"gregkavarnos"]Actually, I should have been a litle clearer. A human being that achieved liberation as a consequence of his past actions and his practice during his final incarnation. I consider him a human being even after his enlightenment. He still had to eat, drink, sleep, shit, he got sick, tired, old, etc... An enlightened human being.
if a man were to become Enlightened he would cease to be a human, he would acquire the 32 physical features of a Buddha, and possess the Dharma Body.
so either way it goes the Buddha is not a human.in the Mahayana case not only was Shakyamuni not born a human he manifested in the Dharma body.
now this is what is taught in Mahayana, you might not accept it but it is what is taught.
Nirvana sutra Chapter 7.
Jambudvipa, in the Lumbini gardens, I manifested birth from the womb of Mother Maya. After
birth, I took seven steps to the east and proclaimed: "I am the most honoured and best of all
men, devas and asuras." My parents and men and devas, on witnessing this, were joyous beyond
words and wonderstruck. All these people said that I was a child. But, for innumerable kalpas
past, I had been segregated from any such thing. Such a body as this is the Dharma-Body,
not one born of ﬂesh and blood, sinews, bones and marrow. Following the way of the world, I
appeared as a child."
that Rahula is my son, that Suddhodana was my father and Maya my mother, that I carried
on a secular career in my life, that I enjoyed peace and happiness [as a young prince], and that
I abandoned all such things and sought the Way. People further say: "The prince of this king,
of the great clan of Gautama, renounced worldly pleasures and sought the supramundane." But
I had long since been away from worldly love and desire. I merely displayed all such things.
Everybody says that I am a man. But truth to tell, I am not. O good man! I manifest myself in
Jambudvipa and often enter Nirvana. But in truth I do not enter Nirvana at all. Yet all people
say that the Tathagata is now dying. But the nature of the Tathagata, truth to tell, eternally
does not die out. So you should know that I am one Eternal and Unchanging."
As an aside, and seeing how we are throwing Sutta at each other, you also find accounts like this in the Pali Canon:http://www.accesstoinsight.org/tipitaka ... .than.htmlAN 2.5 PTS: A i 50
Appativana Sutta: Relentlessly
translated from the Pali by
"Monks, I have known two qualities through experience: discontent with regard to skillful qualities and unrelenting exertion. Relentlessly I exerted myself, [thinking,] 'Gladly would I let the flesh & blood in my body dry up, leaving just the skin, tendons, & bones, but if I have not attained what can be reached through human firmness, human persistence, human striving, there will be no relaxing my persistence.' From this heedfulness of mine was attained Awakening. From this heedfulness of mine was attained the unexcelled freedom from bondage.
"You, too, monks, should relentlessly exert yourselves, [thinking,] 'Gladly would we let the flesh & blood in our bodies dry up, leaving just the skin, tendons, & bones, but if we have not attained what can be reached through human firmness, human persistence, human striving, there will be no relaxing our persistence.' You, too, in no long time will reach & remain in the supreme goal of the holy life for which clansmen rightly go forth from home into homelessness, knowing & realizing it for yourselves in the here & now.
"Thus you should train yourselves: 'We will relentlessly exert ourselves, [thinking,] "Gladly would we let the flesh & blood in our bodies dry up, leaving just the skin, tendons, & bones, but if we have not attained what can be reached through human firmness, human persistence, human striving, there will be no relaxing our persistence."' That's how you should train yourselves."
1. In other words, not allowing oneself to rest content merely with the skillful qualities developed on the path. In the Buddha's biography, this point is illustrated by his refusal to rest content with the formless absorptions he mastered under his first two teachers. See MN 36.
this is not claiming that the Buddha was human, its simply speaking about how a human would exert himself along the path to Enlightenment.
nor does it refute my original position that Shakyamuni in the Theravadan Canon was only pretending to be a worldly prince and "discover" Enlightenment in his life time.
its made very clear in the Jataka tales that he already knew the basics of Buddhism,its made very clear in his birth story that he has already walked the path, and that he sure didn't forget it.