Information on Sarasvati

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Fortyeightvows
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Re: Information on Sarasvati

Post by Fortyeightvows » Wed Mar 16, 2016 5:13 am

Some friends recently visited a Jain temple and took some photos. I thought this one might be of interest to you
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Karinos
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Re: Information on Sarasvati

Post by Karinos » Fri Mar 18, 2016 1:35 pm

There are several tantric forms of Sarasvati in Tibetan Buddhism, both in Sarma and Terma - to mention few:
- white two armed Vajra Sarasvati from Samputa Tantra,
- white four armed Vajra Sarasvati (Taranatha's Rinjung Gyatsa),
- red two armed Vajra Sarasvati (termas + Shakyasri Bhadra tradition - preserved in Sakyapa),
- red six armed, 3 headed Vajra Saraswati from Krishna Yamari Tantra,
- blue two armed Vajra Saraswati with Manjusri on lion (Tertön Mingyur Dorjé written by Karma Chakmé),
- five forms of Vajra Saraswati (different colours) as retinue of Manjusri on lion (8th Karmapa),

also wrathful emanation of Sarasvati is Vajra Vetali (Dorje Rolangma) - consort of Yamantaka in all Yamantaka tantras,

her wrathful emanation as protector is Palden Lhamo Magzor Gyalmo,

her emanation as worldly protector is Palden Lhamo Ochen Barma



no possible to describe benefits of practicing Vajra Saraswati, every vajrayana student should do that :namaste:

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Re: Information on Sarasvati

Post by dzogchungpa » Tue May 31, 2016 7:00 pm

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Palzang Jangchub
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Re: Information on Sarasvati

Post by Palzang Jangchub » Thu Jan 19, 2017 10:52 pm

Karinos wrote:There are several tantric forms of Sarasvati in Tibetan Buddhism, both in Sarma and Terma - to mention few: [...]
- blue two armed Vajra Saraswati with Manjusri on lion (Tertön Mingyur Dorjé written by Karma Chakmé)
Karinos, can you please tell me how you came to know this practice originates with Namchö Tertön Mingyur Dorje? If it's the same sadhana of Jampal Mawa'i Senge I'm thinking about, entitled Dispelling the Darkness of Ignorance, it seems not to be practiced in Palyul. In trying to track down a lama who could give the empowerment, I came to find out that my Palyul lamas didn't know about it. Instead, they mentioned that in Palyul they use the Jampal Mawa'i Senge sadhana composed by Mipham. However, it is one of the main short Manjushri practices in Karma Kagyu (undoubtedly thanks to Karma Chagme).

Also, I don't remember Mingyur Dorje being mentioned in the history of the text, which is included after the practice along with the benefits. IIRC, it comes to us through Padampa Sangye, and eventually to 9th Karmapa Wangchuk Dorje (who compiled it with many other empowerments in the Chikshe Kundröl). Still haven't been able to truly identify the "Gemo Lama" Pema Trinley that Karma Chagme gave it to as a heart practice...
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"The Sutras, Tantras, and Philosophical Scriptures are great in number. However life is short, and intelligence is limited, so it's hard to cover them completely. You may know a lot, but if you don't put it into practice, it's like dying of thirst on the shore of a great lake. Likewise, a common corpse is found in the bed of a great scholar." ~ Karma Chagme

དྲིན་ཆེན་རྩ་བའི་བླ་མ་སྐྱབས་རྗེ་མགར་ཆེན་ཁྲི་སྤྲུལ་རིན་པོ་ཆེ་ཁྱེད་མཁྱེན་ནོ།།
རྗེ་བཙུན་བླ་མ་མཁས་གྲུབ་ཀརྨ་ཆགས་མེད་མཁྱེན་ནོ། ཀརྨ་པ་མཁྱེན་ནོཿ

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Karinos
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Re: Information on Sarasvati

Post by Karinos » Mon Jan 23, 2017 4:11 pm

Hey, don't have text with me atm (I'll check that later for you), but empowerment was given to me/us in Poland by Khenpo Namse Rinpoche in 90ties (former resident in Canada) and we had retreats on this form with him few times until he passed away.
Text is available via http://www.benchen.org.pl/en/


