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All is One

Posted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 2:17 pm
by White Lotus
Each letter is 1. Each word is 1. Each sentence is 1. Each paragraph is 1. Each chapter is 1. Each book is 1. Each library is 1. All knowledge is 1. All form is 1. All emptiness is 1. All is 1. :smile:

Re: All is One

Posted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 2:25 pm
by Simon E.
Thats as maybe.
But it is not, and never has been, Buddhadharma.

The Dharma of the Buddha does not say all is one. But rather that all arises in Emptiness.

Re: All is One

Posted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 2:50 pm
by White Lotus
No self is 1. Emptiness emanates from 1. In emptiness there is no arising. Emptiness is dependent.

Re: All is One

Posted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 2:58 pm
by DGA
White Lotus wrote:
Tue Dec 12, 2017 2:50 pm
No self is 1. Emptiness emanates from 1. In emptiness there is no arising. Emptiness is dependent.
how does emptiness "emanate"? what is the one that you claim it "emanates from"?

how is it possible for emptiness to be dependent on something if emptiness is one, or emanates from one...? if there is no arising, as you claim, how can anything be dependent on anything else?

Re: All is One

Posted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 3:40 pm
by White Lotus
1 is transcendent, immanent and subscendent. Transcendent 1 is not 'is'. It has no being or form and is ideal 1. Uncompounded. 1 dimensional. Individual forming of emptiness takes its unity and inspiration from ideal 1. Emptiness exists as immanent 1 and 'is'. (my hands are cold. Hard to text.)

Re: All is One

Posted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 3:44 pm
by Astus
"Two comes from one,
Yet do not even keep the one.
When one mind does not arise,
Myriad dharmas are without defect."

(Sengcan: Faith in Mind)

Re: All is One

Posted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 3:46 pm
by White Lotus
Emptiness is 1, but not ideal 1. It is compounded. 4 dimensional and 'is' even when we say it is not this or that. Emptiness is the outer circle of the Dharma Eye.

Re: All is One

Posted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 3:51 pm
by White Lotus
There is no arising and yet we call this dependence. Apparent arising is 1. Immanent 1. And yet when 1 is realised all is seen to be real. Not empty.

Re: All is One

Posted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 3:56 pm
by White Lotus
Thank you Astus for the Third Patriarch's quote. Bowing before him now begging him for wisdom and clear understanding of the Dharma. That i may see the error in my thought. Tom.

Re: All is One

Posted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 5:12 pm
by White Lotus
Astus, it is possible that Seng Tsan's teaching was provisional? Is there no room for further future clarification of the Dharma? Is it possible the Ekayana is revealing itself again having been forgotten? I think i might be onto something. I just can't get away from it! :?:

Re: All is One

Posted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 6:00 pm
by White Lotus
"One is all, All is one. If Thusness is ably realized, why worry you as unperfected." [v34 -45. The Faith Mind Maxim. P.127 Three Chan Classics, BDK English Tripitaka]. i appreciate that we should not cling to anything. However, we are 1. :reading:

Re: All is One

Posted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 6:38 pm
by Simon E.
No, we are not.
The most that you can say is that we are not two.
I think you are confusing Vedanta with Buddhadharma.

All arises dependant on everything else. And all is a constant state of change.

There is no 'one'. There is no thing to be 'one'.

Re: All is One

Posted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 6:45 pm
by Motova
:popcorn:

Re: All is One

Posted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 6:50 pm
by Vasana
Dearest White lotus

Please understand that you can't just present the dharma in your own idiosyncratic style divorced from the language and terminology that the dharma has been traditionally communicated for centuries, millennia.

It may well be that you have cottonned on to a valid understanding but all we have to go by are your abstract phrases and general preference for deifying 'one' - if you can present a citation supporting your statements and views on this 'one', then maybe n the discussion can be furthered and people can potentially benefit. If all you do is say ' oneness this, oneness that' and then respond in even more cryptic 'empty nothings' no one can really benefit from this.

