 2020 3:38 pm The Nichiren Mandala Workshop has a paper regarding the N.Shoshu Dai-Gohonzon, including a close examination of its design in relation to other original gohonzons including forensic examination of its style, as well as a presentation of relevant gosho and other documentation;

https://nichirenmandala.weebly.com

(pdf link here)
https://nichirenmandala.weebly.com/uplo ... andala.pdf

It is an interesting read.
reading this , not completely, i came to the conclusion that knocking the Daigohonzon is like a trick of Mara..
I will be more careful in future .
It's the emphasis that this Gohonzon has some sort of special power implied. Now thats the real problem for me...

reading this ...then coming back and seeing your post Narwhal,worked it's magic and i came to this conclusion about the whole affair and me.
Thing is, even if the Mandala folks are correct and the dai-gohonzon was created hundreds of years after Nichiren, and re-manufactured a couple times due to loss by fire (which has destroyed many dozens of originals- perhaps hundreds), its production is still entirely consistent with standard practice. Many gohonzons are said to have special power and significance. Do they actually? I don't know- and I wonder if its appropriate to make claims one way or another with respect to others' practice.
well i'm back to the drawing board where a Gohonzon is a Gohonzon...except i'm not into having one with some High Priests name on it ...for thats a whole other ball of wax...i feel you are bringing his life into the picture and i;m not into that...

as for other persons...we should not argue amongst ourselves...debate but argue...no...
the trick of Mara ...i meant like Mara is fuking with us and causeing dissension ..We end up slandering a Gohonzon ...in the way we talk of it ...emotions run high and it gets worse...Mara ..

This DaiGohonzon is all Nichiren's hand ???....whether it's carved or not does not matter to me..as long as it is pure Nichiren i'm ok ...
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