Chikshe Kundröl form is with 4 (or5?) Sarasvatis - so that is completely different sadhana


also FYI there is Dudjom Lingpa terma with actual union yab-yum form of Manjusri and Sarasvati :) very interesting too - but never saw thangka

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Palzang Jangchub
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Re: Information on Sarasvati

Post by Palzang Jangchub » Mon Jan 23, 2017 7:07 pm

Karinos wrote:Hey, don't have text with me atm (I'll check that later for you), but empowerment was given to me/us in Poland by Khenpo Namse Rinpoche in 90ties (former resident in Canada) and we had retreats on this form with him few times until he passed away.
Text is available via http://www.benchen.org.pl/en/
Don't see the sadhana on there under "Dharma for Reading" and "Practice Texts," unless you meant in their online store which is currently only in Polish. Do you have a direct link? I'll have to look up your khenpo. Interesting that he was named after Vaishravana, god of wealth and protector of the North (rnam sras, which comes into play just below).
Chikshe Kundröl form is with 4 (or5?) Sarasvatis - so that is completely different sadhana.
The sadhana I had (ordered from KTD's Namse Bangdzo site) only mentioned Red Manjushri riding a blue lion and Blue Saraswati standing in front of him (yab and yum, though technically not in union), who at some point emanate offering goddesses. No other Saraswatis involved to my knowledge. It also specifically mentions the Chikshe Kundröl and Karma Chagme during the lineage history of sorts under the Benefits section. See this online version (though I prefer Michelle Martin's translation through KTD for reasons I won't go into here).

Could the version you know from the Chikshe Kundröl possibly be different Jampal Mawa'i Senge than the one in the sadhana we're discussing, or perhaps a Senge Dra(drok)? Both are Manjushri riding a lion; the former is Lion of Speech and the latter is Lion's Roar (though Senge Dra is often a red, two-armed Chenrezik confused with Manjushri).
also FYI there is Dudjom Lingpa terma with actual union yab-yum form of Manjusri and Sarasvati :) very interesting too - but never saw thangka
I was unaware of this, so thanks for mentioning. There are specific reasons I'm drawn to the version that Chagme Rinpoche wrote, though this is good to know. I saw an excellent thangka in someone's personal collection. Maybe I'll send you a photo via PM if I'm able to get the owner to send me a pic.
Image

"The Sutras, Tantras, and Philosophical Scriptures are great in number. However life is short, and intelligence is limited, so it's hard to cover them completely. You may know a lot, but if you don't put it into practice, it's like dying of thirst on the shore of a great lake. Likewise, a common corpse is found in the bed of a great scholar." ~ Karma Chagme

དྲིན་ཆེན་རྩ་བའི་བླ་མ་སྐྱབས་རྗེ་མགར་ཆེན་ཁྲི་སྤྲུལ་རིན་པོ་ཆེ་ཁྱེད་མཁྱེན་ནོ།།
རྗེ་བཙུན་བླ་མ་མཁས་གྲུབ་ཀརྨ་ཆགས་མེད་མཁྱེན་ནོ། ཀརྨ་པ་མཁྱེན་ནོཿ

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Karinos
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Re: Information on Sarasvati

Post by Karinos » Mon Jan 23, 2017 7:42 pm

Karma Jinpa wrote:Don't see the sadhana on there under "Dharma for Reading" and "Practice Texts," unless you meant in their online store which is currently only in Polish. Do you have a direct link? I'll have to look up your khenpo. Interesting that he was named after Vaishravana, god of wealth and protector of the North (rnam sras, which comes into play just below).
You'd need to contact them directly via emai - but from below I think we have the same sadhana actually
You can check info on Khenpo Namse Rinpoche here http://www.ksdl.org/lama.php
Karma Jinpa wrote: The sadhana I had (ordered from KTD's Namse Bangdzo site) only mentioned Red Manjushri riding a blue lion and Blue Saraswati standing in front of him (yab and yum, though technically not in union), who at some point emanate offering goddesses. No other Saraswatis involved to my knowledge. It also specifically mentions the Chikshe Kundröl and Karma Chagme during the lineage history of sorts under the Benefits section
Interesting - I think we may be talking about two different - sorry if I confused - from ChikShie Kyn Drol:
Manjushri with 5 Sarasvatis - Jampal Marser yabyum according to teachings of VIII Karmapa - I'll send you msg with picture with 5 Sarasvatis - it's not on snow lion - mantra here seem the same like in mentioned sadhana

Manjusri on lion Jampel Maseng according to teachings of VI Karmapa

Manjusri on lion Jamepl Senge Dra - no sword or book, just lotus



Karma Jinpa wrote: I was unaware of this, so thanks for mentioning. There are specific reasons I'm drawn to the version that Chagme Rinpoche wrote, though this is good to know. I saw an excellent thangka in someone's personal collection. Maybe I'll send you a photo via PM if I'm able to get the owner to send me a pic.
that'd be great - thank you :)

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dzogchungpa
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Re: Information on Sarasvati

Post by dzogchungpa » Tue Jan 24, 2017 9:41 pm

Karinos wrote:also FYI there is Dudjom Lingpa terma with actual union yab-yum form of Manjusri and Sarasvati :) very interesting too - but never saw thangka
I'm interested in this, may I ask what the name of the text or practice is?
There is not only nothingness because there is always, and always can manifest. - Thinley Norbu Rinpoche

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Karinos
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Re: Information on Sarasvati

Post by Karinos » Wed Jan 25, 2017 12:40 pm

Please contact Enrico https://enricokosmus.wordpress.com/
He was preparing translation to German last year for teachings with Lopon Ogyan Tanzin RInpoche

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Re: Information on Sarasvati

Post by DGA » Wed Jan 25, 2017 6:54 pm

Karinos wrote:Please contact Enrico https://enricokosmus.wordpress.com/
He was preparing translation to German last year for teachings with Lopon Ogyan Tanzin RInpoche
for clarification: Loppon Orgyan Tanzin has taught this practice recently (Manjusri/Saraswati yab-yum), and it has been translated in at least one Western language?

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Karinos
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Re: Information on Sarasvati

Post by Karinos » Wed Jan 25, 2017 8:36 pm

yes, translated to German. Wang, lung, tri was given by LOTR in Austria summer 2016
Rinpoche explained that sadhana is very close to Karma Chagme text, but is in Dzogchen context
front page says "from collected work of Dudjom Lingpa - volume 15 (ba) page 71-72

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Re: Information on Sarasvati

Post by dzogchungpa » Wed Jan 25, 2017 10:13 pm

There is not only nothingness because there is always, and always can manifest. - Thinley Norbu Rinpoche

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Karinos
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Re: Information on Sarasvati

Post by Karinos » Wed Jan 25, 2017 10:56 pm

dzogchungpa wrote:I think this is it:
http://www.tbrc.org/eBooks/W28732-4630-77-78-any.pdf
:namaste: :applause:

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Karinos
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Re: Information on Sarasvati

Post by Karinos » Thu Mar 23, 2017 1:58 pm

I believe this is thangka for that sadhana :)

http://www.himalayanart.org/items/71210 ... 8,5733,-24

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Re: Information on Sarasvati

Post by tomschwarz » Tue Apr 11, 2017 4:04 pm

Redfaery wrote:Thank you everyone! I normally write poems to her, and after I wrote the last one, I had....an experience. Not sure how to describe it. I just..."got it." Like, I understood EVERYTHING that I'd been trying to figure out from my readings. Then of course, it went away, and I was back to square one...
There is a real contentment to be found. I feel a bit of your identity, of course as we learn, fundamental ignorance is grasping onto that identity and is the core cause of all suffering including the three types of suffering from the first noble truth. So in the interest of your happiness, I will respect your right to happiness and overcoming suffering which hangs on your Buddha nature and lack of independent identity.

With that said, please consider, there is no happy )))). No found no lost.. samadhi reveals the four immeasurables one of which is equinimity. So that is Buddhism.

Then there is enlightenment. That is not Buddhism (see chpt 6 diamond sutra, to cross the river of suffering one must abandoned the dharma used to cross it)
i dedicate this post to your happiness, the causes of your happiness, the absence of your suffering the causes of the absence of your suffering that we may not have too much attachment nor aversion. SAMAYAMANUPALAYA

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Re: Information on Sarasvati

Post by Tenma » Thu Aug 17, 2017 6:02 pm

Redfaery wrote:
dzogchungpa wrote:OK, so how did you identify her as Saraswati?
LOL....it took a long time before I was able to pin it down.

When I decided to figure out what I was spiritually, I prayed to anyone who I thought might listen, including Benzaiten, who is the Japanese version of Sarasvati. So it's not like she just showed up out of the blue, uninvited. I reached out for help in a time of spiritual crisis, and she was the one who answered. It's like I went into a party and yelled "FRED!!!" and someone answers, "yeah?" I assume that guy answers to Fred, even though his real name might be Frederick, or Fred might not be his first name at all.
Huh, I had the same thing with Saraswati after receiving her mantra through phone by Lama Kunga Thartse Rinpoche, but for some reason, with my Korean name instead of Western. The only difference was that I was alone and no one in my neighborhood knew my Korean name, and my parents weren't home. I'm happy to find someone with the same experience.

*I've noticed that Lama Dawa Chodak Rinpoche is the only lama with heavy connection to Saraswati, how can I contact him?(I have anti-Buddhist parents, so I can't travel to him)
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Re: Information on Sarasvati

Post by pemachophel » Thu Aug 17, 2017 8:07 pm

Sorry to tell you but Lamas Dawa is at His home in Boudha, Nepal sick with stage 4 colon cancer. He is only seeing His personal students and friends, not even other Lamas and Tulkus who would like to meet Him.

His brother, Lama Pema Dorje Rinpoche, who lives at least part of the time in Oakland, CA, also received Cho-kyi Go-cha's Saraswati cycle from H.H. Dilgo Khyentse Rinpoche. Also, some of the late Lama Tharchin's students received this cycle from Lama Tharchin who received it from Lama Sherab Dorje. I've also heard that this cycle is still practiced in Amdo where Cho-kyi Go-cha was from.

Good luck & best wishes.
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Re: Information on Sarasvati

Post by Tenma » Fri Aug 18, 2017 5:24 pm

pemachophel wrote:Sorry to tell you but Lamas Dawa is at His home in Boudha, Nepal sick with stage 4 colon cancer. He is only seeing His personal students and friends, not even other Lamas and Tulkus who would like to meet Him.

His brother, Lama Pema Dorje Rinpoche, who lives at least part of the time in Oakland, CA, also received Cho-kyi Go-cha's Saraswati cycle from H.H. Dilgo Khyentse Rinpoche. Also, some of the late Lama Tharchin's students received this cycle from Lama Tharchin who received it from Lama Sherab Dorje. I've also heard that this cycle is still practiced in Amdo where Cho-kyi Go-cha was from.

Good luck & best wishes.
That is such a pity. I thought of him as a good match, especially the devotion to Saraswati since childhood. So far, I have been trying to mix as many praises I can find into a "sadhana" which is very unorthodox as it is only using regular "Om Argham Ah HUm" instead of a long "Om Priti Devye.... Pushpe Ah HUm" along with no torma or tsok and only inner offerings(I was almost killed for using outer offerings when my parents caught me practicing Buddhism). The only mantra is a lung I received through phone call and so far, I've used the basic Om at forehead, and so on except Hrim shares a same lotus as Hum with the mantra(don't know if it's spelled correctly in Tibetan) circling it. Can't contact Kunga Thartse as he's busy with translations and so on. Also, not interested in Manjushri or the other deities, except Saraswati(Tara in some forms, yes).
So his brother has Saraswati from white(like the lute form) to red(with mirror and jewel) and her retinue including Dorje Yudronma? Sorry, I don't know traditions, so I have no clue on what deities are inside.
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Re: Information on Sarasvati

Post by Motova » Fri Aug 18, 2017 6:06 pm

Tenma wrote: (I was almost killed for using outer offerings when my parents caught me practicing Buddhism).
This is a problem.

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Re: Information on Sarasvati

Post by Lobsang Chojor » Fri Aug 18, 2017 7:16 pm

Tenma wrote:I was almost killed for using outer offerings when my parents caught me practicing Buddhism
Perhaps you could just visualise the outer offerings to work within your circumstances.
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