Again, it may well be that you have understood something . If you can communicate it in a way that follows how dharma has been communicated in Buddhism as a whole or in your favoured tradition then it will be easier for us to all to either imrpove our understanding or point out any potential wrong views any of us may have.

Re: All is One

Posted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 6:58 pm
by Vasana
http://rywiki.tsadra.org/index.php/thig_le_nyag_cig

thig le nyag cig

I don't know if this is the way White Lotus is thinking about oneness but this phrase is the closest i can think of that could point towards this elusive one that white lotus speaks of. But even here, I'm not sure it's correct to see it in terms of unicity or multiplicty.

'thig le nyag cig

single sphere; single bindu, the uniform bindu, the sole sphere [of the nature] Syn chos sku the single circle, sole bindu [RY]

the sole seed/ sphere [of the nature], single/ uniform bindu /circle [= chos sku [IW]

the sole seed/ sphere [of the nature], single/ uniform bindu /circle [IW]

single sphere of totality [JV]

Single sphere. A symbolic description of dharmakaya being like a single sphere because it is devoid of duality and limitation and defies all 'edges' of conceptual constructs that could be formed about it [RY] '

Re: All is One

Posted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 7:02 pm
by Simon E.
White Lotus I have just read a post of yours from 2010, six years and a half years ago, in which you make more or less the same points you make in this thread, and get the same replies that you get now.

Something for you to ponder I think.

Re: All is One

Posted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 7:27 pm
by Virgo
Simon E. wrote:
Tue Dec 12, 2017 6:38 pm
No, we are not.
The most that you can say is that we are not two.
I think you are confusing Vedanta with Buddhadharma.

All arises dependant on everything else. And all is a constant state of change.

There is no 'one'. There is no thing to be 'one'.
Wonderful explanation Simon.

Kevin

Re: All is One

Posted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 12:15 am
by SunWuKong
White Lotus wrote:
Tue Dec 12, 2017 2:17 pm
Each letter is 1. Each word is 1. Each sentence is 1. Each paragraph is 1. Each chapter is 1. Each book is 1. Each library is 1. All knowledge is 1. All form is 1. All emptiness is 1. All is 1. :smile:
It reminds me a bit of "I Am That, Thou Art That, All This is That" from the Bhagavad Gita - All is One Indivisible Absolute. It's the definition of God that theist yogis adhere to. Buddhism got kicked out of India because they rejected Atman, or Soul, as well as Ishvara, Absolute God. Well, they didn't get kicked out, but people flip-flopped for the latest debate winner, as is the system. I'm immediately skeptical because it's logical and lacks paradox. Most Buddhist reject the idea of Self, or atman. Yet at its pinnacle, Buddhism embraces all things as essentially sentient. And that is a classic paradox you can bank on.

Re: All is One

Posted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 2:14 pm
by White Lotus
Immanent 1 is compounded, 4 dimensional and divisible. It is not self. It is 1. There is no self just 1. How could ideal 1 be self it is just 1. (without the 'is'). Brahma 'is' 1 without second: this is absolutely not what i am talking about. Brahma is 1 no doubt, but so is a grain of sand 1. This =1, is=1, it=1, but all of this is immanent and not ideal. Though i am speaking of 1 in different ways it is basically 1. Thats the simplest way i can put it 1. The simplest thing of all. Thank you for you'r patience with me. And for good questions. I hope you don't find too much mud in my old posts! If you have patience to scrutinise them i hope you will not be wasting you'r time.

Re: All is One

Posted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 2:31 pm
by White Lotus
A grain of sand is 1. A clod of earth is 1. A pebble is 1. A rock is 1. A hill is 1. A mountain is 1. A mountain range is 1. A province is 1. A country is 1. The Earth is 1. The Solar System is 1. The Milky Way galaxy is 1. The universe is 1. Form is 1. Mind is 1. Emptiness is 1. All is 1. 1 is immanently 1. :anjali: