If you read Ryuichi Abe (Shingon pov) and Paul Groner, you (Tendai pov) you'll find the former asserting that Saicho received initiation into the two mandalas by Kukai, but Groner points out that Saicho himself asserted that he received initiation in China.Coëmgenu wrote:]Well, there is Tendai vs Tiāntāi (and Tiāntāi vs the nascent works of its founders), and myriad stages of evolution for both.
The discourse on the mandalas reminds me of in Shingon, the "doctrine of the non-duality of the two mandalas" or something of the like, I think it was called, relating to the Diamond and Womb Realm mandalas. Did Tendai get this from cultural contact with Shingon, or is this the Tendai schools's own native system of interpretation of these mandalas that is different from Shingon discourse?
though Groner thinks he did not receive the Taizokai.
I just looked at Ryuichi Abe's The Weaving of Mantra
Abe says since there were unbridgeable differences: Saicho wanted the Esoteric teachings to be incorporated into The Tendai school and to integrate them into the exoteric Lotus sutra. And Kukai regarded the Mahavairocana Sutra and Vajrasekhara Sutra as paramount. Also Kukai maintained that the esoteric teachings required different hermeneutical and pedagogical methods. 44
Later Ennin of Tendai shu went to China during 37-848 to study and brought back a wealth of esoteric material and Shingon monks studied it as well. It's best to think of Shingon and Tendai as study groups and disciples went back and forth and learned and took transmissions from the others' materials.
Really Rev. Jikai is the one to ask, as he's a Tendai priest and Ajari, all I'm posting is just scholarly material from books.
A really interesting topic to discuss!